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Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

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Old July 10 2013, 07:39 AM   #31
Timo
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

Perhaps they were monitoring the situation and decided to 'allow' Mitchell to be killed, because if he escaped (which he surely would), he could threaten even them.
It's a bit silly of Spock to conclude that just because Mitchell's abilities grow exponentially they will eventually be infinite. So what if he's superior to you now, Spock, and continues to get better? That doesn't automatically and categorically make him infinitely powerful... Q powers might have been well beyond what Mitchell could at best/worst become.

Gary could easily have made the ship blow up, or crash into the planet. He had to be stopped, period.
But if he could easily make the ship blow up or crash, how could he be stopped? Hitting him with a fist would be the least likely way to succeed!

Kirk's choice at this stage should still have been to go for the most potent weapon in his arsenal: the radiation bombardment from orbit. Toying around with feeble phaser rifles put everything in jeopardy.

Timo Saloniemi
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Old July 10 2013, 08:50 AM   #32
Robert Comsol
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

T'Girl wrote: View Post
i think that it was less Kirk going after Mitchell to get Mitchell, and more Kirk going to attempt to rescue Dehner.

Kirk would not have realized that she had "turned," and could easily have thought she had left with Mitchell unwillingly.

Otherwise Kirk and the ship would have simply left, and proceeded with the plan to irradiate the planet later.

Oh yes, I had forgotten that Kirk had been unconscious during Dehner's "departure".

A classic "damsel in distress" scenario, very palatable to audiences of the 1960's.

Elizabeth Dehner might have even read telepathically Kirk's noble intentions and then come to realize, despite her intoxication with her new powers, that something wasn't "right" about the whole situation and eventually came to her senses.

Bob
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Old July 10 2013, 09:17 AM   #33
Mario de Monti
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

Timo wrote: View Post
... life, the universe and everything.
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Old July 10 2013, 01:07 PM   #34
Crazyewok
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

Timewalker wrote: View Post
the planet. He had to be stopped, period.

And glassing the planet with a starship would be more effective than a phaser rifle and a fist fight.
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Old July 10 2013, 03:45 PM   #35
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

ZapBrannigan wrote: View Post
You know how this would work in real life: having done exactly the right thing, the thing that had to be done, Kirk would be put on trial for murder.

"Why did you decide to follow Mr. Mitchell?"
KIRK: "Since I was unconscious when Dr. Dehner's powers manifested themselves, I went after her, not Mitchell. She may have only been on the ship a short time, but she was still a member of my crew. Unless absolutely necessary, I refuse to leave a crewman behind."

LAWYER: "And you don't think insuring the safety of the Federation and beyond was a necessary enough reason?"

KIRK: "You read the report. She was still in the early stages of metamorphosis. I was able to reach her humanity and she was instrumental in buying me the time to stop Mitchell."

LAWYER: "Says here that Mitchell regained his powers shortly thereafter."

KIRK: "She still weakened him enough for me to break free and attack."

LAWYER ACTIVATES VIEWSCREEN. THE FIGHT SCENE PLAYS.

LAWYER: "By hitting him in the jaw? In the stomach? Karate chops? Why didn't you simply run for the rifle?"

KIRK: "Now hold on a minute. My report wasn't that detailed. All I said was they gave their lives in the performance of their duties! Where did you get this video?"

LAWYER POINTS TO THE BACK OF THE ROOM. A SHORT, BALD, HUGE SKULLED ALIEN, WITH PULSATING HEAD VEINS, SITTING NEXT TO BEN FINNEY.

KIRK: "Damn it."
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Old July 10 2013, 07:11 PM   #36
Kevman7987
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

^It's really too bad Talosian mental video is admissable in court...
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Old July 10 2013, 07:46 PM   #37
Timo
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

...As evidence that the cameraman, the producer and the distributor should be put to death!

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Old July 10 2013, 11:35 PM   #38
TREK_GOD_1
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

Timo wrote: View Post
It's a bit silly of Spock to conclude that just because Mitchell's abilities grow exponentially they will eventually be infinite. So what if he's superior to you now, Spock, and continues to get better? That doesn't automatically and categorically make him infinitely powerful
Considering the evolution of Mitchell's powers (from speed reading, to mind reading, telekinisis, offensive lightning, matter creation), Spock was correct early on. It was too clear where Mitchell was going, so why assume limits?


But if he could easily make the ship blow up or crash, how could he be stopped? Hitting him with a fist would be the least likely way to succeed!
Kirk used his fists when Mitchell was rendered human again--that was his best chance in a physical confrontation. If you notice, when GM was in "god" mode, Kirk used the most powerful personal weapon avaliable at the time.

Further, he already told doctor Piper what to do if he (Kirk) did not return, so the radiation option was always on the table. Meanwhile, Kirk was on a mission to not only kill GM, but to rescue Dehner--assumed to be normal, since he did not witness the transformation.
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Old July 10 2013, 11:57 PM   #39
The Old Mixer
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

According to Sulu's calculations, in a month or so he could have bought his own starship.
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Old July 11 2013, 01:54 AM   #40
Timewalker
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

Timo wrote: View Post
Gary could easily have made the ship blow up, or crash into the planet. He had to be stopped, period.
But if he could easily make the ship blow up or crash, how could he be stopped? Hitting him with a fist would be the least likely way to succeed!
You know that. But Kirk didn't think of it. And more importantly, the writers and director didn't think of that.

And at the top of it all, there was a Fight Scene (I don't remember if Kirk's shirt got ripped in this episode...).

But by comparison, it was better than TNG would have done it. At the first sign of trouble, they held a meeting. The first time Picard actually socked someone, I literally stood up in my living room and applauded.
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Old July 11 2013, 02:50 AM   #41
nightwind1
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

Crazyewok wrote: View Post
Timewalker wrote: View Post
the planet. He had to be stopped, period.

And glassing the planet with a starship would be more effective than a phaser rifle and a fist fight.
It would also destroy the lithium cracking station and probably render the ecosphere uninhabitable.
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Old July 11 2013, 03:17 AM   #42
The Old Mixer
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

Timewalker wrote: View Post
(I don't remember if Kirk's shirt got ripped in this episode...).
It did.
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Old July 11 2013, 08:07 AM   #43
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post

Although I'm liking the idea of the Q stepping in. Perhaps they were monitoring the situation and decided to 'allow' Mitchell to be killed, because if he escaped (which he surely would), he could threaten even them.
I think it would have been interesting if it turned out Mitchell gained his powers not through the ion storm (the humans just assumed it was the storm), but it was actually the Q who caused him to gain the power as a test, so that they could gauge humanity and see how much a threat humanity could be to the Q Continuum. I mean if a mere human can take down someone approaching some level of the power of Q, what would the Q think. We already know the Q are billions of years old, so maybe that is why 78 some odd years later, they finally decided to act, and it happened to be as Picard was on his way to Farpoint. Because, when you are billions of years old, 78 years is not that long to wait.
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Old July 11 2013, 10:45 AM   #44
Timo
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

OTOH, it's rather amusing to think that godlike intellect and powers are just random occurrences, like some sort of nasty infections you get from a broken toilet seat... Puts us intelligence-worshipping monkeys in our place, really.

You know that. But Kirk didn't think of it.
I can't really see Kirk first calmly arranging for Mitchell's ultimate destruction via radiation bombardment, and then succumbing to red haze and deciding that he absolutely needed to punch him in the jaw as well... "He had to be stopped, period!" would be no rationale or excuse for going after him, not unless Kirk had become utterly deranged.

On the other hand, "He had to be stopped, ellipsis and question mark" would be. Perhaps reason and mercy still stand a chance of working? Nothing will be lost by trying, except of course for Kirk's own life.

Timo Saloniemi
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Old July 11 2013, 10:48 AM   #45
ZapBrannigan
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Re: Why did Kirk Kill Mitchell?

TheSubCommander wrote: View Post
I think it would have been interesting if it turned out Mitchell gained his powers not through the ion storm (the humans just assumed it was the storm), but it was actually the Q who caused him to gain the power as a test, so that they could gauge humanity and see how much a threat humanity could be to the Q Continuum.

I think that despite John de Lancie being great in the role, Q was a directional mistake for ST:TNG. Q's inexplicable bromance with Picard was like a cross between the "deus ex machina" of an ancient Greek play and Kazoo of The Flintstones.

Kirk had his run-ins with superbeings, but none of them became a semi-regular, impishly helping and hindering Kirk's missions for sport. Q, as a vastly powerful and eternal superbeing, should never have found one particular Frenchman with a British accent so fascinating.

On the other hand, purely as an alternate universe story, it might be fun to imagine WNMHGB ending differently. Suppose after Gary bit the dust, Elizabeth had stood up, brushed herself off, and said "Good work, Captain. Let's get back to the ship."

And then she stays in Star Fleet, using her superpowers to get the Enterprise out of every jam. She could have put Kirk on equal footing with Charlie Evans, Trelane, and Apollo.

She could have captured the Romulan ship intact in "Balance of Terror." If she was in the landing party that got snatched by the Gamesters of Triskelion, she could have emancipated the slaves in two minutes and given each Provider a wicked-ass migraine headache.

It might make for lousy one-hour drama, but being her would be a blast.
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