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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old December 28 2012, 05:04 PM   #91
SalvorHardin
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Re: Earth's Role

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
I think the Earth stuff happens in the first half of the movie, and it all ends on Qo'nos, since ...
I don't think it ends in Qo'nos. The way I understand it from the trailers, images and interviews
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Old December 28 2012, 05:16 PM   #92
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Re: Earth's Role

SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
I think the Earth stuff happens in the first half of the movie, and it all ends on Qo'nos, since ...
I don't think it ends in Qo'nos. The way I understand it from the trailers, images and interviews
OK, but


Of course, who really knows? (Other than Abrams and his group.)
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Old December 28 2012, 05:24 PM   #93
SalvorHardin
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Re: Earth's Role

Franklin wrote: View Post
SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
I think the Earth stuff happens in the first half of the movie, and it all ends on Qo'nos, since ...
I don't think it ends in Qo'nos. The way I understand it from the trailers, images and interviews
OK, but


Of course, who really knows? (Other than Abrams and his group.)

Well
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Old December 28 2012, 05:28 PM   #94
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Re: Earth's Role

SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
Franklin wrote: View Post
SalvorHardin wrote: View Post

I don't think it ends in Qo'nos. The way I understand it from the trailers, images and interviews
OK, but


Of course, who really knows? (Other than Abrams and his group.)

Well
Yeah. I could go with that.
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Old December 28 2012, 09:35 PM   #95
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Re: Earth's Role

Talosian wrote: View Post
Yeah, this is my least favorite aspect of new Star Trek. It's only been one film so far and hints about the next, but this quote seems to cement the geocentric nature of this version of the Federation and Starfleet...
The goecentric nature of the the Federation (and especially Starfleet) had been cemented long ago by Star Trek TV shows and the first ten movies. Just look at the overwhelmingly vast majority of humans on the Enterprise. Consider the location of Starfleet academy. Consider the location of the capital of the Federation.

Obviously in the Star Trek universe (even prior to Abrams involvement), Earth and Humanity are very, very important.
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Old December 28 2012, 10:49 PM   #96
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Re: Earth's Role

Shazam! wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post
One Earth-focused movie in a 46 year-old space franchise isn't going to hurt at all.
Star Trek TMP? Star Trek IV? Star Trek: First Contact? Star Trek: Nemesis? Star Trek XI?
I suppose I should have said Future Earth focused. TMP has what, one scene set on Earth and a handful in Earth orbit? Trek IV is mostly on Earth in 1986 with a handful of scenes set on 23rd century Earth. First Contact is mostly on 21st century Earth, with a few scenes in 24th century Earth orbit, and even then it's briefly an alternate timeline. Nemesis has one scene on Earth and one in Earth orbit. XI you have a point, but even that has plenty of scenes not on Earth.
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Old December 29 2012, 01:33 PM   #97
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Re: Earth's Role

Jackson_Roykirk wrote: View Post
Talosian wrote: View Post
Yeah, this is my least favorite aspect of new Star Trek. It's only been one film so far and hints about the next, but this quote seems to cement the geocentric nature of this version of the Federation and Starfleet...
The goecentric nature of the the Federation (and especially Starfleet) had been cemented long ago by Star Trek TV shows and the first ten movies. Just look at the overwhelmingly vast majority of humans on the Enterprise. Consider the location of Starfleet academy. Consider the location of the capital of the Federation.

Obviously in the Star Trek universe (even prior to Abrams involvement), Earth and Humanity are very, very important.
Indeed. It actually made very little sense post-TOS. In TOS, Kirk was clearly in command of an Earth starship but as the franchise grew and the Federation became more and more prominent, the Earth-centric nature of Starfleet was odd indeed. For all the hundreds of member races in the Federation, was Earth the only one that built starships? Why wasn't Starfleet comprised of Vulcan, Andorian and other alien-built ships? Why were all the top Starfleet brass invariably human?

Just one more reason why the continuity and canon were't worth a hill of spit.
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Old December 29 2012, 01:43 PM   #98
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: Earth's Role

The Stig wrote: View Post
Jackson_Roykirk wrote: View Post
Talosian wrote: View Post
Yeah, this is my least favorite aspect of new Star Trek. It's only been one film so far and hints about the next, but this quote seems to cement the geocentric nature of this version of the Federation and Starfleet...
The goecentric nature of the the Federation (and especially Starfleet) had been cemented long ago by Star Trek TV shows and the first ten movies. Just look at the overwhelmingly vast majority of humans on the Enterprise. Consider the location of Starfleet academy. Consider the location of the capital of the Federation.

Obviously in the Star Trek universe (even prior to Abrams involvement), Earth and Humanity are very, very important.
Indeed. It actually made very little sense post-TOS. In TOS, Kirk was clearly in command of an Earth starship but as the franchise grew and the Federation became more and more prominent, the Earth-centric nature of Starfleet was odd indeed. For all the hundreds of member races in the Federation, was Earth the only one that built starships? Why wasn't Starfleet comprised of Vulcan, Andorian and other alien-built ships? Why were all the top Starfleet brass invariably human?

Just one more reason why the continuity and canon were't worth a hill of spit.
Actually Enterprise did a reasonably good job of showing that Trek ships weren't all Earth designed. Andorian ships had the TOS- style helm/nav stations, energy shields and the blue phasers. Vulcan ships had the TOS movie-style computer graphics. The Enterprise NX-01 had the exterior shape, nacelles and (by the end) TOS series bridge graphics.
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Old December 29 2012, 02:01 PM   #99
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Re: Earth's Role

My concern is that ST09 already utterly destroyed Roddenberry’s vision of 23rd-century humans and Earth!

JJ and crew ignored everything about Roddenberry's vision of Earth and humanity. What was ignored?

Well, here's a list for starters...

- "New Humans" who are willing to meld their own identities and individuality into a group consciousness versus rare "Primitives" like Kirk who still follow ancient customs like taking the last name of your father. In fact, using the father's surname is quite rare among most humans.
- Humanity moving beyond primitive monogamy and becoming swingers.
- James Kirk was named for his mother’s “first love instructor,” not his grandfather!
- George Kirk as just another of his mother's love instructors.
- Kirk's academy class had less "intellectual agility" than previous classes.
- The Federation installing cybernetic implants (senceivers) in Starfleet member's heads.

Now don't go screaming "not canon!" because this is the word of Trek's creator himself, as bestowed upon us in the official movie tie-in of the pinnacle of Star Trek at its absolute purest: Star Trek: The Motion Picture!

And consider the description of Earth from the 1977 draft of Phase II/TMP:

San Francisco -- a few familiar landmarks still recognizable. A beautiful summer day. Families romp and play in a parkland area. Animals, unafraid, wander about. Tasteful adult nudity here and there.

Admiral James T. Kirk, in civilian attire, strolls through the park, looking for someone. Ahead of him he spots two teenagers and their pet cheetahs. A man, his back to Kirk, gives first-aid to the wounded paw of one of the cheetahs. Kirk smiles, moves forward.

It is Leonard "Bones" McCoy (known to the locals as the "animal doctor"). He and Kirk greet each other warmly, but warily.
Where was this in the new film?

Everyone in the new trailer looks clothed, and there are no wild animals wandering about!
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Old December 29 2012, 02:07 PM   #100
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Re: Earth's Role

SonicRanger wrote: View Post
Now don't go screaming "not canon!" because this is the word of Trek's creator himself, as bestowed upon us in the official movie tie-in of the pinnacle of Star Trek at its absolute purest: Star Trek: The Motion Picture!
Which Roddenberry himself declared non-canon (the novelization, that is, not the movie). Although, I will admit, that novelization really does offer some interesting insights into Roddenberry's mindset.
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Old December 29 2012, 02:22 PM   #101
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Re: Earth's Role

SonicRanger wrote: View Post

And consider the description of Earth from the 1977 draft of Phase II/TMP:

San Francisco -- a few familiar landmarks still recognizable. A beautiful summer day. Families romp and play in a parkland area. Animals, unafraid, wander about. Tasteful adult nudity here and there.

Admiral James T. Kirk, in civilian attire, strolls through the park, looking for someone. Ahead of him he spots two teenagers and their pet cheetahs. A man, his back to Kirk, gives first-aid to the wounded paw of one of the cheetahs. Kirk smiles, moves forward.

It is Leonard "Bones" McCoy (known to the locals as the "animal doctor"). He and Kirk greet each other warmly, but warily.
Where was this in the new film?

Everyone in the new trailer looks clothed, and there are no wild animals wandering about!

Nudity in my Trek? You better be kidding.
That kind of blasphemy will never be tolerated. I would personally make sure such an abomination never reaches theaters.
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Old December 29 2012, 02:25 PM   #102
marksound
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Re: Earth's Role

SonicRanger wrote: View Post
My concern is that ST09 already utterly destroyed Roddenberry’s vision of 23rd-century humans and Earth!

JJ and crew ignored everything about Roddenberry's vision of Earth and humanity. What was ignored?

Well, here's a list for starters...

- "New Humans" who are willing to meld their own identities and individuality into a group consciousness versus rare "Primitives" like Kirk who still follow ancient customs like taking the last name of your father. In fact, using the father's surname is quite rare among most humans.
- Humanity moving beyond primitive monogamy and becoming swingers.
- James Kirk was named for his mother’s “first love instructor,” not his grandfather!
- George Kirk as just another of his mother's love instructors.
- Kirk's academy class had less "intellectual agility" than previous classes.
- The Federation installing cybernetic implants (senceivers) in Starfleet member's heads.

Now don't go screaming "not canon!" because this is the word of Trek's creator himself, as bestowed upon us in the official movie tie-in of the pinnacle of Star Trek at its absolute purest: Star Trek: The Motion Picture!

And consider the description of Earth from the 1977 draft of Phase II/TMP:

San Francisco -- a few familiar landmarks still recognizable. A beautiful summer day. Families romp and play in a parkland area. Animals, unafraid, wander about. Tasteful adult nudity here and there.

Admiral James T. Kirk, in civilian attire, strolls through the park, looking for someone. Ahead of him he spots two teenagers and their pet cheetahs. A man, his back to Kirk, gives first-aid to the wounded paw of one of the cheetahs. Kirk smiles, moves forward.

It is Leonard "Bones" McCoy (known to the locals as the "animal doctor"). He and Kirk greet each other warmly, but warily.
Where was this in the new film?

Everyone in the new trailer looks clothed, and there are no wild animals wandering about!
Yeah, none of that ever really made it onscreen. Not even when GR was running the show. So yeah, no.
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Old December 29 2012, 02:28 PM   #103
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: Earth's Role

Naked Kirk in a park with teenage boys and a cheetah? This can't possibly go wrong!
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Old December 29 2012, 02:33 PM   #104
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Re: Earth's Role

Gene Roddenberry was a visionary for creating Star Trek, but he had an... "interesting" preoccupation with sex from all reports.
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Old December 29 2012, 02:34 PM   #105
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Re: Earth's Role

But the first thing Roddenberry did with a movie budget is redesign the Enterprise and show Earth... and he wanted Earth to have naked people who are telepathically linked and wild animals as pets.
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