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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old February 14 2013, 01:43 PM   #136
Set Harth
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

Royale with cheese?

Shazam! wrote:
Same thing #abramstrek
In that case, Nero apparently intended to destroy various Federation worlds. Soran was trying to get back to the Nexus.
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Old February 14 2013, 01:49 PM   #137
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

Oso Blanco wrote: View Post
anh165 wrote: View Post
It's not about success, it is about making trek only enjoyed by a few elite trekkies and alienating casual viewers and potentially new generation of trek fans.
Excuse me? TNG was a huge success back then, DS9 as well ... and even Voyager used to be very popular. Just because some over saturated people like you are suffering from "franchise fatigue" doesn't mean it was all a steaming pile of horseshit!

It is not fatigue, you can clearly gather from any episode of DS9/VOY/ENT, there is just that missing X-factor about the whole affair that is needed to really work on the big screen.

The casting, the characters, the attitude is all too uncharismatic and insipid for an exciting big screen movie.

While hardcore trekkies ignore all this and gets excited about the application of ablative armour or the latest technobabble phaser upgrade Voyager gets to defeat the borg of the week, the intelligent paying customer who invests 2-3 hours of their time to watch a film will not want it wasted on such TV filler.
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Old February 14 2013, 02:02 PM   #138
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

DS9 was not and never was a huge success, unless you restrict your attention to the first airing of the pilot episode.
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Old February 14 2013, 02:07 PM   #139
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

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If the generic Star Trek universe setting alone were enough, DS9, Voyager and Enterprise would have all been massive successes. But it was steadily diminishing returns until ENT's cancellation in '05.
Isn't that the case with most series'? Ratings always go down, the longer a series is on the air. And when Enterprise ended, TNG Trek had been on air for 18 years straight. There was no way to hold up the ratings for that long.
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Old February 14 2013, 02:11 PM   #140
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

Set Harth wrote: View Post
Royale with cheese?
Interestingly, no one on the planet has ever called it "Royale with cheese". We call it "Cheeseburger royal". Close enough.

And yeah. Star Trek.
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Old February 14 2013, 02:13 PM   #141
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

CorporalCaptain wrote: View Post
DS9 was not and never was a huge success, unless you restrict your attention to the first airing of the pilot episode.
Doesn't need to be if it earns my opinion of being the best of the bunch.
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Old February 14 2013, 02:18 PM   #142
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

anh165 wrote: View Post
The casting, the characters, the attitude is all too uncharismatic and insipid for an exciting big screen movie.
I don't see anything uncharismatic in neither the cast nor the characters of TNG/DS9. Maybe you should go watch it again?

And the original TOS cast had ten times the charisma of the nuTrek cast.

anh165 wrote: View Post
While hardcore trekkies ignore all this and gets excited about the application of ablative armour or the latest technobabble phaser upgrade Voyager gets to defeat the borg of the week
I guess that transwarp beaming bullshit doesn't count as technobabble?

anh165 wrote: View Post
the intelligent paying customer who invests 2-3 hours of their time to watch a film will not want it wasted on such TV filler.
Talking about intelligence here, eh? If you seriously think that nuTrek is more intelligent than old Trek, then there is nothing more to discuss.
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Old February 14 2013, 02:20 PM   #143
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

Oso Blanco wrote: View Post
I've been a fan of TOS since the mid-seventies. And I have been a fan of TNG era Trek ever since it premiered. I just think that rehashing TOS is kind of pointless, although I can live with the "alternate timeline" explanation. But I will never care for nuKirk or nuSpock the way I did for the original characters.
That's not the point.

With a TV series you have to want to see the same people do he same things week after week after week for years for the show to be considered a success. You need some sort of connection.

Movies just need you to be bored for a couple of hours. If enough people are bored you get a sequel and throw down some more disposable income a few years later.
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Old February 14 2013, 02:25 PM   #144
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

Oso Blanco wrote: View Post
I guess that transwarp beaming bullshit doesn't count as technobabble?
Are you refering to the scene where they're talking about grapefruits and dogs?
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Old February 14 2013, 02:30 PM   #145
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

Jeyl wrote: View Post
CorporalCaptain wrote: View Post
DS9 was not and never was a huge success, unless you restrict your attention to the first airing of the pilot episode.
Doesn't need to be if it earns my opinion of being the best of the bunch.
Regardless of how much some like DS9, it never had and never will command a big enough audience at the theater to justify making a DS9 motion picture, which—in context—was my point.
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Old February 14 2013, 02:34 PM   #146
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

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Talking about intelligence here, eh? If you seriously think that nuTrek is more intelligent than old Trek, then there is nothing more to discuss.
You are confused.

The majority - millions of paying viewers are likely to be rational and intelligent people, you can be sure that many appreciate movies that are made well and entertain without boring people to death with bland tech driven dialog and uncharismatic casting and performance.

This applies to all forms of arts, such as live theatre, music and dance.
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Old February 14 2013, 02:48 PM   #147
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

anh165 wrote: View Post
uncharismatic casting and performance.
And the nuTrek cast/performance is more charismatic? Excuse me, but the TOS/TNG era cast/performance was at least ten times more charismatic.

I guess the most charismatic character of STID will be the Cumberbatch character!
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Old February 14 2013, 02:57 PM   #148
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

In mass marketing, what matters is what appeals to the biggest audience. That's how charisma is measured in this context. That small minority with the strong opinions can't buy enough tickets fast enough to get catered to as much as they think they deserve. And, they can't seem to grasp that point, either.
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Old February 14 2013, 03:02 PM   #149
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

For what it's worth, as many here know, Paramount had a chance to try something "new" with Erik Jendresen's "Star Trek: The Beginning" script. It was supposed to be an "epic" trilogy of films filling in the blanks between ENT and TOS, including the Romulan-Earth war. One of the main characters was an ancestor of James T. Kirk. The idea was scrapped when they got J.J. Abrams to come aboard and heard his pitch.

OK, for the sake of argument, say Abrams had decided to revisit TNG characters instead of TOS characters.
-- He would've recast the crew of the Enterprise with new actors.
-- He would've updated and changed the look of the Enterprise and its techonolgy to reflect a 21st century vision of the 24th century and not a 1980s view.
-- To justify the big budget, the story would've fit in with the action-adventure genre that's popular with general audiences, today. (It is a commercial film, after all, and is after a wide audience.)
-- He'd have directed the movie in his fast-paced style.
-- He'd have violated some parts of "canon" in order to shed baggage or tell a better story. For example, maybe Picard never spent 23 years as captain of the Stargazer.

So, I guess that means the movie wouldn't have been TNG. And it certainly wouldn't have been "Star Trek". Right?
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Old February 14 2013, 03:19 PM   #150
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Re: What were they thinking? AVENGERS style TREK

Oso Blanco wrote: View Post
anh165 wrote: View Post
uncharismatic casting and performance.
And the nuTrek cast/performance is more charismatic? Excuse me, but the TOS/TNG era cast/performance was at least ten times more charismatic.
Not sure if serious. Especially in the case of The Next Generation.
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