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Old January 18 2013, 11:18 AM   #91
RoJoHen
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Re: Going Veggie

J. Allen wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post
Diet isn't one size fits all. If you find something that works, makes you feel better, lose weight, improve health issues then go for it!
Bingo! Yahtzee! Connect Four! That thing you say when you win Scrabble!






(this)
Triple Word Score!

Or something.

But yeah, totally true. There is no "one best diet" that works for everybody. Even some of the brightest nutritionalists in the world have conflicting views on what you should be eating.

You basically just have to live and try things and see what works for you. That's why I'll never give up meat. Hell, I get headaches and my skin breaks out if I go more than a couple days without beef! Forget weight loss; I get legitimately ill.
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Old January 18 2013, 01:17 PM   #92
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Re: Going Veggie

J. Allen wrote: View Post
Indeed. I'm finding that my energy levels have been boosted significantly just in the past few days. If this keeps up, I'm going to have to start jogging around the house just to burn some of it off!
How wonderful! Keep up the great work! It's wonderful you are already reaping benefits!

Sector 7 wrote: View Post
J.,

Part of the difficulty taking care of my mother, is that SHE still wants to eat that way. Last night was a breakthrough (I hope!). I explained to Mom (one... more... time...) why she needed to diet. [She has been bedridden for 4 years now. She refuses to diet, or even eat healthy, and has gained enough weight that our aide/friend and I are having back problems moving her.]

This time she seemed to be listening. Last week my lab results showed: diabetes under control, can stop taking cholesterol medications, etc..
"Be good, do good." You are the perfect example! This will benefit everyone involved!

thestrangequark wrote: View Post
Oh, man, Sector7, please don't take any offense or insult at this, because I don't mean it that way at all, but I personally find your attitude towards carb counting hilarious! It's just that I am a type 1 diabetic; I've been carb counting since I was 12, using carb counts to calculate boluses. The thought of carb counting as fun rather than "IF YOU DON'T DO THIS CORRECTLY, YOU WILL DIE IN YOUR SLEEP!" is so mind-bogglingly foreign to me that it made me laugh! It's awesome that you like it though, and that it's working so well for you. Very cool!
What a load for such a young person to have to carry through life. You are in my thoughts!
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Old January 18 2013, 03:50 PM   #93
thestrangequark
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Re: Going Veggie

^Thanks
Kelthaz wrote: View Post
thestrangequark wrote: View Post
That's complete, total, utter nonsense. It is very easy to eat a complete and healthy vegetarian diet!
Right ...

Look, I never said that it's impossible to adopt a vegetarian diet, but if you go into it without knowing what you're doing it's not going to improve your health. It's much easier (and requires very little planning) to eat a reasonably healthy diet that includes meat. The same can not be said of a vegetarian diet.

http://brown.edu/Student_Services/He...vegetarian.php

It is important for vegetarians to pay attention to these five categories in particular.
http://library.thinkquest.org/08aug/...an%20diet.html



http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/e...cle/002465.htm

Vitamins that may be lacking in a vegetarian diet include:
http://www.health.harvard.edu/newsle...g-a-vegetarian

Iron. Studies show that in Western countries, vegetarians tend to get the same amount of iron as meat eaters. But the iron in meat (especially red meat) is more readily absorbed than the kind found in plant foods, known as non-heme iron. The absorption of non-heme iron is enhanced by vitamin C and other acids found in fruits and vegetables, but it may be inhibited by the phytic acid in whole grains, beans, lentils, seeds, and nuts.
Recommendations just as detailed could be (and have been) made for meat-eaters. Do you take the time to sit and account for every micro nutrient in your diet? I highly doubt it, because it would take just as much time and energy as it would for a vegetarian to do so. In fact, the dietary guidelines from the sources you offered for non-vegetarians are just as lengthy:

Look at the guidelines for selecting meat and poultry from one of your own source websites:
The 2010 Dietary Guidelines for Americans recommends that most people cut back on meat and poultry. When you do eat them, aim for lean versions. Also, consider eating fish and seafood more often and in greater variety by choosing fish or seafood instead of some meat and poultry. Try a few meatless meals, too. That's not to say you can't enjoy meat and poultry if you choose. But keep it healthy by selecting lean cuts and using low-fat cooking methods.
http://www.mayoclinic.com/print/food...2/METHOD=print

And brown has something to say about non-veg diets too!
Another of Kelthaz's sources wrote:
Foods higher in saturated fat (animal fat, butter, whole-milk dairy products, coconut, palm, and palm kernel oils) when consumed frequently and in large amounts have been shown to increase the risk of cardiovascular disease. You can still include these foods in moderation as part of a healthy diet.
Whew, that was a long article! Eating non-vegetarian diets must be really hard and time-consuming!
http://brown.edu/Student_Services/He...idelines.php#1


See, I can Evidence too!
Science wrote:
In 1999 a metastudy combined data from five western countries and reported mortality ratios. This broad study showed fish eaters (pescetarians) had a the lowest ratio of 0.82, followed by vegetarians at 0.84. Occasional meat eaters were at 0.84 and vegans as well as regular meat eaters had a ratio of 1.0. (The lower the number the longer the lifespan.) – American Journal of Clinical Nutrition Vol 70 (3): 516S-524S – September 1999
http://skepchick.org/2011/11/ask-sur...atarian-diets/

So, mortality rates are higher among meat eaters, and lower the less meat you eat -- interesting!

Also, did you know that many disease rates for many diseases are statistically significantly lower than for meat-eaters? Some types of cancer and heart disease among the greatest in effect.
Check out the charts on this page (Yes, I know the source is biased, but the studies cited are from multiple, unbiased and unaffiliated institutions, and are presented in charts with no commentary except to highlight statistically significant results in red.)

Diets aren't one-size-fits-all. The evidence shows that vegetarians are just as healthy as, or healthier than meat eaters. Stop trying to police other people's eating habits, and get your facts straight before your roll your eyes at me. How rude!
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Old January 18 2013, 05:57 PM   #94
Emher
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Re: Going Veggie

Okay, here goes for the recipy! This is my own translation from Swedish, so some things might be...off.

Ingredients

4 tablespoons of butter
1 yellow onion, chopped
1 kilogram (or roughly 2 pounds) of tomatoes, diced (recipe also thought peeled and de-seeded, but F that shit)
1 laurel
4 fresh twigs of parsley
4 fresh twigs of basil
1,5 liters of vegetable bouillon (adjust for the fact juices from the tomatoes, recipe thought 2 liters)
1 tablespoon of ketchup
1-2 deciliters of cream (so that's like...a cup?)
salt and pepper
fresh basil for garnish

some bread to make into croutons if you wish



1. Melt the butter in a big pot. Add onions and fry at low heat for five minutes or u8ntil soft. Stir now and then. Add tomatoes, laurel, basil and parsley. Spice with salt and pepper and let simmer for 15 minutes or until the tomatoes have boiled together and most of the liquid have boiled away (again, I didn't wait foir this because I was compensating for the added liquid from the tomatoes). Stir now and then.

2. Increase to medium heat. Add the bouillon and let it come to a boil. Lower the hear, put on the lid and let simmer for 25 minutes.

3. Make the freaking croutons! Recipe had a very fancy dice them and fry them in olive oil thing, but I found that just doing some toast and cutting that into dices works just as well and takes way less time.

4. Remove the pot from the heat and let cool somewhat (again, didn't bother). Remove the herbs and stir the ketchup into the soup. Pour the soup into a mixer and mix it smooth (this is why I didn't bother, I just took my staffmixer and put it in the pot).

5. Pour back the soup into the pot (if removed) and heat it up. Stir the cream into the soup and let heat it up until warm all the way trough (didn't bother since warm already). Add salt and pepper to taste, if even necessary. Pour the soup into bowls. tare the fresh basil into bits and add as garnish, along with the croutons. Enjoy!



Here's a pic of it from my lunch today. This is the last bit of it. Was gone after lunch!

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Old January 18 2013, 06:04 PM   #95
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Re: Going Veggie

^That sounds (and looks) AMAZING! I am so going to try that, though I might replace the cream with half and half to make it at least a little lighter -- or I could puree cauliflower for a thickener. The translation is great, though one note -- we tend to refer to laurel as bay leaves here.
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Old January 18 2013, 07:10 PM   #96
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Re: Going Veggie

^ It really is delicious, I had it for dinner two days in a row and now today for lunch and I didn't get tired of it. The cream is mainly seasoning, Half and half should do fine.

As for the bay leaves, I actually googled that since I had no idea what they where called, and the source I found clearly said laurel was the US version. Damn site lied to me.
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Old January 18 2013, 07:13 PM   #97
J. Allen
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Re: Going Veggie

Thanks for the well wishes everyone who has wished them, and I wish them all back to you.

Emher, that recipe looks delicious, and I will have to try it. Also, I wish to extend to you a laurel, and hardy handshake.
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Old January 18 2013, 07:21 PM   #98
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Re: Going Veggie

Actually Umbellularia Californica (California Bay Luarel) is only one type of laurel and theer are a few different ones use in cooking--Bay leavings being the most common.

It is also, ever so slightly, different from the European Laurus Noblis--mostly due to the growing environment.
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Old January 18 2013, 07:39 PM   #99
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Re: Going Veggie

^Interesting! I didn't know that. Are bay and other kinds of laurel used differently in cooking?
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Old January 18 2013, 08:32 PM   #100
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Re: Going Veggie

I don't believe so. I think there are four or five verities around the world used in cooking. They have slight differences in aroma and appearance. The only ones I've ever seen are the two.

One was slightly longer and more slender (forget which). If I remember, the European was more pungent and a bit more woody while the California was a bit more peppery and bitter. The only other one I know of, is one that grows in Eastern Asia (Okinawa maybe?) which supposedly has the strongest flavor, and they use it in just about everything. I think there's also a different one found western South America.

I could be totally wrong though.

As far as the many other types, some don't really have a use (or no one's found one), but a lot of them are burned in incense, ground into salves, that sort of thing.
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Old January 18 2013, 08:54 PM   #101
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Re: Going Veggie

J. Allen wrote: View Post
Kelthaz wrote: View Post
If you're going vegetarian for health reasons, I sure hope you know what you're doing. If you're not completely committed or you don't have a specific diet planned out to satisfy all your body's nutritional needs you're going to end up horribly weak and sicker than you've ever been.

I've toyed with the idea of completely giving meat up, but I stick with meat for my health. You can live a healthy life as a vegetarian, but holy fuck is it going to be time-consuming and difficult. Personally, I'd say cutting down your meat consumption is a much better idea than completely giving it up if you want to improve your health, but to each their own.
True, it requires a bit more care, but so far, I haven't been hungry, I've had more energy than I did even a week ago, and my blood sugar and blood pressure are still lowering at a steady pace. Plus, I have taken great care to memorize daily nutritional requirements, adjusting as necessary. I don't usually half-ass anything.
Make sure you get complete proteins.
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Old January 18 2013, 08:59 PM   #102
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Re: Going Veggie

^The complete protein thing was debunked.
Whenever we eat, our body deposits amino acids into a storage bank, and then withdraws them whenever we need them. So, it’s no longer considered necessary to eat complementary proteins together at one sitting, to make complete protein. Your body does that automatically, from all the foods that you eat over the course of a day or so.
http://www.savvyvegetarian.com/artic...n-veg-diet.php
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Old January 18 2013, 09:17 PM   #103
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Re: Going Veggie

This thread needs more veggie porn


Pomegranate tabbouleh. Yum.

Been seeing quinoa mentioned in lot of recipes. Haven't tried that yet.
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Old January 18 2013, 09:37 PM   #104
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Re: Going Veggie

Sexy!

You know, I'm surprised Lady CZ hasn't chimed in on this thread yet.
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Old January 18 2013, 09:39 PM   #105
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Re: Going Veggie

Teya, TSQ is right about the complete protein thing being debunked.

I haven't been strictly veggie in years, but when I was, I never made a point of mixing "complementary" proteins, and I was healthy and energetic, and my lab results always looked great. Even now, the less meat and dairy I eat, the better I feel.

The only exception was after surgery, when I became severely anemic -- from blood loss, not diet -- and made a point of eating some meat for a while.
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