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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old August 2 2013, 04:42 PM   #61
TREK_GOD_1
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Re: JJverse converts

Mr. Hengist wrote: View Post
They are simply completely derivative, they contribute no new ideas, and when the two hours or so of flashing images on the screen are over, there's really not much to talk about.
Your post should be stamped across every frame of the NuTrek movies.
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Old August 2 2013, 05:05 PM   #62
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Re: JJverse converts

Melakon wrote: View Post
Geez, when I was around 13, I always wound up going to my room because my parents liked to watch Sing Along With Mitch and Lawrence Welk. Those are two shows I never look up on YouTube. They liked westerns too, which were okay, but I preferred sci-fi and adventure shows.
Yeah, there certainly were things my parents or siblings watched that I didn't care for and never would. My mother and sisters were into things like Little House On the Prairie. You couldn't have gotten me to watch that even if my life were threatened.
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Old August 2 2013, 05:06 PM   #63
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Re: JJverse converts

TREK_GOD_1 wrote: View Post
Mr. Hengist wrote: View Post
They are simply completely derivative, they contribute no new ideas, and when the two hours or so of flashing images on the screen are over, there's really not much to talk about.
Your post should be stamped across every frame of the NuTrek movies.
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Old August 3 2013, 12:14 AM   #64
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Re: JJverse converts

Warped9 wrote: View Post
Melakon wrote: View Post
Geez, when I was around 13, I always wound up going to my room because my parents liked to watch Sing Along With Mitch and Lawrence Welk. Those are two shows I never look up on YouTube. They liked westerns too, which were okay, but I preferred sci-fi and adventure shows.
Yeah, there certainly were things my parents or siblings watched that I didn't care for and never would. My mother and sisters were into things like Little House On the Prairie. You couldn't have gotten me to watch that even if my life were threatened.
This is why I was glad my mom liked sci-fi. We'd watch the TOS reruns, Buck Rogers, and Battlestar Galactica (1978) together, then, when stuff she liked, like "Little House" would come on, it was usually time for me to go to bed. Or at least to my room, to read.

But, for the most part, we liked the same stuff.
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Old August 3 2013, 12:34 AM   #65
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Re: JJverse converts

RandyS wrote: View Post
This is why I was glad my mom liked sci-fi. We'd watch the TOS reruns, Buck Rogers, and Battlestar Galactica (1978) together, then, when stuff she liked, like "Little House" would come on, it was usually time for me to go to bed. Or at least to my room, to read.

But, for the most part, we liked the same stuff.
I still remember my mom indoctrinating me into Trek explaining the characters and stuff when they started airing the reruns. I don't know if I should thank her or blame her.

Together we watched Trek, Flash Gordon, Incredible Hulk, Man From Atlantis, Kung Fu. Not the worst mother when it came to TV...
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Old August 3 2013, 01:19 AM   #66
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Re: JJverse converts

Warped9 wrote: View Post
Yeah, there certainly were things my parents or siblings watched that I didn't care for and never would. My mother and sisters were into things like Little House On the Prairie. You couldn't have gotten me to watch that even if my life were threatened.
Well of course I didn't like everything my parents liked. I just meant that I enjoyed things from the same era my parents and especially my grandparents did.

In fact I would argue I liked older things than my mom. I love silent films and my mom has no interest in them.

But as for genre I am pretty open. I think there is good and bad stuff in every genre.
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Old August 3 2013, 01:23 AM   #67
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Re: JJverse converts

Mr. Hengist wrote: View Post
and when the two hours or so of flashing images on the screen are over, there's really not much to talk about.
I think the XI+ forum shows that the movies gave us plenty to talk about!
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Old August 3 2013, 01:49 AM   #68
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Re: JJverse converts

Maybe it is the quality of conversation that is the issue here.

I mean, I don't see any threads over there that are deep philosophical ones like you might find on a BLADE RUNNER forum. I mean, does anybody here think Khan was a replicant?

But you've got a thread on the size of the ship (shouldn't that be in trek tech?) that could stretch across the whole bay by now. And if the makers had done their job right, it wouldn't even be an issue, and we could be bitching and gushing about storypoints or character development if any.
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Old August 3 2013, 02:48 AM   #69
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Re: JJverse converts

trevanian wrote: View Post
Maybe it is the quality of conversation that is the issue here.

I mean, I don't see any threads over there that are deep philosophical ones like you might find on a BLADE RUNNER forum. I mean, does anybody here think Khan was a replicant?


None of the Star Trek movies have been particularly deep, yet we keep talking about them. I've written whole dissertations on why Insurrection is a shitty movie.

Maybe you should find a board that discusses material that is more on par with your intellect.


But you've got a thread on the size of the ship (shouldn't that be in trek tech?) that could stretch across the whole bay by now. And if the makers had done their job right, it wouldn't even be an issue, and we could be bitching and gushing about storypoints or character development if any.
It's a fictional spaceship. As much as I love the TOS Enterprise (I have a Diamond Select 1701 on my shelf), it's just a fictional spaceship. No one on the Abrams team did their job "wrong", they used the ship as a vehicle to tell a story. I suppose Matt Jefferies did his job "wrong" because we still debate details about that ship fifty years later?

You don't like the movie, I can respect that. What I can't respect is when you keep looking down your nose at people who do like it.
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Old August 3 2013, 03:48 AM   #70
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Re: JJverse converts

trevanian wrote: View Post

. . . I'm wondering if any of them can get through FORBIDDEN PLANET or THE DAY THE EARTH STOOD STILL or COLOSSUS THE FORBIN PROJECT, to name 3 pretty solid pics . . .
A whooooooole lot of them can't. As a teacher if I show a film in black and white you'd think it was as bad as, oh, reading a book or something. I still do (Mr. Smith, Grapes of Wrath, and Bad Seed, all of which have most kids really digging 'em after awhile.

Stories are told differently now; dialog is much more conversational; and of course the production values. . . . Some people including kids (including my own, yay!) can dig old things. Shoot, my 15 year old LOVES TOS and Sinatra on vinyl. She's even on this BBS now. But many people, adults and kids alike just have too many stumbling blocks to enjoy the remnants of "the Old Ones."

I now shake my head and give a low, Ruk-like "Mmrrrhhrmmm...." and look of disappointment. But so it goes.
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Last edited by plynch; August 3 2013 at 03:50 AM. Reason: had to add a Ruk noise
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Old August 3 2013, 09:30 AM   #71
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Re: JJverse converts

trevanian wrote: View Post
Maybe it is the quality of conversation that is the issue here.

I mean, I don't see any threads over there that are deep philosophical ones like you might find on a BLADE RUNNER forum. I mean, does anybody here think Khan was a replicant?
I don't care about Blade Runner, I care about Star Trek. The two movies have been discussed and nitpicked to death, on par with what's here and in the other subforums. The characters, the allegory, the tribute scene, Spock's godawful yell (surely this generation's "THE WOMAN!") the casting of Khan, S/U, what's coming next etc.
But you've got a thread on the size of the ship (shouldn't that be in trek tech?) that could stretch across the whole bay by now. And if the makers had done their job right, it wouldn't even be an issue, and we could be bitching and gushing about storypoints or character development if any.
And that's any different to the technical debates here how, exactly? We've had massive threads debating the accuracy of Franz Jospeh's blueprints and technical manual, questions raised about the location of the engine room, and going back a couple of years bitter arguments about which whether the bridge faces forward or is at an angle so the turbolift lines up with the rear blister.

If only those pesky makers did their job right...
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Old August 3 2013, 08:46 PM   #72
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Re: JJverse converts

ssosmcin wrote: View Post
The whole "all kids have ADD" thing is a bunch of bullshit anyway. That's just another version of the older generation crabbing about how "kids don't understand nothing good" that they're parents said about them. It's what every single older generation says about the younger. "They don't like it unless it's got 'splosions, quick cuts, loud rock music and shaky cam." Just because they're used to what the standard for blockbuster entertainment is doesn't make them closed to other things. What many people don't enjoy, though (and this ain't just kids), is dated TV and movies. Lots of us like what we grew up with and what we're used to. In 40 years, they'll be nostalgic for what they like today. But their kids will mock how cheesy it all seems. "They can't see past the old effects!" Well for some people, even the best effects from 50 years earlier are simply "bad" today.

Some people don't care about effects and are fine with watching an outdated style of acting. But you won't find them in the majority. I'm 45, I grew up with Star Trek and enjoy old movies and TV. But even I couldn't watch the James Cagney movie "The Public Enemy" without laughing at some of it. Or rolling my eyes at how the sublte, real acting by Burgess Meredeth and Lon Chaney Jr in "Of Mice and Men" was countered by over the top mugging by a few who couldn't adjust to "talkies."

Oh, I also have ADD. Only those who live with it can tell you what fresh hell it is. Yet, I still can sit through an old movie or TV show if I find it interesting. Tastes change with every generation. To old people, every new is crap. I got news for ya, the generation before ours thought the stuff we revere was crap, too.

Younger people will like or dislike 60's Star Trek based on their tastes.
THIS.


I too have ADD and Asperger's (diagnosed at the age of thirty-six), and I find that kind of inference highly insulting. If something's dated and doesn't work for people of the present, it won't work no matter how hard its boosters push it on people (the original Battlestar Galactica being a case in point.) I've had to hammer this into the heads of a ton of people at IMDB and Home Theater Forum (in particular the participants of one thread about older TV shows on DVD who don't get it that not all of the older shows are that great.) They just don't get it, and continue to say this despite that fact.
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Old August 4 2013, 03:53 AM   #73
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Re: JJverse converts

LOL. The attitude of people who simply don't care about cultural antecedents of current pop-culture (or even more serious culture) has nothing to do with your, their, or my own "personal preferences" as to a specific style, genre, or even a particular T.V. show such as TOS.

They're not interested in TOS, or "Casablanca," or the Odyssey, or the Iliad, or Bladerunner, or Forbidden Planet, or Betty Page, because they're dull, uneducated, ignorant, witless, uncaring, mediocrities who are simply looking for something to distract their brains for a while so as not to possibly actually have to think about something.

The fact that anyone thinks that they've

"had to hammer this into the heads of a ton of people at IMDB and Home Theater Forum (in particular the participants of one thread about older TV shows on DVD who don't get it that not all of the older shows are that great.) They just don't get it, and continue to say this despite that fact"

means anything other than that the person doing the hammering is the one who simply "doesn't get it," yet is too clueless to understand why no one else on said forum agrees with him--but of course he is smarter than anyone else, right?--basically "says it all."

Just because YOU don't see anything of value in an "old" tv series or other cultural artifact from the past, does NOT mean it is lacking in value. Maybe it's just a testament to your lack of perception. Feeling that it's your "job" to "hammer" other folks with your valuable opinions when they obviously disagree with you doesn't mean you're right, it just means you've been unpersuasive.

I wonder why.

I don't think anyone here is claiming "My Mother The Car" is great and worthy simply because it's an old t.v. show.
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Old August 4 2013, 04:00 AM   #74
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Re: JJverse converts

And people wonder why I'm embarrassed to be a TOS fan?

Taste is subjective.

Mr. Hengist wrote: View Post
LOL. The attitude of people who simply don't care about cultural antecedents of current pop-culture (or even more serious culture) has nothing to do with your, their, or my own "personal preferences" as to a specific style, genre, or even a particular T.V. show such as TOS.

They're not interested in TOS, or "Casablanca," or the Odyssey, or the Iliad, or Bladerunner, or Forbidden Planet, or Betty Page, because they're dull, uneducated, ignorant, witless, uncaring, mediocrities who are simply looking for something to distract their brains for a while so as not to possibly actually have to think about something.

The fact that anyone thinks that they've

"had to hammer this into the heads of a ton of people at IMDB and Home Theater Forum (in particular the participants of one thread about older TV shows on DVD who don't get it that not all of the older shows are that great.) They just don't get it, and continue to say this despite that fact"

means anything other than that the person doing the hammering is the one who simply "doesn't get it," yet is too clueless to understand why no one else on said forum agrees with him--but of course he is smarter than anyone else, right?--basically "says it all."

Just because YOU don't see anything of value in an "old" tv series or other cultural artifact from the past, does NOT mean it is lacking in value. Maybe it's just a testament to your lack of perception. Feeling that it's your "job" to "hammer" other folks with your valuable opinions when they obviously disagree with you doesn't mean you're right, it just means you've been unpersuasive.

I wonder why.
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Old August 4 2013, 04:05 AM   #75
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Re: JJverse converts

I don't like all the older shows out there. I think some are terrible. The two groups are not the same.

There's good and bad in every era, and almost every show has something of value. The only catch is that it's not of equal value to everyone.
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