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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Welcome to the Trek BBS! > General Trek Discussion

General Trek Discussion Trek TV and cinema subjects not related to any specific series or movie.

View Poll Results: Would you rather be
A diehard fan who has seen scores of Trek episodes and films 19 95.00%
A neophyte who can watch and enjoy Trek with little to no bias 1 5.00%
Voters: 20. You may not vote on this poll

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Old July 22 2013, 03:28 AM   #1
M.A.C.O.
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Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

For the past 3 years I have done as much as I can to convince my group of friends to watch any amount of Star Trek they possibly can. As you can imagine I was not successful at first. However this year I have received a large amount of positive feedback from several of my friends who finally gave Trek a chance. Each one started in a different era. Three started TOS, 2 started TNG, 1 started DS9, and 3 started VOY. My friends who's interest range from Star Wars, Stargate, Doctor Who, Harry Potter, Twilight, scores of animes, books and online gaming. Trek was just that lame cheesy show to them, but now they consider themselves Trekkies.

I listen to them describe the joy and excitement they get out of watching Star Trek. While I don't disagree that there are volumes of quality entertainment to be had. There is something genuine and pure about being able to see these shows for the first time that I miss. Even episodes and movies we the Hardcore fans consider terrible like (going by memory of what they told me)
TOS Plato's Stepchildren, Savage Curtain
TNG The Royale, The Game
DS9 Move Along Home, Q-Less
VOY The 37's
Movies TMP, Final Frontier, INS and NEM

They only see entertainment. While we (hardcore fans) see flaws and things to be critical of in these and other episodes and movies.

I have watched all 726 episodes and 12 movies. I'm pleased with my accomplishment. However I feel like I've lost something.

Does anyone else feel this way?
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Old July 22 2013, 04:43 AM   #2
BruntFCA
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

I've seen everything but I don't really think that i'm bias either. I don't pay much attention to "common perception" as there are a lot of episodes that many think are terrible but that I like.
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Old July 22 2013, 05:24 AM   #3
Tosk
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

AllStarEntprise wrote: View Post
They only see entertainment. While we (hardcore fans) see flaws and things to be critical of in these and other episodes and movies.
Jumping to an odd conclusion there, ASE. I am a hardcore fan, but I don't only see flaws and things to be critical of. I love to watch favorite episodes or films and be swept away by the same enjoyment I've always had for them.

I can be critical and notice flaws. But so can a new viewer.
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Old July 22 2013, 05:38 AM   #4
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

I don't feel that way at all. If anything, I enjoy Trek on levels far beyond the perception of my non-Trekkie friends. Where they might chuckle at two characters having a humorous conversation, I can chuckle at two characters having a humorous conversation, catch two references to Trek lore, three production mistakes, a continuity error, an homage to Forbidden Planet, and then spend the next thirty years of my life analyzing and debating the scene on the internet long after they've forgotten it.

My brother notices this when we were watching STID- there were moments where I be the only one around us laughing or gasping in surprise or groaning at the screen. "Dude, where they playing a second movie that only Trekkies could see?"

Yes, they were.
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Old July 22 2013, 10:05 AM   #5
M.A.C.O.
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

Tosk wrote: View Post
AllStarEntprise wrote: View Post
They only see entertainment. While we (hardcore fans) see flaws and things to be critical of in these and other episodes and movies.
Jumping to an odd conclusion there, ASE. I am a hardcore fan, but I don't only see flaws and things to be critical of. I love to watch favorite episodes or films and be swept away by the same enjoyment I've always had for them.

I can be critical and notice flaws. But so can a new viewer.
Sorry Tosk I didn't mean to imply hardcore Trek fans were critical of every single thing Trek. Only the episodes and movies I listed above. Which are reviled by most as being terrible.

Hearing someone praise "Move Along Home" or "Plato's Stepchildren" was jarring for me. Also I dragged my friends to STID back in May. After that we watched TWOK, NEM and XI. My friends having limited exposure to Trek found each film enjoyable. When on this board we know NEM is reviled by many as the worst Trek movie.
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Old July 22 2013, 10:48 AM   #6
Tosk
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

AllStarEntprise wrote: View Post
Sorry Tosk I didn't mean to imply hardcore Trek fans were critical of every single thing Trek. Only the episodes and movies I listed above. Which are reviled by most as being terrible.
Ah, I gotcha...it is I who should apologize, I misunderstood the (now obvious to me) point you were making.

That said, I still fall outside the parameters set forth. I like a bunch of reviled episodes and films. Yep, I like Move Along Home. And Fascination. And Insurrection. And Nemesis.
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Old July 22 2013, 06:26 PM   #7
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

I am more of a wonk. I like it but i would never aak or pay for any Trek authors autograph.
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Old July 24 2013, 03:43 AM   #8
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

I believe I've watched all the episodes, I haven't seen all the movies, but the whole process has been so gradual (taking place over about 40 years) that I can't conceive of how it would feel to be a neophyte at this point.

The closest I can come is seeing my daughter's reactions (she's 11) as we did a marathon Trekwatch last year so she's seen almost everything. But even that's from the outside.

Besides, I can turn on and off my inner critic, so I can enjoy or critique at will.
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Old July 24 2013, 04:51 AM   #9
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

I get what you're after, and the comments in the thread I think are the real nuggets of interest.

However, I must say this poll sets up a dichotomy and really by the mere fact we're here on a Trek forum, you can be pretty sure what the outcome will be.

DCR wrote: View Post
Besides, I can turn on and off my inner critic, so I can enjoy or critique at will.
Yep me too. I can be pretty critical, but I can also just enjoy all that is Trek for the most part.

Also for me I grew up watching Trek, so there are a lot of fond childhood memories tied into it.
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Old July 24 2013, 11:27 AM   #10
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

I've watched it all multiple times. I've been watching it for decades. I enjoy being a specialist. I get what you're saying but I think it's easy to get into a rut on this forum where opinions on certain episodes, movies and entire series can seem like "what the fans think". Get out into real life fandom and you discover that this forum, like any long standing community, has it's own culture and that includes predominant opinions that the majority here share. Step into another Star Trek subculture and you will find very different opinions. So if you want to freshen up your relationship to Trek I think doing what you're doing, introducing brand new people to it is good but also getting off this forum and into other fan communities and hearing what totally different people say is also a great.

And Star Trek The Final Frontier is a camp masterpiece of delicious candied joy so there.
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Old July 25 2013, 09:03 PM   #11
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

I watch the series and movies, read the books and comics, and I post about it on the internet. I don't live and die by the canon, though.
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Old July 28 2013, 05:36 AM   #12
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

I refuse to vote on your poll. I'm secure in my Trekkieness and don't need to apply any labels to satisfy others. The only difference between you and your friends I see is, you've been through it more than they have. Speaking from my own experience, there's a lot of episodes I enjoyed the first time through, that just have no rewatch value. Or if I do, it is to point out every flaw in them, as that's a certain amount of fun in of itself. If you've been through the series so many times you can quote half the dialogue from memory, yes you're going to search out alternate ways to entertain yourself with it. Or just stop.
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Old July 29 2013, 05:17 PM   #13
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Re: Hardcore Trek Fans vs Trek Neophytes

Kelso wrote: View Post
...when we were watching STID- there were moments where I'd be the only one around us laughing or gasping in surprise or groaning at the screen.
Yeah, in the theater I was in, it felt like one other and myself were the only one's getting the Trek lore references.

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