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Old November 26 2013, 01:31 AM   #136
Guy Gardener
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

Peta vs. The Flash.

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Old November 26 2013, 01:32 AM   #137
Nerys Myk
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

Yeah, I want a guy who can pick bullets out of the air with his fingers.
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Old November 26 2013, 01:47 AM   #138
Savage Dragon
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

I personally want all the bells and whistles that come with the Flash. If you are going to do the Flash, you might as well go all out.
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Old November 26 2013, 01:58 AM   #139
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

Agent Richard07 wrote: View Post
^ The Flash from the 90s show got a guy out of an electric chair as the switch was being pulled and no one saw him. That's the kind of thing I want to see. Being able to run a little faster than a cheetah doesn't make for an impressive Flash.
That's not what I said. A cheetah's top speed is around 60 MPH; I'm talking about hundreds of MPH, the speed range of the John Wesley Shipp Flash. I just don't want it to get to the kind of speed that would send an object into orbit, which would be a couple of orders of magnitude higher. And I certainly don't want to deal with the stupidity of someone time-traveling or crossing dimensions just by running on a treadmill.

(Although 60 MPH worked just fine for Steve Austin...)


Some of the problems you mentioned like physics, reaction time and whatnot have been a problem for me as well. I don't have a good rationale, but I sometimes like to think that he's in his own little "bubble" that exists at a different pace and that he's not just moving really fast.
Which wouldn't explain it, because the physical processes and laws around him would not be accelerated accordingly. If your perceptions were sped up a hundred times, then one second would feel like a hundred seconds to you, so you'd perceive things seeming to take a hundred times as long to fall to the ground, which would be equivalent to feeling a gravity of one ten-thousandth of a gee. Physics would behave for you as if you were on a small asteroid. Plus the air molecules would seem to take a hundred times longer to be displaced, so it would feel like the air was a hundred times thicker. It would feel more like swimming than running. Not to mention that the air would feel a hundred times harder to breathe.

And since physics requires that you measure the same speed of light regardless of your reference frame, you'd perceive distances being compressed to compensate, and wavelengths of light being altered, so you'd find the world around you rendered incomprehensible.
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Old November 26 2013, 01:59 AM   #140
Nerys Myk
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

Screw physics!!!!!

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Old November 26 2013, 02:11 AM   #141
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

TheSeeker wrote: View Post
I personally want all the bells and whistles that come with the Flash. If you are going to do the Flash, you might as well go all out.
Balls deep at the speed of light?

(That's just so wrong.)
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Old November 26 2013, 02:13 AM   #142
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

Christopher wrote: View Post
Agent Richard07 wrote: View Post
^ The Flash from the 90s show got a guy out of an electric chair as the switch was being pulled and no one saw him. That's the kind of thing I want to see. Being able to run a little faster than a cheetah doesn't make for an impressive Flash.
That's not what I said. A cheetah's top speed is around 60 MPH; I'm talking about hundreds of MPH, the speed range of the John Wesley Shipp Flash.
Just using a bit of hyperbole with the cheetah comment.

Did Shipp's Flash really run that slow? They might have established a speed at some point but a lot of times it seemed like he could move a lot faster.

As for the physics, yeah it can be problematic if you think about it but you can either ignore it or use a bit of creative jiggering to make something sound workable.
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Old November 26 2013, 02:20 AM   #143
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

Christopher wrote: View Post
I really, really don't want any "cosmic treadmill." It's ridiculous. I don't want the Speed Force, I don't want Barry to be able to run at the speed of light or whatever. I want a Flash who obeys the laws of physics and can't run faster than maybe a few hundred kilometers per hour, tops. I mean, once past about 27,000 kph, you'd reach orbital velocity and just fly off the ground, so there's no possible way a human being could run faster than that; beyond that point he'd have to be flying. That's always annoyed me about the Flash in comics and cartoons, the way that basic fact was ignored, along with numerous other facts of friction, inertia, reaction time, you name it. I prefer a Flash who has some marginally plausible limitations on his speed, like the one from the '90s show.
I really liked the no-powers universe of Green Arrow, but if the producers are going the Super Powers route then running at the speed of sound is as silly as running at the speed of light. It requires the same kind of psuedo-science technobabble as pretty much everything else in the genre.
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Old November 26 2013, 02:45 AM   #144
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

Agent Richard07 wrote: View Post
Did Shipp's Flash really run that slow? They might have established a speed at some point but a lot of times it seemed like he could move a lot faster.
Fast is relative. Say a typical city block is about 100 meters long. At, say, 600 kilometers per hour, it would take a hundredth of a minute or 0.6 seconds to traverse it, which would seem incredibly fast to a human observer. For comparison, we're talking something close to the speed of a handgun bullet, and that's effectively invisible to the naked eye. It's also about half the speed of sound, so it's really damn fast. But orbital velocity is more like 27,000 kph, nearly 50 times faster than that. And the speed of light is over a billion kph, 40,000 times faster than orbital velocity.

So the Flash can be really, really fast on any meaningful human scale without getting anywhere close to orbital speed, let alone the speed of light. I think being faster than a speeding bullet is plenty fast enough.
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Old November 26 2013, 03:44 AM   #145
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

[QUOTE=Christopher;8940805]
Agent Richard07 wrote: View Post
I think being faster than a speeding bullet is plenty fast enough.
I agree. The only reason the Flash's speed has been that of light is feeling the need to escalate power levels. Without any real concept of what the increases mean or are even necessary for story reasons.

Superman is the perfect example of over escalation of power levels. Faster than a speeding is still really fast.
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Old November 26 2013, 03:16 PM   #146
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

In the 90s show he created a sonic boom in the pilot episode when he was testing his limits on a test track.
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Old November 26 2013, 03:26 PM   #147
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

TheSeeker wrote: View Post
In the 90s show he created a sonic boom in the pilot episode when he was testing his limits on a test track.
^Okay, but the speed of sound is only twice the sample speed I gave, so it's effectively of the same magnitude. It's still about 1/25th of the speed you'd have to run before you were too fast for gravity to hold you, and it's still microscopic compared to the speed of light.

The problem with us humans is that we tend to treat every magnitude beyond our range of comprehension as interchangeable. So we see every speed that's beyond everyday experience as just being uniformly fast and think it's a short hop from the speed of sound to the speed of light, even though the truth is that they're immensely far apart. It's the same conceptual habit that leads us to assume everything in the past happened at the same time and tell stories about cavemen living with dinosaurs even though the latter were about a thousand times more distant in time.
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Old November 26 2013, 03:38 PM   #148
theenglish
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

Christopher wrote: View Post
TheSeeker wrote: View Post
In the 90s show he created a sonic boom in the pilot episode when he was testing his limits on a test track.
^Okay, but the speed of sound is only twice the sample speed I gave, so it's effectively of the same magnitude. It's still about 1/25th of the speed you'd have to run before you were too fast for gravity to hold you, and it's still microscopic compared to the speed of light.

The problem with us humans is that we tend to treat every magnitude beyond our range of comprehension as interchangeable. So we see every speed that's beyond everyday experience as just being uniformly fast and think it's a short hop from the speed of sound to the speed of light, even though the truth is that they're immensely far apart. It's the same conceptual habit that leads us to assume everything in the past happened at the same time and tell stories about cavemen living with dinosaurs even though the latter were about a thousand times more distant in time.
This speed was set after COIEs when Wally's limit became roughly the speed of sound for a while (the slow moving Flash!). I don't know how long it was before his speeds got ramped up again though.
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Old November 26 2013, 08:02 PM   #149
Guy Gardener
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

TheSeeker wrote: View Post
In the 90s show he created a sonic boom in the pilot episode when he was testing his limits on a test track.
And later when a missile chased him, while he was running and exploded, it propelled him "through the time barrier" into the future, where he had an adventure and returned to the past using a similar method.

That sounds like light speed.
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Old November 26 2013, 10:10 PM   #150
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Re: FLASH series being developed for The CW

No it doesn't, it just sounds like bullshit.
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