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Deep Space Nine What We Left Behind, we will always have here.

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Old March 9 2013, 04:42 AM   #1
Sadara
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Captain Solok

So I was watching Take Me Out to the Holosuite the other day and I'm curious what other fans think of Captain Solok.

He kind of baffles me. He is less than fond of more "emotionally handicapped species" (to the point where he behaves much like a bully) and yet he chose to leave Vulcan and venture out among them. Sure he has an all Vulcan crew, but he had to go through the Academy with members of other species and he comes into frequent contact with them.

I wish we'd learned more about *why* Solok is this way. Did he not measure up to other Vulcans at some point so now he thinks he has to prove his superiority elsewhere? Is he seriously just a jerk with no catalyst behind the behavior?
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Old March 9 2013, 05:08 AM   #2
Seventh White Boomer
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Re: Captain Solok

He's a Vulcan, they are generally all jerks. Even Spock frequently put down the Humans on the Enterprise because they didn't embrace logic and strictly control their emotions. Vulcan's have a superiority complex and Solok seems to be a bit more aggressive about it.
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Old March 9 2013, 07:06 AM   #3
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Re: Captain Solok

There is no point in being superior if you can't demonstrate it to the inferiors. Staying on Vulcan wouldn't let Solok demonstrate his superiority to the likes of Sisko.
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Old March 9 2013, 08:15 AM   #4
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Re: Captain Solok

DS9 had a problem writing likable Vulcans. They were all jerks or murderers.

ENT kind of had the same problem too.
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Old March 9 2013, 12:27 PM   #5
Seventh White Boomer
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Re: Captain Solok

Given that neither Solok or Chu'lak were meant to be likeable it isn't a problem at all. The only other Vulcan I can remember is the one from "The Maquis" and I can't remember her being likeable or unlikeable.
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Old March 9 2013, 12:45 PM   #6
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Re: Captain Solok

Dream wrote: View Post
DS9 had a problem writing likable Vulcans. They were all jerks or murderers.
Was there a single Vulcan in DS9 who was supposed to be likeable? I don't recall any.

There was an ambassador who was crummy to Bashir, a sniper, a jerk Baseball guy and his nameless posse...and a bunch of neutral ones, like Ben's old captain, Maquis lady, and a whole mess of other randoms.
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Old March 9 2013, 01:07 PM   #7
Dream
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Re: Captain Solok

Tosk wrote: View Post
Dream wrote: View Post
DS9 had a problem writing likable Vulcans. They were all jerks or murderers.
Was there a single Vulcan in DS9 who was supposed to be likeable? I don't recall any.

There was an ambassador who was crummy to Bashir, a sniper, a jerk Baseball guy and his nameless posse...and a bunch of neutral ones, like Ben's old captain, Maquis lady, and a whole mess of other randoms.
The way the Vulcans were depicted on DS9 felt incredibly negative to me.

TNG really didn't use Vulcans all that much, but when they did with Dr Selar and Ensign Taurik (Lower Decks) they were pretty cool. Also liked how the writers handled the return of Sarak and Spock.

I won't talk about TOS, VOY, or ENT since they all had a Vulcan as part of the main cast that they obviously tried to develop.
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Old March 9 2013, 01:40 PM   #8
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Re: Captain Solok

I think some fans take exception to Spock's race being portrayed as snooty, arrogant jerks in DS9, TNG and Enterprise; I liked this portrayal actually.
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Old March 9 2013, 02:51 PM   #9
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Re: Captain Solok

Solok was the most un-Vulcan Vulcan I have ever seen on Trek.

He derided humans for acting emotionally, yet Solok was obviously emotional himself. He gloated. He smirked. He rubbed people's faces in their supposed "inferiority". Those are all emotional reactions, and Vulcans - by definition - are not entitled to that.

No doubt the reason that the T'Kumbra had an all-Vulcan crew was because of Solok's racial prejudice and intolerance - he probably wouldn't ALLOW any non-Vulcans to serve on his ship. And who knows if the T'Kumbra would even answer a distress call from a human-crewed ship, or lift a proverbial finger to save anyone who was not Vulcan? Solok pretty much hated humans, and it showed.

Indeed, the very concept of 'superior' or 'inferior' races is illogical in the extreme.

Arrogance is an emotion, and Solok was the most arrogant of them all. He had no right to call himself Vulcan.
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Old March 9 2013, 03:57 PM   #10
C.E. Evans
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Re: Captain Solok

Although Vulcans suppress their emotions, they are not machines. Vulcans can engage in rivalries & competitions, and are even capable of put-me-downs like anyone else. They just do it in a way that piss most Humans off, IMO.

And that the T'Kumbra has an all-Vulcan crew may have more to do with the ship possibly being built and launched from Vulcan. There probably are a few Federation starships launched from Earth that have predominantly or even entirely Human crews.
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Old March 9 2013, 04:19 PM   #11
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Re: Captain Solok

C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
Vulcans can engage in rivalries & competitions, and are even capable of put-me-downs like anyone else. They just do it in a way that piss most Humans off, IMO
No Vulcan has ever acted as openly emotional and insulting as Solok. His emotional control, if he had any, was obviously faulty.
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Old March 9 2013, 04:22 PM   #12
C.E. Evans
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Re: Captain Solok

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
Vulcans can engage in rivalries & competitions, and are even capable of put-me-downs like anyone else. They just do it in a way that piss most Humans off, IMO
No Vulcan has ever acted as openly emotional and insulting as Solok. His emotional control, if he had any, was obviously faulty.
Not really. Solok seemed to be a Vulcan that enjoyed pushing the buttons of Humans like Sisko, but otherwise, he seemed in keeping with most Vulcans.
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Old March 9 2013, 04:25 PM   #13
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Re: Captain Solok

^ But like I said, "enjoying pushing the buttons" of anyone is an emotional pursuit - which Vulcans are not entitled to. If Solok is engaging in this, his control is slipping.

Although a personal rivalry between Solok and Sisko would explain a lot. I can't remember, were there ever many scenes between Solok and other human characters? If Solok doesn't hate other humans like he clearly hates Sisko, then I guess that's good.
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Old March 9 2013, 06:28 PM   #14
C.E. Evans
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Re: Captain Solok

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
^ But like I said, "enjoying pushing the buttons" of anyone is an emotional pursuit - which Vulcans are not entitled to. If Solok is engaging in this, his control is slipping.
Actually, Vulcans do have emotions. They simply suppress them. Vulcans have admitted to feeling grief, contentment, enjoyment, and even love. They just don't express them as much as Humans do.
Although a personal rivalry between Solok and Sisko would explain a lot.
And it seems to be the case. They've known each other for a very long time.
I can't remember, were there ever many scenes between Solok and other human characters? If Solok doesn't hate other humans like he clearly hates Sisko, then I guess that's good.
There's no indication that Solok hates Sisko, but he is very competitive with Sisko, and their rivalry began while they were cadets together at the Academy.
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Old March 9 2013, 06:32 PM   #15
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Re: Captain Solok

C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
Actually, Vulcans do have emotions. They simply suppress them.
Of course. But Solok is clearly failing in his suppression of emotions. His gloating, smirking, and anti-Human prejudice clearly demonstrate this.

Spock, half-human, is more Vulcan than Solok could ever claim to be.
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