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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

View Poll Results: Grade the movie...
A+ 143 19.32%
A 160 21.62%
A- 99 13.38%
B+ 82 11.08%
B 58 7.84%
B- 27 3.65%
C+ 40 5.41%
C 38 5.14%
C- 24 3.24%
D+ 11 1.49%
D 13 1.76%
D- 10 1.35%
F 35 4.73%
Voters: 740. You may not vote on this poll

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Old July 2 2013, 02:50 PM   #4486
Kolinahr
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

It seems to me that the use of the man to bomb the Archive was not actually useful. Khan could have just used some kind of craft to fly above and drop something on it. Why did he risk the man just refusing to do it or telling his superiors instead? Seems illogical to me.
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Old July 2 2013, 03:36 PM   #4487
Pingfah
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

He gave the man a plenty good reason to do it, he wasn't blackmailing him, he bribed him.

Seems a lot more certain than attempting an air attack over a major city, which would abjectly fail right now, let alone in a few hundred years.
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Old July 2 2013, 03:42 PM   #4488
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Someone mentioned earlier that it could be seen as a pretty useful way of demonstrating how much of a dick Khan is. I don't necessarily agree with that but it's a valid reading.
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Old July 2 2013, 03:43 PM   #4489
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

mos6507 wrote: View Post
Shazam! wrote: View Post
As ridiculous as it is, the tribble scene was actually the superior set-up scene because it, y'know, set something up which actually paid off later in the film.
The setup was so obvious, though, that it made the plot too predictable.
Well, the point in the story is Kirk makes his sacrifice unaware of what we (the audience) suspect could happen. If Kirk had been aware there was a chance he'd survive his trip to the warp core, that would've truly spoiled the story.

I don't think the point was to create suspense over whether or not Kirk would live, either, so much as show what Kirk was willing to do to save his ship and crew. Again, within the story, he's giving his life for the rest of the crew. That, and he can be afraid. That's the growth of the character.

Kolinahr wrote: View Post
It seems to me that the use of the man to bomb the Archive was not actually useful. Khan could have just used some kind of craft to fly above and drop something on it. Why did he risk the man just refusing to do it or telling his superiors instead? Seems illogical to me.
I've thought about this, too. As far as the father goes, as I stated above, he probably had to complete his end of the deal or Harrison would've killed his family.

Still, Harrison could've used a cyber attack, planted a time bomb, used a drone, or done any one of six or seven other things before needing a suicide bomber. Of course, the point of what he did within the story is that in the three or four minutes it takes the scene to play out, we learn just how cruel and manipulative Harrison is.

There's also the shock value of the bomb going off. That's probably the first time that happened in decades on Earth. Pure terror. Sloppy. If someone was willing to blow up what everyone thought was just a public archive, then what's next?
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Old July 2 2013, 04:04 PM   #4490
Kruezerman
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Well after Nero, Starfleet was prepared for an attack from foreign powers, a suicide bomber that admits to being manipulated represents an attack from within, which for the Federation on Earth I'm assuming, is borderline unheard of.
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Old July 2 2013, 05:17 PM   #4491
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Kolinahr wrote: View Post
It seems to me that the use of the man to bomb the Archive was not actually useful. Khan could have just used some kind of craft to fly above and drop something on it.
Seemed pretty deep under the city, so well protected from the outside.
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Old July 2 2013, 10:22 PM   #4492
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

^ yep, the Section 31 installation (Khan's true target) was deep underground. The memorial archive was built on top of it.
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Old July 4 2013, 03:13 AM   #4493
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Yet, the explosion was powerful enough to tear through several levels of sub-levels, to breach street level, and be seen from the Royal Children's Hospital, a facility outside London.

After seeing "The Lone Ranger", I see a strength of Star Trek. The source material is far more adaptable and malleable than other products of 20th century media. (The biggest flaw of "The Lone Ranger" was its source material, which I think doesn't translate well into the 21st century.)
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Old July 4 2013, 10:46 AM   #4494
Belz...
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

throwback wrote: View Post
Yet, the explosion was powerful enough to tear through several levels of sub-levels, to breach street level, and be seen from the Royal Children's Hospital, a facility outside London.
It's easier when you're inside the facility.
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Old July 5 2013, 02:47 AM   #4495
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Belz, I don't understand what you wrote. Can you please clarify your statement?
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Old July 5 2013, 02:50 AM   #4496
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Ln X wrote: View Post
It would make half the money, but if you halved the budget then Paramount would still be getting the same proportion of returns from its investment. You half the budget by trimming down the special effects, being far more careful and measured with the action scenes and cutting down on a bloated advertisement and promotion budget.
Nope. Doesn't work that way, sorry.

You've proposed a recipe for getting slaughtered at the box office. Go big or go home.
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Old July 5 2013, 03:14 AM   #4497
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Actually, the returns can be larger on a film made with a smaller budget.

What I see happening is that if a film has a larger budget, the harder the climb to profits. Some films can do this, like Man of Steel. Other films, like The Lone Ranger, can't do this, which can be calamitous for a studio. Walt Disney's stock has declined with the news that their latest film is a John Carter in the making.

For a film to succeed, it must be able to transcend cultural barriers, have good word of mouth, and have a hook to get people into the chairs.
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Old July 5 2013, 08:45 AM   #4498
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Yeah, all well and good, but....

Trek needs a big name attached to it. Get a big-name internationally recognized action star as your must-see blockbuster villain of the summer and you'll pull in more numbers.
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Old July 5 2013, 10:41 AM   #4499
Belz...
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

throwback wrote: View Post
Belz, I don't understand what you wrote. Can you please clarify your statement?
I mean if you want to bomb a heavily-fortified location, bombing from the inside will be far more successful than from the outside. The death toll in the movie seems to be Section 31 people, moreso than anyone on the outside.
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Old July 5 2013, 11:38 AM   #4500
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Re: STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

throwback wrote: View Post
For a film to succeed, it must be able to transcend cultural barriers, have good word of mouth, and have a hook to get people into the chairs.
STID got something right at any rate, since about half of its total lifetime grosses are domestic and the other half foreign. And the movie's beaten its prodution budget in both foreign and domestic sales. (Box office mojo) I don't understand the cost structure of the distribution systems well enough to be able to judge when the movie makes a net profit, though.
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