RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 141,343
Posts: 5,502,335
Members: 25,118
Currently online: 704
Newest member: Ashanti

TrekToday headlines

IDW Publishing March 2015 Comics
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Paramount Star Trek 3 Expectations
By: T'Bonz on Dec 17

Star Trek #39 Sneak Peek
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Star Trek 3 Potential Director Shortlist
By: T'Bonz on Dec 16

Official Starships Collection Update
By: T'Bonz on Dec 15

Retro Review: Prodigal Daughter
By: Michelle on Dec 13

Sindicate Lager To Debut In The US Next Week
By: T'Bonz on Dec 12

Rumor Mill: Saldana Gives Birth
By: T'Bonz on Dec 12

New Line of Anovos Enterprise Uniforms
By: T'Bonz on Dec 11

Frakes: Sign Me Up!
By: T'Bonz on Dec 11


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > Star Trek - Original Series

Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old January 22 2013, 10:52 PM   #1
Ho Ho Homeier
Vice Admiral
 
Ho Ho Homeier's Avatar
 
Location: Melakon's place
Spock and Pike

Why didn't Spock mind-meld with injured Captain Pike in "The Menagerie"?

Mendez shows frustration that Pike can't reach out, no one can reach in, and that his mind is working normally.

In terms of production numbers, "Dagger of the Mind" was apparently filmed about 4 or 5 episodes before the "Menagerie" framing story, and originally aired 2 weeks earlier.

So it had been previously established that Spock had this ability.

Was it unmentioned only because they were uncertain of actual airdates in those days?
__________________
Curly: Oh, you hit Santa Claus. Just for that, no toys! --Wee Wee Monsieur (1938)
Ho Ho Homeier is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 22 2013, 10:55 PM   #2
Dale Sams
Fleet Captain
 
Dale Sams's Avatar
 
Re: Spock and Pike

What would he mind-meld about?
Dale Sams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 22 2013, 10:56 PM   #3
stationzebra
Ensign
 
Location: united federation of peanuts
Re: Spock and Pike

mind meld for what reason?
stationzebra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 22 2013, 11:09 PM   #4
Ho Ho Homeier
Vice Admiral
 
Ho Ho Homeier's Avatar
 
Location: Melakon's place
Re: Spock and Pike

Well, I was originally thinking they could figure out what Pike was agitated about, which frustrated Mendez. But since Spock himself was the cause of Pike's agitation, Spock could have simply lied about the results of the mindmeld, or even faked the whole thing.

Though it could have had other uses, since Pike couldn't even communicate whether he wanted someone to leave him the hell alone for five minutes.

It's rough not having the episodes in my library anymore, so I could think these things out before making a stupid post.
__________________
Curly: Oh, you hit Santa Claus. Just for that, no toys! --Wee Wee Monsieur (1938)
Ho Ho Homeier is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 22 2013, 11:11 PM   #5
plynch
Commodore
 
plynch's Avatar
 
Location: Outer Graceland
View plynch's Twitter Profile
Re: Spock and Pike

Melakon wrote: View Post
Though it could have had other uses, since Pike couldn't even communicate whether he wanted someone to leave him the hell alone for five minutes.
That was three "boops."
__________________
Author of Live Like Louis! Inspirational Stories from the Life of Louis Armstrong, http://livelikelouis.com
plynch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 22 2013, 11:42 PM   #6
Lance
Commodore
 
Lance's Avatar
 
Location: The Enterprise's Restroom
Re: Spock and Pike

Pike in a wheelchair seems harsher in hindsight. What surprised me is that the actor who played him had a speaking role as an Ensign in "Arena" later in the season, and without the aging make-up (and with dialogue) I reckon he was a reasonably close match for Jeff Hunter, so I don't see why the producers felt the need to cover him up at all. Mind you, I suppose they might have felt that the stock footage from The Cage would have made it much too obvious that it very evidently isn't the same guy, even though his voice is kind of similar (to my ears anyway).
Lance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 22 2013, 11:47 PM   #7
SchwEnt
Fleet Captain
 
Re: Spock and Pike

This post leads to me question why Pike didn't have a telepathic assistant/caregiver.

Telepathic species, Vulcans included, were known in TOS.
Wasn't there some kindly telepathic race that could have served as aide to Pike, contacting his mind and expressing his thoughts, helping Pike to connect to the outside world?

If medical technology wasn't able to overcome the obstacles, an empathic or telepathic species would be helpful to someone in Pike's predicament.
SchwEnt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 22 2013, 11:55 PM   #8
Ho Ho Homeier
Vice Admiral
 
Ho Ho Homeier's Avatar
 
Location: Melakon's place
Re: Spock and Pike

Maybe there are retconned Betazoids hanging around the starbase.
__________________
Curly: Oh, you hit Santa Claus. Just for that, no toys! --Wee Wee Monsieur (1938)
Ho Ho Homeier is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 23 2013, 01:10 AM   #9
BillJ
Admiral
 
BillJ's Avatar
 
Location: Covington, Ky.
View BillJ's Twitter Profile
Re: Spock and Pike

Melakon wrote: View Post

It's rough not having the episodes in my library anymore, so I could think these things out before making a stupid post.
Not stupid, I've been wondering the same thing myself for years.
__________________
"...the most elementary and valuable statement in science, the beginning of wisdom, is I do not know." - Lt. Commander Data, "Where Silence Has Lease"
BillJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 23 2013, 01:14 AM   #10
Redfern
Commodore
 
Redfern's Avatar
 
Location: Georgia, USA
Re: Spock and Pike

Pike's injuries and the nature of his chair crop up every so often and some interesting ideas get tossed around the threads. Someone suggested this chair was something of a "stop gap" to stabilize his condition before more sophisticated devices could be employed, like a more refined communications interface. Unfortunately, the way McCoy talks, there's no way to tie more directly into Pike's brain to allow that. And, if they could, it would "weaken" Spock's desperation to get Pike to Talos IV where he can live out his years "unfettered" by his injuries.

In short, if Pike could have talked, the "mystery" as to why Spock would seemingly go AWOL is negated. In short, it's the "McGuffin", a motivating factor for the narrative. Or, if one is cynical, it's a plot contrivance. Maybe the nature of the Delta ray damage made normal interfacing considerably more problematic.

Pulling Next Gen' into the equation, how long has the Federation had relations with Betazed? If, barely a century, there might not be too many of them around, yet (at the time of TOS). Vulcans? Well, later Spock was mind-melding with everything this side of the galactic core, but at the time of "Dagger of the Mind", Spock spoke of it in hushed tones, it being a rather private thing, almost as secretive as Pon Farr. So maybe Vulcans in general were not that willing to offer their services.

Sincerely,

Bill
__________________
Tempt the Hand of Fate and it'll give you the "finger"!

Freighter Tails: the Misadventures of Mzzkiti
Redfern is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 23 2013, 01:28 AM   #11
Ho Ho Homeier
Vice Admiral
 
Ho Ho Homeier's Avatar
 
Location: Melakon's place
Re: Spock and Pike

And Spock usually didn't do a mindmeld without explicit consent. Pike could have just boop-boop-a-dooped him.

__________________
Curly: Oh, you hit Santa Claus. Just for that, no toys! --Wee Wee Monsieur (1938)
Ho Ho Homeier is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 23 2013, 01:43 AM   #12
BillJ
Admiral
 
BillJ's Avatar
 
Location: Covington, Ky.
View BillJ's Twitter Profile
Re: Spock and Pike

Redfern wrote: View Post

In short, if Pike could have talked, the "mystery" as to why Spock would seemingly go AWOL is negated. In short, it's the "McGuffin", a motivating factor for the narrative. Or, if one is cynical, it's a plot contrivance. Maybe the nature of the Delta ray damage made normal interfacing considerably more problematic.
Out of universe, of course it's a plot contrivance. I think Melakon was likely trying to fit in the events of the episode with what else we've seen done.

As far as Next Gen goes, I thought Betazed was one of the Federations founding members? Though I could be mis-remembering that part. EDIT: Definitely wrong on this point. Memory Alpha gives a 2273 join date.
__________________
"...the most elementary and valuable statement in science, the beginning of wisdom, is I do not know." - Lt. Commander Data, "Where Silence Has Lease"
BillJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 23 2013, 02:58 AM   #13
Mister Atoz
Lieutenant
 
Mister Atoz's Avatar
 
Location: Los Angeles
Re: Spock and Pike

Melakon, you have brought up an excellent point and your analysis is valid.

Mr Atoz
Mister Atoz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 23 2013, 03:11 AM   #14
Ho Ho Homeier
Vice Admiral
 
Ho Ho Homeier's Avatar
 
Location: Melakon's place
Re: Spock and Pike

BillJ figured out what I was aiming for. I was trying to put it down fast while I had the thought, but my keyboard is a piece of crap with sticking keys and requires both hands to press the spacebar, and I can't type as fast as I used to (70wpm on a manual typewriter).
__________________
Curly: Oh, you hit Santa Claus. Just for that, no toys! --Wee Wee Monsieur (1938)
Ho Ho Homeier is online now   Reply With Quote
Old January 23 2013, 12:09 PM   #15
Redfern
Commodore
 
Redfern's Avatar
 
Location: Georgia, USA
Re: Spock and Pike

I tend to "weave" between "narrative universe" and "real life" production even if the thrust of the discussion is meant to be just one of those facers.

As for typing speed, don't apologize. Took typing classes nearly 30 years ago, but to this day, I'm still something of a "hunt and pecker". (Wait; that doesn't sound right!) An early childhood stroke left me with slightly diminished motor skills in my left arm. Thankfully I wasn't left slogging about like Igor for some mad scientist.

Sincerely,

Bill
__________________
Tempt the Hand of Fate and it'll give you the "finger"!

Freighter Tails: the Misadventures of Mzzkiti
Redfern is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:24 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.