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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old June 28 2015, 11:39 AM   #1
Khan 2.0
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Location: earth...but when?...spock?
the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

just read a recent ST09/STID article and this part

16. In the story universe, the ship in the film is the second Constitution Class USS Enterprise, according to the back story worked out for the film, that was explored in the in-canon IDW/Bad Robot comics. When Starfleet (via Section 31?) discovered that the Klingons had reverse engineered technology from the Narada while Nero and his crew were on Rura Penthe, operatives smuggled out the technology. This is where the major changes in technology occur in the alternative timeline.

As the Klingon Defence Force replaced its D-7 Battle Cruisers with the vessels designated as Klingon Warbirds by Starfleet, Starleet started replacing its fleet too, with the original Constitution Class USS Enterprise having already completed its tour of duty with Captain Robert April (who faked his own death) , and a tour with Captain Pike (including the events of The Cage, perhaps) before being decommissioned and directly replaced with the Constitution (Mark 2?) class vessel seen in the film.

From a production point of view, when you think about it, there are a few pointers about the ship's design that suggest it may well be the second. The saucer section especially echoes that of the refit Enterprise and Enterprise-A from the first six original series cast Star Trek films, and indeed, the paint job using interference/pearlescent paint was specifically to mimic that of the refitted Enterprise in Star Trek: The Motion Picture.

Read more: http://www.denofgeek.com/movies/star...#ixzz3eLqo4A1p
I had no idea the JJprise was actually the 2nd Enterprise thus making it the Ent 'A'.
I haven't been keeping up to date with the Ongoing IDW series so im assuming it was revealed in those at some point (had read the Countdown to Darkness featuring April and his Ent but hadn't made the connection so maybe it was expanded in future issues?).

anyway in STB I hope they alter it abit so its looks even more like the Movies I-VI Ent (never liked the JJ nacelles much)

EDIT - Apologies, I see this has already been discussed in a previous thread (to which I posted in!)

Last edited by Khan 2.0; June 28 2015 at 12:42 PM.
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Old June 28 2015, 12:24 PM   #2
Starborn Dragon
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

No, it will only be lettered AFTER it is destroyed when the Duras sisters find the right frequency....

Which should teach you to ALWAYS check your visor.

Although with his new eyes in First Contact I'm not so sure they can just take them out like that now.
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Old June 28 2015, 02:13 PM   #3
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

First, comics are not canon, and anything established in them does not count in the movies. Indeed, STID contradicts the comics at every turn.

Now, while it is true that Countdown to Darkness does reveal another Enterprise in service some twenty years prior which does resemble the Constitution design and does have the registry NCC-1701, that does not make the "JJprise" the Enterprise A. The one thing to remember is that the IDW comics are remarkably sloppy and are loaded with mistakes. We've seen characters slap their chest insignia as though they were comm badges, 24th century LCARS displays are shockingly common and a whole load of other mistakes. Hell, there wasn't even any real consistency between Countdown to Darkness and the Ongoing comic line, since the Ongoing Scotty flashback includes a reference to Alexander Marcus being head of the Academy Admissions Board at the same time Countdown to Darkness has him serving as XO on the Enterprise under Captain Robert April. And that's ignoring that the ongoing features the Kelvin era uniforms being used in this era while Countdown to Darkness has the TOS-style uniforms being used.

Besides, there is nothing in the comics to indicate that Starfleet was reacting to intelligence that the Klingons were designing new ships based on Narada's technology. Indeed, when such ships show up in the comics, it's after STID and they are a surprise to everyone. I don't know where the article gets the idea these are the term "warbird" applies to these ships which are replacements for the D-7, Trek XI refers to the D-7s as "warbirds" in the Kobayashi Maru simulation.

In light of this, I'm inclined to think the NCC-1701 showing up on Robert April's Enterprise is nothing more than a mistake and nothing further should be read into it. I'm sure it had some other registry, likely with an idiotic leading zero. The Enterprise seen in the films is the first to have the NCC-1701 registry.

And before someone waltzes in here claiming Trek XI was supposed to open with the original 1701 commanded by Captain April destroyed by the Narada, please support this claim with a source other than IMDB.
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Old June 28 2015, 02:33 PM   #4
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

The 1701 in the new movies is "the" original Enterprise of it's universe, starting construction sometime prior to 2255 and launched 2258 rather than the 2245 of the prime universe.

The "power wall" in Marcus' office visible in the movie does show another ship exactly the same configuration as the JJ Enterprise but less than half the size, but lists it with a different class index code (the ships are labelled by X:123 or something like that rather than a class).

That one would be the size of the original Enterprise, but given the same specs, likely produced alongside the new one.

Marcus' model collection shows the same NX-01 to 1701 gap as the prime universe, no ship in between.
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Old June 28 2015, 06:57 PM   #5
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

Marcus does have an old style Constitution-class model hanging from his ceiling.
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Old June 28 2015, 07:06 PM   #6
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

I don't remember a JJPrise from the movie. When was that ship seen? Did it move out with the fleet headed for Vulcan, right before the Enterprise?
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Old June 28 2015, 07:28 PM   #7
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

Khan 2.0 wrote: View Post
...

EDIT - Apologies, I see this has already been discussed in a previous thread (to which I posted in!)
The previous thread in question:

Kirk Enterprise - the Enterprise(a)?
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Old June 28 2015, 07:32 PM   #8
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

Ithekro wrote: View Post
Marcus does have an old style Constitution-class model hanging from his ceiling.
The scene was deliberately removed from the movie so that doesn't count. It was also not the Enterprise which doesn't prove there was another one in any way.
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Old June 29 2015, 04:04 AM   #9
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

Chemahkuu wrote: View Post
Ithekro wrote: View Post
Marcus does have an old style Constitution-class model hanging from his ceiling.
The scene was deliberately removed from the movie so that doesn't count. It was also not the Enterprise which doesn't prove there was another one in any way.
Also, in the script it was meant to be the Abrams style Constitution. They just inserted the TOS style as an Easter egg for the scene after it was deleted.
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Old June 30 2015, 11:16 PM   #10
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
First, comics are not canon, and anything established in them does not count in the movies. Indeed, STID contradicts the comics at every turn.
I thought that Countdown was at least considered canon... I seem to recall Abrams saying around the release date that the story was part of his 'canon'.
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Old June 30 2015, 11:20 PM   #11
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

^The novels have been allowed to ignore it, so I guess not.
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Old June 30 2015, 11:25 PM   #12
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

Countdown is not, and never was, canon.
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Old July 1 2015, 12:03 AM   #13
M'Sharak
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

nx1701g wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
First, comics are not canon, and anything established in them does not count in the movies. Indeed, STID contradicts the comics at every turn.
I thought that Countdown was at least considered canon... I seem to recall Abrams saying around the release date that the story was part of his 'canon'.
In one interview, Orci was badgered into saying Countdown was canon, and then within a day walked it back. That's about as close as any of the tie-in comics ever came.

Edited to add:

This, quoting from the summaryof the Q&A Orci and Kurtzman did at TrekMovie:
Inconsistencies between film and "Countdown" can be explained that the comic is not canon
http://trekmovie.com/2009/05/22/orci...kmovie-fan-qa/

And quoting from the Q&A session itself, Orci's comment at #495
495. Boborci - May 18, 2009 103. cugel the clever – May 18, 2009
QUESTION:
In “Countdown”, the Narada effortlessly destroyed an armada of 24th century Klingon warships and disabled the Enterprise-E with one volley. However, in the film, the Kelvin (and early 23rd century ship) actually managed to exchange fire and survive for at least several minutes. It even managed to damage the Narada by ramming it. Logically, this makes no sense…. it should have been destroyed immediately (and Kirk&mother killed) given the firepower possessed by the Narada.
This is like the Merrimac surviving a firefight with the Bismark.
Care to explain this inconsistency?
—————-
(Answer) Easy. The comic is not canon?
http://trekmovie.com/2009/05/18/orci...tu-qa/#1828719
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Last edited by M'Sharak; July 1 2015 at 12:27 AM.
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Old July 1 2015, 02:59 AM   #14
The Wormhole
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

nx1701g wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
First, comics are not canon, and anything established in them does not count in the movies. Indeed, STID contradicts the comics at every turn.
I thought that Countdown was at least considered canon... I seem to recall Abrams saying around the release date that the story was part of his 'canon'.
Since the above post satisfactorily refutes this claim, I'll just add that Abrams himself has never talked about the comics, nor would he. He has nothing to do with them. The comics are, and indeed all tie-in material is supervised and handled by Orci, who as we have already established don't consider them to be canon.
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Old July 1 2015, 12:22 PM   #15
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Re: the JJprise is actually the Enterprise A?

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
^The novels have been allowed to ignore it, so I guess not.
Which novels?



The Wormhole wrote: View Post
Since the above post satisfactorily refutes this claim, I'll just add that Abrams himself has never talked about the comics, nor would he.
Note the question-mark "?" at the end of Orci's answer.
It isn't a definite answer.

Later interviews with Orci suggest, that he is not sure what is canon, and (unfortunately) did not want to be an arbiter of cannon.


In the audio commentary of Star Trek (XI) Abrams, Orci & Kurtzman talk about the comic, for a few sentences, but I don't remember what exactly they said. I think, they did not seem to treat it as definite canon though.


Countdown has some continuity issues, but I like to treat it as canon, until a big problem arises. So it is part of my head-canon.
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