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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old May 28 2013, 03:14 PM   #16
gomtuu20
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

Both the live shots and the special effects shots looked like they were filmed by a cameraman with Parkinson's who had the camera in a paint shaker, which he tied a rope to and was swinging around his head! It doesn't make it feel exciting, it just looks like amateurish photography.

During the fight scene with the Klingons, I couldn't tell who was doing what. This technique ruined the 2nd & 3rd Bourne movies for me.

In Star Trek: The Motionless Picture they went to the other extreme, which has been widely criticized. Can't we find a happy medium?

Having said all that, I enjoyed the film. I look forward to the next movie set to start the 5 year mission. It would be nice to have some drama come from something other than another villain.
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Old May 28 2013, 05:05 PM   #17
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

Perfectly still camera shots during tense or action scenes is very dated and has that IMO 'straight-to-video/TV' quality about it. The TNG era Trek movies were guilty of this when other movies around that time moved on.
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Old May 28 2013, 05:15 PM   #18
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

OpenMaw wrote: View Post
@thread honestly this is just a matter of keeping a consistent style. It would be incredibly goofy to go from interior's where you have hand held and free flowing camera work to - "LOCKED VISUAL FX SHOT! SEE AUDIENCE! WE'RE SHOWING YOU THE EFFECTS!"
This.

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Old May 28 2013, 06:48 PM   #19
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

anh165 wrote: View Post
Perfectly still camera shots during tense or action scenes is very dated and has that IMO 'straight-to-video/TV' quality about it. The TNG era Trek movies were guilty of this when other movies around that time moved on.
Oh, gosh, does that mean we're stuck with this "hand-held" style forever ?
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Old May 28 2013, 09:00 PM   #20
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

gomtuu20 wrote: View Post
Both the live shots and the special effects shots looked like they were filmed by a cameraman with Parkinson's <snip>
Parkinson's isn't funny at all. Let's lose this kind of "joke," OK?
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Old May 28 2013, 09:08 PM   #21
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

OpenMaw wrote: View Post
@thread honestly this is just a matter of keeping a consistent style. It would be incredibly goofy to go from interior's where you have hand held and free flowing camera work to - "LOCKED VISUAL FX SHOT! SEE AUDIENCE! WE'RE SHOWING YOU THE EFFECTS!"
If the camera's perspective is in distress, like onboard a ship where there is gravity and movement to contend with, shaky-cam makes sense. If the perspective is free-floating in space, it's just stupid and distracting.
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Old May 28 2013, 09:15 PM   #22
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

Tosk wrote: View Post
JonnyBoy wrote: View Post
the drawing morphing into the ship, the title card sequence
Mostly I was just impressed that the natives could draw such an accurate top-view of the Enterprise without ever seeing it from above.

If you watch that scene more closely, you can see the engineering hull overlap the saucer, indicating that they drew the underside of the ship.
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Old May 28 2013, 10:38 PM   #23
beamMe
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

Mr. B wrote: View Post
OpenMaw wrote: View Post
@thread honestly this is just a matter of keeping a consistent style. It would be incredibly goofy to go from interior's where you have hand held and free flowing camera work to - "LOCKED VISUAL FX SHOT! SEE AUDIENCE! WE'RE SHOWING YOU THE EFFECTS!"
If the camera's perspective is in distress, like onboard a ship where there is gravity and movement to contend with, shaky-cam makes sense. If the perspective is free-floating in space, it's just stupid and distracting.
It's not.
It wasn't in '09 and it isn't now.
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Old May 28 2013, 10:57 PM   #24
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

Mr. B wrote: View Post
If the camera's perspective is in distress, like onboard a ship where there is gravity and movement to contend with, shaky-cam makes sense. If the perspective is free-floating in space, it's just stupid and distracting.
That really depends on the specific context. If the intention is to keep a pace form shot to shot, then no. You want to maintain the same style of motion, otherwise it will pull the audience out of the moment.

However, if the intention is to juxtapose the environments, then you would do that. Which happens in both XI and ID during the atmospheric jumps. The style of camera work, and the use of sound both change dramatically from one shot, to the shot taking us into the next scene. It's a dangerous game to play, because if you mess it up, you can pull the audience right out of the movie and annoy them.
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Old May 29 2013, 10:15 AM   #25
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

beamMe wrote: View Post
Mr. B wrote: View Post
If the camera's perspective is in distress, like onboard a ship where there is gravity and movement to contend with, shaky-cam makes sense. If the perspective is free-floating in space, it's just stupid and distracting.
It's not.
It wasn't in '09 and it isn't now.
It is. And I hope that whoever will direct the next Trek movie will get rid of those stupid shaky cams. They completely ruin the style and are distracting as hell. I don't want to watch a movie going forward frame by frame on my TV to be able to see what's actually going on.

And I do miss the beauty fly-by shots.
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Old May 29 2013, 08:31 PM   #26
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

The entire point was realism, to make it seem like you're there. Thankfully it was much better in this than 09. As for the speed of it in space shots, one can say that in this incarnation of Trek the special effects aren't center stage anymore.
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Old May 29 2013, 09:04 PM   #27
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

Oso Blanco wrote: View Post
beamMe wrote: View Post
Mr. B wrote: View Post
If the camera's perspective is in distress, like onboard a ship where there is gravity and movement to contend with, shaky-cam makes sense. If the perspective is free-floating in space, it's just stupid and distracting.
It's not.
It wasn't in '09 and it isn't now.
It is. And I hope that whoever will direct the next Trek movie will get rid of those stupid shaky cams. They completely ruin the style and are distracting as hell. I don't want to watch a movie going forward frame by frame on my TV to be able to see what's actually going on.

And I do miss the beauty fly-by shots.
But it's not. And I don't think it's going anywhere. It's the style presented by these films, and I'm sure that while the director of III will have his own style, he'll also respect what has come before.
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Old May 29 2013, 09:07 PM   #28
Belz...
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

I don't think shaky-cam adds realism, really, unless it's in documentary style like District 9. First, we're supposed to be observers, not participants in the story (like in a videogame, for instance), and second, shaky-cam simulates an actual camera... so who's filming on the ship ?

I don't really mind the technique, mind you, but in the case of Star Trek I just think it's a bit out of place. My personal opinion, of course.
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Old May 29 2013, 10:01 PM   #29
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

gomtuu20 wrote: View Post
Both the live shots and the special effects shots looked like they were filmed by a cameraman with Parkinson's who had the camera in a paint shaker, which he tied a rope to and was swinging around his head!

(I disagree, but that was still hilarious)
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Old May 29 2013, 10:11 PM   #30
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Re: Shaky-cam in space / Visual effects shots

I would probably prefer smoother FX shots but I realise they'd stick out like a sore thumb in JJ's movies.

Though if he wants to give us a DVD extra where we get the action scenes done retro TOS style (though without The Enterprise listing around at odd angles!) that'd be sweeeeet

I think my favourite FX in the whole movie was the warp drive sequence. Felt like TNG warp and TOS Movie warp combined.
Would love to see a lot more of that
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