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Old December 19 2013, 02:05 AM   #961
jbny67
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Pavonis wrote: View Post
Morfius wrote: View Post
Any way, I have a theory. There seems to be a contradiction in that everyone who dies becomes a Walker, but also people who die become walkers. What if the zombification factor (virus/bacteria/god flipped a switch) that turns everyone who dies is a separate thing from the illness you get if a walker bites you. What if the walker bit only kills you and the separate zombification factor turns you after you die?
Highlighted part confuses me. It says the same thing twice, yet you seem to be distinguishing them. Very confusing. Might be able to discuss if you sort out what you're trying to say by writing clearly.
I think it's supposed to say
everyone who dies becomes a Walker, but also people who get bit become walkers.
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Old December 19 2013, 02:36 AM   #962
Pavonis
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Oh? Well, "people who die from walker bites" are just a subset of "people who die", so I really don't see any difference. It's already been made clear that walker bites do not transmit the reanimation bug, since everyone already has that factor which causes reanimation after death. I think I'm still confused as to the question.
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Old December 19 2013, 04:00 AM   #963
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

The Walker virus (or infection, disease, whatever it is) seems to have two variants. There's an active one and there's a dormant one. Everyone is already infected with the dormant one that's apparently able to be controlled or stopped by the body's own immune system. When the person dies the immune system can no longer fight the dormant virus which now becomes active and aggressive and reanimated the body at some point in the next few minutes to few hours.

The active version of the disease is much more virulent and aggressive. It causes a person to become ill and succumb within a half-day or so. At which point the dormant variant goes to work.
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Old December 19 2013, 04:41 AM   #964
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Pavonis wrote: View Post
Morfius wrote: View Post
Any way, I have a theory. There seems to be a contradiction in that everyone who dies becomes a Walker, but also people who die become walkers. What if the zombification factor (virus/bacteria/god flipped a switch) that turns everyone who dies is a separate thing from the illness you get if a walker bites you. What if the walker bit only kills you and the separate zombification factor turns you after you die?
Highlighted part confuses me. It says the same thing twice, yet you seem to be distinguishing them. Very confusing. Might be able to discuss if you sort out what you're trying to say by writing clearly.
I believe what the poster is saying, is what we've known since Rick disclosed what Jenner told him at the CDC, "everybody is infected, they'll turn no matter how they die".

Therefore, I believe the poster, like me and others, surmises, that a Zombie bite only kills you, it doesn't turn you by itself. Dying is what turns you, being bit or not doesn't make a difference in how you turn.

I think the this past half season Flu Virus, is just a virulent Flu Virus that killed people, and since they died, they turned. The Flu itself didn't turn them, and doesn't have anything to do with the "Turn you into a Zombie Virus" everybody is already infected with.
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Old December 19 2013, 04:59 AM   #965
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Pavonis wrote: View Post
Morfius wrote: View Post
Any way, I have a theory. There seems to be a contradiction in that everyone who dies becomes a Walker, but also people who die become walkers. What if the zombification factor (virus/bacteria/god flipped a switch) that turns everyone who dies is a separate thing from the illness you get if a walker bites you. What if the walker bit only kills you and the separate zombification factor turns you after you die?
Highlighted part confuses me. It says the same thing twice, yet you seem to be distinguishing them. Very confusing. Might be able to discuss if you sort out what you're trying to say by writing clearly.
We talked about this in an earlier thread. The mechanism that revives people is a "virus" while what kills someone from a bite or scratch is a "bacteria" . (or whatever terms are more accurate) They're interconnected but not the same thing.

The new flu might be a more aggressive version of the "bacteria"
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Old December 19 2013, 05:06 AM   #966
Pavonis
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

When were these mechanisms revealed? In the comics? In the show? In a video game? Or are you relying on your own knowledge of epidemiology?
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Old December 19 2013, 05:19 AM   #967
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

I think the "flu" in the first part of the season was just that, an aggressive flu that was just much more deadly given the unsanitary conditions people have been living in for the last year, year and a half. It's sort of like how if you were to travel back in time to the 19th century you'd probably find it pretty hard to survive there on at the very least the food and water supply. Our food and water is so treated and clean we've not many immunities to the natural bacteria and such in these items. People in the 19th century DID have these immunities from being exposed to them.

I don't think this "flu" is related to the zombie [illness] it's just very aggressive and deadly (as some strains of the actual flu can be) given the unsanitary conditions people live in with limited medical resources.

Whatever people die from after a zombie-bite however has to be related to the bite which, again, I think comes from a more active and aggressive version of the zombie [illness.] Since people die from it within 12 hours usually by running a very high fever and severe pain. So it's more than a simple infection from an untreated wound. But it does seem to move slowly and not through the blood supply since fairly early amputation of the bitten area prevents the spread of the disease. (If it traveled by blood it'd be all over the body after a bite pretty quickly.) This *may* suggest that the body has "some" immunities or defense mechanism against the illness and that it attacks and spreads by some other means.
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Old December 19 2013, 09:26 AM   #968
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Morpheus 02 wrote: View Post
Pavonis wrote: View Post
Morfius wrote: View Post
Any way, I have a theory. There seems to be a contradiction in that everyone who dies becomes a Walker, but also people who die become walkers. What if the zombification factor (virus/bacteria/god flipped a switch) that turns everyone who dies is a separate thing from the illness you get if a walker bites you. What if the walker bit only kills you and the separate zombification factor turns you after you die?
Highlighted part confuses me. It says the same thing twice, yet you seem to be distinguishing them. Very confusing. Might be able to discuss if you sort out what you're trying to say by writing clearly.
We talked about this in an earlier thread. The mechanism that revives people is a "virus" while what kills someone from a bite or scratch is a "bacteria" . (or whatever terms are more accurate) They're interconnected but not the same thing.

The new flu might be a more aggressive version of the "bacteria"
Jenner was pretty clear that they didn't know what the cause of the reanimation was, which is why it was so hard to treat. Fact is, we're all working on assumptions here. It may as well be black magic.
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Old December 19 2013, 12:02 PM   #969
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

The Walking Dead Wiki has this to say on the matter:

Robert Kirkman wrote:
The rule is WHATEVER it is that causes the zombies, is something everyone already has. If you stub your toe, get an infection and die, you turn into a zombie, UNLESS your brain is damaged. If someone shoots you in the head and you die, you're dead. A zombie bite kills you because of infection, or blood loss, not because of the zombie "virus."
This is why amputation can save those like Hershel from turning, because it stops the infection, not because it stops the zombie "virus."
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Old December 19 2013, 01:47 PM   #970
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Trekker4747 wrote: View Post
The Walker virus (or infection, disease, whatever it is) seems to have two variants. There's an active one and there's a dormant one. Everyone is already infected with the dormant one that's apparently able to be controlled or stopped by the body's own immune system. When the person dies the immune system can no longer fight the dormant virus which now becomes active and aggressive and reanimated the body at some point in the next few minutes to few hours.

The active version of the disease is much more virulent and aggressive. It causes a person to become ill and succumb within a half-day or so. At which point the dormant variant goes to work.
You've read the Newsflesh Trilogy haven't you?
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Old December 19 2013, 09:13 PM   #971
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

I didn't like that the series began after the fall. So we didn't get to see how it happened. What ever it was it was very fast. So fast that after the hospital nurses stopped taking care of Rick, he was able to wake up after it before he starved to death. It happened so fast that the stores were still full of stuff. (There wasn't time for them to be emptied by hoarders before they all died)

If the cause of zombies was a virus, even if (like in 12 monkeys) someone deliberatly spread it, it would take time to get every where, governments would have time to respond and it would take about a year to get everywhere in the world. (like in Wolrd War Z) But in this story, it was everywhere at once. I'm inclined to think god just "flipped a switch" and suddenly everyone world-wide who died became a walker. So ground zero became every hospital, hospice, motorcycle accident and war zone.

Also why doesn't anyone use the word: "Zombie" in this series. Has Disney copywrited it?
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Old December 19 2013, 09:27 PM   #972
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

I'm fine with them picking up after, as it sets it apart from a random zombie disaster flick a bit. Just wish they'd toss us a little backstory now and then and fill in those bits, even if they don't want to really explore the whole thing...

New spinoff coming, maybe that will give us some of that?

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Also why doesn't anyone use the word: "Zombie" in this series. Has Disney copywrited it?
Eh, doubt it. Most likely, it's just the same conceit that every zombie movie makes: almost every zombie movie takes place in a world where zombie movies never existed. Bites, shooting them in the brain, it's new and novel concept every time. Otherwise, people would know too much going in and you lose the terrified/panicked/what do we do? vibe. Not that it still wouldn't be scary as shit, but in OUR universe, you'd know enough about it that it's unlikely it would ever get that far.
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Old December 19 2013, 10:56 PM   #973
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Yeah pretty much, zombies don't exist as a fictional concept. Thus the word "zombie" doesn't exist. (Of note, the grandfather of zombie movies "Night of the Living Dead" doesn't use the word either.)
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Old December 19 2013, 11:33 PM   #974
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

"Zombie" gets used a few times in the comics. More commonly though Rick's group calls them "Roamers" (the ones that move around) and "Lurkers" (the ones that tend to stay in one spot til someone passes by.) The one that bites Hershel on the show would be a Lurker. "Walker" has never been used in the comics as far as I know.
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Old December 19 2013, 11:59 PM   #975
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 4

Yeah, I don't recall though if zombies exist in popular culture or not in the context of the comic, however.

I like the way the series handles it though. Because, again, if zombies don't exist in popular culture then why would the word itself exist? And if zombies DO exist in popular culture then certain tropes, like shooting them in the head, not letting them bite you, etc.; would exist and be known.
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