Section 31...

2 of 10 · October 21 2008, 05:57 AM

In the episode of DS-9 "Inquisition" Slone mentions to Bashir that Section 31 has been part of the Federation since it's original charter. Does anyone recall any mention of Section 31 in any other Trek Series or Films.

It does make sence that the Federation would have it's own Internal Intelligence Branch. The Romulans have the Tal-Shair, and the Cardassians have the Obsidian Order. It would seem to me that it would be a bit nieve for the Federation to not have internal security of it own.

Nerys Ghemor · October 21 2008, 06:11 AM

I believe that there was never any mention of Section 31 prior to DS9. Any suggestions that they were there would be speculative at best. (Except VOY/ENT.)

Sheliak · October 21 2008, 07:44 AM

"Is there a John-Luck Pickard here?" Tapestry

dave_R_treker · October 21 2008, 03:18 PM

2 of 10 wrote:

In the episode of DS-9 "Inquisition" Slone mentions to Bashir that Section 31 has been part of the Federation since it's original charter. Does anyone recall any mention of Section 31 in any other Trek Series or Films.

It does make sence that the Federation would have it's own Internal Intelligence Branch. The Romulans have the Tal-Shair, and the Cardassians have the Obsidian Order. It would seem to me that it would be a bit nieve for the Federation to not have internal security of it own.

Nothing to my knowlage was mentioned prior to this episode. There are books that take place prior to this episode. And also the few episodes of Enterprise that had section 31 in it. But like I said, nothing prior to the actual airing of the episode.

Sector 7 · October 21 2008, 04:05 PM

No mention of it.... because...

USS Excelsior · October 21 2008, 04:29 PM

The episode "Divergence" in ENT features Section 31 with an agent named Harris that secretly gives Malcolm orders and ultimately lands him in the brig. Harris would also appear in "Demons".

T'Cal · October 21 2008, 04:47 PM

Nerys Dukat wrote:

I believe that there was never any mention of Section 31 prior to DS9. Any suggestions that they were there would be speculative at best. (Except VOY/ENT.)

Then let's speculate! I would guess that Adm. Pressman was working with if not a part of S31. While there was no indication that Shelby was, had she stuck around, I can easily imagine her as an operative of S31. Also, rather than kill off Yar, she would've made a fine member as well. Paris might've made a good one, too, reluctant like Bashir and Reed but capable.

The Wormhole · October 21 2008, 10:03 PM

The novels have had a field day with Section 31. Off the top of my head, they have said that the events of Insurrection and the TOS episode The Enterprise Incident were Section 31 operations.

Of course, novels are not canon.

All Seeing Eye · October 21 2008, 10:27 PM

What I always couldn't quite fathom was whether or not Admiral Ross was a Section 31 operative or whether he was just reluctantly sucked into that particular situation. (I'm talking about the episode where they go to Romulus.)

The Wormhole · October 21 2008, 10:40 PM

I was under the impression that he relunctantly allowed himself to be duped into becoming their shit-pawn.

LutherSloan · October 21 2008, 11:05 PM

The only canon mentions of S31 occur on Enterprise and DS9.

Ethros · October 21 2008, 11:19 PM

Been a while since I watched the relevant eps of ENT. Is the group actually referred to as "Section 31" in those eps?

USS Excelsior · October 22 2008, 12:33 AM

Ethros wrote:

Been a while since I watched the relevant eps of ENT. Is the group actually referred to as "Section 31" in those eps?

One time it was referenced as "Article 14, Section 31" to explain and justify their existence in what they were getting involved with and how.

Mr. Laser Beam · October 22 2008, 02:31 AM

The Wormhole wrote:

The novels have had a field day with Section 31. Off the top of my head, they have said that the events of Insurrection and the TOS episode The Enterprise Incident were Section 31 operations.

So was that whole thing in ST 6.

And Admiral Pressman was obviously Section 31 as well. It's not in a novel that I'm aware of, but...he just *acts* like Section 31.

2 of 10 wrote:

It does make sence that the Federation would have it's own Internal Intelligence Branch. The Romulans have the Tal-Shair, and the Cardassians have the Obsidian Order. It would seem to me that it would be a bit nieve for the Federation to not have internal security of it own.

They do, although I believe it's a part of Starfleet. The difference is, Starfleet Intelligence is an entirely legal, above-board, open organization, with government oversight. They must answer to the Starfleet chain of command, and to the Federation at large.

Section 31, on the other hand, answers TO NO ONE. Not even the Federation President! They are totally secret, totally amoral. Organizations like that have no business existing.

Sector 7 · October 22 2008, 03:58 AM

...but they do... even in the US. CIA, NSA.. and even more ominous groups DO exist.

October 21 2008, 05:57 AM	#1
2 of 10 Captain Location: Los Gatos, Ca	Section 31... In the episode of DS-9 "Inquisition" Slone mentions to Bashir that Section 31 has been part of the Federation since it's original charter. Does anyone recall any mention of Section 31 in any other Trek Series or Films. It does make sence that the Federation would have it's own Internal Intelligence Branch. The Romulans have the Tal-Shair, and the Cardassians have the Obsidian Order. It would seem to me that it would be a bit nieve for the Federation to not have internal security of it own.

October 21 2008, 06:11 AM	#2
Nerys Ghemor Vice Admiral Location: Cardăsa Terăm--Nerys Ghemor	Re: Section 31... I believe that there was never any mention of Section 31 prior to DS9. Any suggestions that they were there would be speculative at best. (Except VOY/ENT.) __________________ Are you a Cardassian fan, citizen? Prove your loyalty--check out my fanfic universe, Star Trek: Sigils and Unions. Or keep the faith on my AU Cardassia, Sigils and Unions: Catacombs of Oralius!

October 21 2008, 07:44 AM	#3
Sheliak Commodore Location: Beta Lyrae	Re: Section 31... "Is there a John-Luck Pickard here?" Tapestry

October 21 2008, 04:05 PM	#5
Sector 7 Rear Admiral Location: Obama's Achievements - http://obamaachievements.org/list	Re: Section 31... No mention of it.... because... Section 31 is a SECRET organization, duh! __________________ “The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little.” -FDR God gives us what we can handle, even if we don't believe it ourselves.

October 21 2008, 04:29 PM	#6
USS Excelsior Fleet Captain Location: Alpha Quadrant	Re: Section 31... The episode "Divergence" in ENT features Section 31 with an agent named Harris that secretly gives Malcolm orders and ultimately lands him in the brig. Harris would also appear in "Demons".

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October 21 2008, 10:03 PM	#8
The Wormhole Admiral	Re: Section 31... The novels have had a field day with Section 31. Off the top of my head, they have said that the events of Insurrection and the TOS episode The Enterprise Incident were Section 31 operations. Of course, novels are not canon. __________________ "Internet message boards aren't as funny today as they were ten years ago. I've stopped reading new posts." -The Simpsons 20th anniversary special.

October 21 2008, 10:27 PM	#9
All Seeing Eye Admiral Location: The Astral Light Realms	Re: Section 31... What I always couldn't quite fathom was whether or not Admiral Ross was a Section 31 operative or whether he was just reluctantly sucked into that particular situation. (I'm talking about the episode where they go to Romulus.)

October 21 2008, 10:40 PM	#10
The Wormhole Admiral	Re: Section 31... I was under the impression that he relunctantly allowed himself to be duped into becoming their shit-pawn. __________________ "Internet message boards aren't as funny today as they were ten years ago. I've stopped reading new posts." -The Simpsons 20th anniversary special.

October 21 2008, 11:05 PM	#11
LutherSloan Fleet Captain Location: Doing the Federation's dirty work	Re: Section 31... The only canon mentions of S31 occur on Enterprise and DS9. __________________ Deputy Director, Section 31 Expand Medicare for All!!

October 21 2008, 11:19 PM	#12
Ethros Vice Admiral Location: 1123 6536 5321	Re: Section 31... Been a while since I watched the relevant eps of ENT. Is the group actually referred to as "Section 31" in those eps?

October 22 2008, 03:58 AM	#15
Sector 7 Rear Admiral Location: Obama's Achievements - http://obamaachievements.org/list	Re: Section 31... ...but they do... even in the US. CIA, NSA.. and even more ominous groups DO exist. __________________ “The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little.” -FDR God gives us what we can handle, even if we don't believe it ourselves.