RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 135,708
Posts: 5,214,092
Members: 24,208
Currently online: 911
Newest member: Robert james


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > Science Fiction & Fantasy

Science Fiction & Fantasy Farscape, Babylon 5, Star Wars, Firefly, vampires, genre books and film.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old January 29 2014, 07:17 AM   #1126
Silvercrest
Rear Admiral
 
Location: Lost in Moria (Arlington, WA, USA)
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Morpheus 02 wrote:

I've been calling #1 Zombie Virus & #2 Zombie Bacteria...but agree with the idea. How they are interrelated, we don't know...and probably not too relevent, at least for the sake of an enoyable show...
Others have pointed out that there's no way a true virus could do the things this does, so I prefer to just stick with something generic like "bug" or "whatever is active in the walkers."

As for bacteria, well, I'm not qualified to analyze that one-- but I was wondering something. Whatever #1 and #2 are, it's either a remarkable coincidence that they work so well together, or else they were designed that way, or else:

The appearance of #2 is dependent on the presence of #1. This is established. It requires a reanimated body before it can manifest itself, and it then does so in the mouth. And only there. If it's a bacterium, there's something about mouth conditions that are just right for it. Perhaps the walker produces some sort of chemical in the mouth that encourages the growth of #2.

OR perhaps the chemical is #2. A substance produced by the walker and secreted in the mouth. When a walker bites living flesh, this stuff gets into the wound and the victim reacts violently. Body temperature shoots up, swelling of the brain produces disorientation that looks like delirium, and so on. The intent is to hasten death so that #1 can take over. It makes #1 more efficient. But it's a chemical reaction, not a fever.

Side note: If #1 is a microorganism, there's a case that #2 facilitates quicker reproduction ... but since it's apparently infected the entire world, it's a little hard to tell when the reproductive cycle even is. So I can't pursue the specific nature of #1 much further.

Including the answer to JD's question. I couldn't possibly guess what #1 might do in a living host when no available evidence suggests that it does anything.

Anyway, #2 could still be a microorganism that lives in some sort of remarkable symbiosis with #1. Both would gain when more walkers are reanimated. But we'd have to ascribe almost as many fantastic elements to #2 as to #1, particularly the apparent speed of reproduction once it enters the body, plus an extremely convenient symbiosis, etc.

And the chemical idea seems more elegant. It only requires one bug, not two, it could very well work that fast, and it seems to account for all the symptoms. And one more thing: the story on the walkers' physiology is mixed, at best. They have this hunger but seem unable to digest, they're producing energy that comes from nowhere, etc. Producing a beneficial chemical doesn't answer all that, but at least it's a nod that they have some kind of functioning metabolism.

Can people see any holes in that?

Last edited by Silvercrest; January 29 2014 at 07:28 AM.
Silvercrest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 29 2014, 07:27 AM   #1127
Mister Fandango
Captain
 
Mister Fandango's Avatar
 
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

I'm still leaning towards the Komodo dragon idea (or at least what was originally thought about them). Their bites are just infested with all kinds of crazy bacteria that leads to festering wounds. Maybe the zombie virus itself acts as a catalyst, greatly accelerating the speed in which the infections spread.

Hell, maybe part of the zombie transformation includes some kind of venom sac. Scratches and bodily fluid certainly don't seem to be deadly, only the biting.
__________________
WildStar
Mister Fandango is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 29 2014, 07:35 AM   #1128
Silvercrest
Rear Admiral
 
Location: Lost in Moria (Arlington, WA, USA)
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Then we're thinking along the same lines. If my Bug #1 acts as a catalyst to speed up existing bacteria, you get the equivalent of my Bug #2. If the body grows a venom sac, that is my Chemical #2. Although I'd prefer to think it adapts the salivary glands or some such thing to produce the chemical, rather than growing something new.

Excellent deductions, Watson!
Silvercrest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 29 2014, 12:46 PM   #1129
Trekker4747
Fleet Admiral
 
Trekker4747's Avatar
 
Location: Kansas City
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

I think of it that the "Zombie Bug" is dormant in everyone and being bitten by someone with an "active" version of the bug (a zombie/walker) causes what happens in every other zombie movie to happen. The person dies and eventually comes back as a zombie.
__________________
Just because it's futuristic doesn't mean it's practical.
Trekker4747 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 29 2014, 06:44 PM   #1130
Silvercrest
Rear Admiral
 
Location: Lost in Moria (Arlington, WA, USA)
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Okay, but even then, there has to be something unique about the walker bite that "activates" the bug. The walker bug is dormant in living people and (as long as they remain alive) it doesn't get activated until very specific conditions arise. Walker scratches, casual exposure to zombie ichor ... none of that does it. There's something about walker structure or "biology" that focuses on their mouths and/or their bites. The most likely candidates are still some other kind of bug (even if it's just an activated version of the regular bug), or some kind of chemical.

That may sound like hairsplitting, but unless you establish that there are some very specific trigger conditions, then the walker bug should be treated like any virulent microorganism. It becomes active at the drop of a hat whether the person is alive or dead, races through the population, and very shortly nothing is left but walkers.

Obviously that hasn't happened yet. (Although the flu outbreak at the prison was meant to make us think it was starting to happen.) So, there are some pretty specific limits for activation and those limits define why the 1% of the population is left for us to have a show.

Yeah, "bite" is one of them, but it has to be more than just "bite". Medically there's no difference between "bite", "scratch", "T-Dog slashing himself open and getting walker ichor into the wound", and "walker gets shot/stabbed/decapitated/[insert violent act here] while attacking Rick and ichor gets into the visible cuts on Rick's face". But only one of those does it.

There has to be more to it than "bite" and there has to be more to it than "virulent organism that runs rampant once it gets into your system."
Silvercrest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 29 2014, 08:13 PM   #1131
dansigal
Lieutenant Commander
 
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Silvercrest wrote: View Post
There has to be more to it than "bite" and there has to be more to it than "virulent organism that runs rampant once it gets into your system."
The real answer to this is that this makes absolutely no sense, and it never will. It simply is what it is. This is the rule for how this fantastical world works. It's like trying to figure out the science behind magic. There's no explanation that will ever make any sense. I think just accepting the rule is better than trying to develop some midiclorian nonsense.

For an example of this done right, look at Mira Grant's Newsflesh trilogy. In that world, there is a zombie virus and everyone is infected. However, its dormant until you die, then it's activated, or if it comes in contact with the active virus, it will also activate. But they are consistent in that it doesn't just have to be a bite. If you get zombie saliva in your eye, you're done. If you get zombie blood in a cut, it's just a matter of time...
dansigal is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 29 2014, 08:45 PM   #1132
Silvercrest
Rear Admiral
 
Location: Lost in Moria (Arlington, WA, USA)
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

I can hardly argue; I posted almost exactly the same thing about a week ago!

I think the actual infection may be the "walker explanation virus". I've caught it since last week and now I'm doomed. Don't let me bite you.

Seriously, it can be interesting to rationalize a framework that covers everything. I don't treat it as canon or even expect anyone else to accept it; I only bring it up here to see if anyone can find inconsistencies. So far, it seems to hold up.

And I go for the simplest explanation that covers all the evidence. I'd prefer a chemical or venom secreted by the walkers over any kind of additional bug. No midichlorians here.

But it's not that important. It's entirely separate from my enjoyment of the show. If my explanation holds up through everything we see through the end of the show, then great. Obviously I was reading the writers' BRRRAIINS!! (Sorry, losing a little control.)

If they present something that violates my explanation, well, too bad — but that's no reason to stop watching. I'm a consumer and I've still gotta consume. Maybe I can try to eat-- I mean, try to find a loophole that makes it work.

Someone help me; I need a crossbow bolt now.
Silvercrest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 29 2014, 09:59 PM   #1133
Relayer1
Commodore
 
Relayer1's Avatar
 
Location: The Black Country, England
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Could it have something to do with viral load ? Everyone has a low intensity background level of infection, which has no noticeable symptoms.

Bites give a sudden massive viral spike overwhelming the subject and leading to death, after which...
__________________
Soon oh soon the light, Pass within and soothe this endless night, And wait here for you, Our reason to be here...
Relayer1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 30 2014, 03:11 AM   #1134
Trekker4747
Fleet Admiral
 
Trekker4747's Avatar
 
Location: Kansas City
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Okay, but even then, there has to be something unique about the walker bite that "activates" the bug.
It's just a very, very, nasty regular bite that's filled with disease and bacteria that quickly becomes very, very infected and septic. It's probably augmented by the "active" version of the Walker Bug but, basically, it's like being bitten by a rabid dog with a flesh-eating bacteria in its mouth that the dog itself is immune to.
__________________
Just because it's futuristic doesn't mean it's practical.
Trekker4747 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 03:00 PM   #1135
PKerr
Rear Admiral
 
PKerr's Avatar
 
Location: Tampa Fl
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Nice Season 4.5 teaser
PKerr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 03:06 PM   #1136
Q2UnME
Commodore
 
Q2UnME's Avatar
 
Location: Inman, SC
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

^ That was REALLY cool. Thank you for posting it.

So ready for new weekend. *squee*

Q2
__________________
"Love to one, friendship to many and goodwill to all."

Whiskey - Tango - Foxtrot
Q2UnME is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 03:12 PM   #1137
PKerr
Rear Admiral
 
PKerr's Avatar
 
Location: Tampa Fl
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Q2UnME wrote: View Post
^ That was REALLY cool. Thank you for posting it.

So ready for new weekend. *squee*

Q2
Same here, not many shows I get really excited for but TWD is one of them and you're welcome BTW.
PKerr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 04:25 PM   #1138
Scout101
Admiral
 
Scout101's Avatar
 
Location: Rhode Island, USA
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Trekker4747 wrote: View Post
Okay, but even then, there has to be something unique about the walker bite that "activates" the bug.
It's just a very, very, nasty regular bite that's filled with disease and bacteria that quickly becomes very, very infected and septic. It's probably augmented by the "active" version of the Walker Bug but, basically, it's like being bitten by a rabid dog with a flesh-eating bacteria in its mouth that the dog itself is immune to.
Same problem: why's the bite different than getting zombie blood in your mouth/eye/open wound? Agree with your general idea, it just doesn't make the bite itself anything special. Getting rabid dog blood in your open wound wouldn't do you any favors, the teeth are just a way of creating that open wound first...
__________________
Perhaps, if I am very lucky, the feeble efforts of my lifetime will someday be noticed and maybe, in some small way, they will be acknowledged as the greatest works of genius ever created by man. ~Jack Handey
STO: @JScout33
Scout101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 3 2014, 09:28 PM   #1139
PKerr
Rear Admiral
 
PKerr's Avatar
 
Location: Tampa Fl
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Dunno if THIS has been uploaded before but it's pretty hilarious.
PKerr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 4 2014, 07:17 AM   #1140
JD
Admiral
 
JD's Avatar
 
Location: Arizona, USA
Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Nice. I love that they actually got Norman Reedus to do it.
__________________
Over the course of many encounters and many years, I have successfully developed a standard operating procedure for dealing with big, nasty monsters. Run away. Me and Monty Python.
Harry Dresden - Blood Rites (The Dresden Files #6)
JD is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
season 4, the walking dead, twd

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:40 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.