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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old July 23 2013, 01:50 AM   #31
Grant
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

SpHeRe31459 wrote: View Post
Grant wrote: View Post
I am pretty sure that full sets of 'remastered' TOS on DVD are not sold. So if you wanted the remastered you'd be deprived of many episodes (Which I personally couldn't do without.)
Sorry what? TOS-R has been on DVD since 2008. And in fact the 3 seasons on DVD are about to get re-released in new packaging as a Best Buy exclusive.


Grant wrote: View Post
So I guess I'm saying if you can somehow get ahold of a Blu-ray player--that would be your best option going forward.
Ditto. As you pointed out the season sets cost pretty much the same whether DVD or Blu-ray. The Blu-ray is the better version thanks to including both the original and remastered VFX option.

Since the cost of the season sets is basically the same, we're talking about a one time investment in a decent brand-name Blu-ray player, as the only real difference.
You are right--they do sell DVD remastered season sets $87 for all 3 AND it's $99 for all 3 in BLu-ray--$12 bucks difference.

Melakon wrote: View Post
My financial situation won't change unless I start playing Lotto. I'm disabled, can't work anymore. There is enough money coming in once a month for rent and food and small expenses, but anything nearing or over $100 I have to budget several months in advance. I can play DVD's on my computer, but not Blu-Ray. And I didn't even start buying DVD until 3 or 4 years ago. Twenty-five years ago I was earning about 3 times what I get now in disability. So money is tight. Life was much better when I could just stop by the video store and order the entire 10-lot set of TOS videotapes that had just been released without checking the bank balance.


Well you made me feel like $h!t.........

I have another older Blu-ray player you can have. I'll box it up and send it to you if you want. PM me your address if you are interested.
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Old July 23 2013, 01:52 AM   #32
SpHeRe31459
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

I have an extra BD player as well. I just remembered I have a very nice circa 2010 Panasonic player in the closet (it's a great disc player it just doesn't do many online services so I replaced it). I was just coming to post about it and I see Grant had the same idea.

I'd be happy to send it to you.
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Old July 23 2013, 02:11 AM   #33
Melakon
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

But to enjoy the supposed benefits of Blu-Ray/HD, I'd also need to buy a new television set. Considering I'm less than a foot away from the screen right now in order to read it, I don't think I'd be able to detect any improvements in picture quality. DVD is fine for me since my vision has been quickly deteriorating for the last few years.

BillJ, thanks, I'll probably investigate that remastered sampler.

Grant, don't worry, all's good. I did get a little snappish, and I apologize for it. I sometimes compare my situation to early retirement (I had to stop working when I was about 51). I can stay up as late as I want, get up as late as I want (unless the cat thinks otherwise), and I don't have to worry about the rat race anymore.
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Old July 23 2013, 02:52 AM   #34
Grant
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Melakon wrote: View Post
But to enjoy the supposed benefits of Blu-Ray/HD, I'd also need to buy a new television set. Considering I'm less than a foot away from the screen right now in order to read it, I don't think I'd be able to detect any improvements in picture quality. DVD is fine for me since my vision has been quickly deteriorating for the last few years.

BillJ, thanks, I'll probably investigate that remastered sampler.

Grant, don't worry, all's good. I did get a little snappish, and I apologize for it. I sometimes compare my situation to early retirement (I had to stop working when I was about 51). I can stay up as late as I want, get up as late as I want (unless the cat thinks otherwise), and I don't have to worry about the rat race anymore.
Well, you certainly don't have anything to apologize for--I came to the thread late and was looking at is as "who would need to make this choice at this point.." and the answer is obvious---lots of people!!

If someone came in my apt and said, "Dam that toaster oven is lame-- you can get a nice one for $60!" I'd say "I can't afford $60 and my old one is fine." LOL.

But to continue to play devil's advocate (or Blu-ray advocate) there are a lot of other reasons to get Blu-ray other than just the picture, sound, features and or course in the case of TOS---both versions of all the episodes. Also I never been able to damage one by clumsiness.

So it's something to keep in mind for the future.

After I bought my TOS BLU-RAYS and watched every episode in the remastered version--I turned around and watched them again with the 'angle' button display on. I found literally dozens of other changes than just the 'space FX' by toggling back and forth between versions. They weren't perfect, but dam, they did a ton of work in a short period of time and plenty of it was darn good.
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Old July 23 2013, 03:38 AM   #35
Kinokima
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Grant wrote: View Post
[
And nobody ever said 'everybody has a blu-ray player'--that's non-sense.
And none of your friends have a PS# which IS a blu-ray player either? That's weird since many people that age play video games.
Nope, most of my friends aren't into video games.

I am not anti-Bluray. And I like when things come as DVD/BR combo sets so I will have that BR as a backup if I ever do get one.

Most people I know are more into streaming or getting digital content for their tablets than buying any physical media (DVD or BR) these days.

Now I am still a collector of physical media at heart but the thing about Blu-ray you know there is going to be a new format 10 years from now too. Whatever you buy is going to eventually be obsolete. My DVD player works just fine and I am happy with watching DVDs. When I do need to buy something new I will definitely buy a Blu-ray player, but it just isn't a priority for me personally.

I also understand you weren't saying everyone has a Blu-ray player but my main point is a whole lot of people don't have one. At least I think less people have switched to Blu-ray then in the days when people switched from VCR to DVD. Blu-Ray is definitely better than DVD in terms of quality. But I don't think it is as major of a shift as VCR to DVD was.
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Old July 23 2013, 03:53 AM   #36
Praetor Baldric
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Although I like the enhancements for the most part, I can understand those who totally reject them on the basis that they just don't seem right. I wonder though if these enhancements seem out of place for any objective technical reason, or is it just because we have been watching and re-watching the original versions for so many years that these enhancements seem so jarring as one poster put it?

In other words, for someone who is watching TOS for the very first time, would they feel that something were out of place if their first experience with each episode was with the enhancements.

I personally have friends who have always teased me for my Trekkie-ness. These same people had never really watched an entire episode before, yet when they would sit down with me and I would put on an ep like Amok Time (enhanced version), they didn't seem to feel like anything was out of place. Of course, this being their first ever viewing, they wouldn't have known what to look for.
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Old July 23 2013, 04:24 AM   #37
Hober Mallow
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Big Daddy wrote: View Post
Although I like the enhancements for the most part, I can understand those who totally reject them on the basis that they just don't seem right. I wonder though if these enhancements seem out of place for any objective technical reason, or is it just because we have been watching and re-watching the original versions for so many years that these enhancements seem so jarring as one poster put it?
The shuttle launch at 0:50 in this clip looks absolutely godawful. I don't see anyway this shot could not look out of place to anyone.
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Old July 23 2013, 04:33 AM   #38
Melakon
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Yikes that shuttle takeoff looks clumsy. Could it be Dr. Sevrin's flower children in their stolen shuttlecraft at the end of "The Way to Eden"? Or maybe Matt Decker took a few nips from the bottle before tackling the planet killer.

I thought I asked in an earlier post but maybe I'm delusional-- In the remastered "Errand of Mercy", when Sulu reports that "a large number of Klingon ships has just arrived", do we get to see them? All the original effects had was what looked like a reverse animation of a photon torpedo hitting Enterprise.
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Old July 23 2013, 04:36 AM   #39
Hober Mallow
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Incredibly, as I recall that particular shot was touted as one of the FX team's favorite shots.

A lot of the Enterprise's beauty passes look great and blend very well with the HD live action, but then you get overachieving shots like that one that looks like a bad video game and pulls you right out of the story.

Some of the original FX actually hold up pretty well in HD. The original shuttle launch looks great IMO, notwithstanding a shakey starfield.
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Old July 23 2013, 05:02 AM   #40
SpHeRe31459
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Melakon wrote: View Post
Yikes that shuttle takeoff looks clumsy. Could it be Dr. Sevrin's flower children in their stolen shuttlecraft at the end of "The Way to Eden"? Or maybe Matt Decker took a few nips from the bottle before tackling the planet killer.
It was created for Doomsday Machine and as I recall they thought the slightly wobbly take off was to show Decker's deranged/obsessed and thus inattentive mindset at the time.

Melakon wrote: View Post
I thought I asked in an earlier post but maybe I'm delusional-- In the remastered "Errand of Mercy", when Sulu reports that "a large number of Klingon ships has just arrived", do we get to see them? All the original effects had was what looked like a reverse animation of a photon torpedo hitting Enterprise.
Yes they show a number of Klingon battle cruisers and they created new VFX for the Klingon weapons, but in keeping with the original style.
http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/1x...mercyhd152.jpg

If you're interested in comparisons, back circa 2006 when these were being in batches by CBS Digital for weekly syndication, I made weekly articles that included comparison images between old and new VFX.

http://trekmovie.com/tos-in-hd/hdtv-...episode-order/
Click on the pix/video article links in the listing of episodes. Most if not all of the videos don't work any more due to server changes, etc.

Last edited by SpHeRe31459; July 23 2013 at 05:14 AM.
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Old July 23 2013, 05:11 AM   #41
Grant
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Melakon wrote: View Post
Yikes that shuttle takeoff looks clumsy. Could it be Dr. Sevrin's flower children in their stolen shuttlecraft at the end of "The Way to Eden"? Or maybe Matt Decker took a few nips from the bottle before tackling the planet killer.

I thought I asked in an earlier post but maybe I'm delusional-- In the remastered "Errand of Mercy", when Sulu reports that "a large number of Klingon ships has just arrived", do we get to see them? All the original effects had was what looked like a reverse animation of a photon torpedo hitting Enterprise.
Yes, they do show a number of Klingon ships in that shot in the remastered.

That shot of the shuttle taking off WAS from Galileo and I see what you mean--although i doubt that the clumsiness was something that happened because they couldn't do anybetter--I just think they wanted to show it as not a perfect tractor-type controlled take-off but perhaps just a loose manuel take-off. Overall the space shots in "Galileo..." look fantastic.

There were literally thousands and thousands of changes done in the remastered versions--nearly a hundred in 'Corbomite.." alone and you think you can prove something by pointing out examples you feel are not great?

It was a herculean project with modest budget and incredible time restraints and they did a fantastic job.


After watching the episodes dozens of times between 1970 and 2007, I can tell you it was great fun to watch them again and see all the changes they made--many great, most good and several not so good.
It also required really studying them, because at any second there could be a change, most subtle in the non-exterior shots.
So to see them all--you had to study the shows very carefully and that was something i suspect a lot of folks don't do after seeing them for 10,15 or 20 times.

So even if you end up still liking the old FX better--you still get to see an alternate version of virtually every space shot and dozens and dozens of other shots, mattes, image stabilization for time-lapse, redone hand phaser shots, force fields, etc, etc, etc.
Even noticed several times where they added reflections on table tops when the little 'tri-monitors' are activated.

A lot of fun and a good mental exercise as well, while re-watching one of your favorite shows ever.

And for scarcely a handful of bucks over the current price for the DVD sets that have only one version or another.
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Old July 23 2013, 05:25 AM   #42
Grant
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Kinokima wrote: View Post
Grant wrote: View Post
[
And nobody ever said 'everybody has a blu-ray player'--that's non-sense.
And none of your friends have a PS# which IS a blu-ray player either? That's weird since many people that age play video games.
Nope, most of my friends aren't into video games.

I am not anti-Bluray. And I like when things come as DVD/BR combo sets so I will have that BR as a backup if I ever do get one.

Most people I know are more into streaming or getting digital content for their tablets than buying any physical media (DVD or BR) these days.

Now I am still a collector of physical media at heart but the thing about Blu-ray you know there is going to be a new format 10 years from now too. Whatever you buy is going to eventually be obsolete. My DVD player works just fine and I am happy with watching DVDs. When I do need to buy something new I will definitely buy a Blu-ray player, but it just isn't a priority for me personally.

I also understand you weren't saying everyone has a Blu-ray player but my main point is a whole lot of people don't have one. At least I think less people have switched to Blu-ray then in the days when people switched from VCR to DVD. Blu-Ray is definitely better than DVD in terms of quality. But I don't think it is as major of a shift as VCR to DVD was.
Well, if they're not into video games--then they wouldn't have PS3 either--what is with your friends--do they have a life? I guess so since they're not always home playing video games!
I just have bought plain Blu-ray players since I don't play video games either.

But at any rate DVD players have bottomed out at--what?---$25 for some players and if 'regular' (non-3D) Blu-ray players soon bottom out at about $50--unless you're really strapped why not get one instead.

Shoot you don't even need to purchase Blu-rays to enjoy them--Redbox rents Blu-rays for 30 cents more than DVDs and there are multiple ways to get free first day rentals from Redbox.
I average 1 to 2 redbox rentals per week for the last two years and i have never paid full price a single time.
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Old July 23 2013, 06:03 AM   #43
Melakon
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Sphere, thanks for those links.

I likely will go for the remastered dvd's since that way I don't have to buy anything else to watch them. If I'm lucky, I might be able to afford the whole series next month, else September. Or maybe I'll wait until I finish my Enterprise reviews.
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Old July 23 2013, 06:10 AM   #44
Grant
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Melakon wrote: View Post
Sphere, thanks for those links.

I likely will go for the remastered dvd's since that way I don't have to buy anything else to watch them. If I'm lucky, I might be able to afford the whole series next month, else September. Or maybe I'll wait until I finish my Enterprise reviews.
That's cool--like i said Amazon is selling the 3 season DVD remastered bundle for $87--if you buy from Amazon OR you could check out the upcoming Best Buy set the other poster mentioned.

Also Wiki and other sites like memory Alpha have detailed breakdowns of the changes.

So after watching the episodes for the remastered for the first time--you could go back and see the rundown of all the changes--some that you may not have caught.

It's TOS there's very little chance you won't enjoy them!
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Old July 23 2013, 06:39 AM   #45
Melakon
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Re: Original or remastered effects?

Yes, I had been checking the Amazon price right before I did the original post. Hopefully the price will stay under $100 long enough until I'm able to get it. I've used Amazon a few times, and they've not disappointed me. They also have a distribution center near me, so it might ship from there.
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