TOS questions

[Borjis]

AtoZ wrote:

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I concur with the 10 posters before me. Can somebody tell me why a ship counselor sat on the bridge next to the captain? That never made any sense to me at all.

Carry over from Ilia in Phase II.

[Silvercrest]

Noname Given wrote:

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Yet in TNG it appears the 'Prime Directive' sudenly meant no interference whatsoever in any world not a ,member of the UFP - and it was ridiculous (IMO) to hear Picard say "Well, we can't be involved in another (space faring) culture's internal affairs..." EVEN WHEN it was clear inaction on Picard's part would have a VERY detrimental effect on Star Fleet. <---- Sorry, but I thought part of Star Fleet's mission WAS Federation protection and defense - so Picard (IMO) wasn't much of a Captain or a Federation citizen in that aspect.

Taken to its logical extreme, the TNG Prime Directive should prevent Starfleet from defending itself from attack by the Klingons or another warlike race. It's a natural part of their culture to attack other people, so for Starfleet to shoot back would, y'know, interfere with that.

Right?

[Nerys Myk]

Borjis wrote:

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Carry over from Ilia in Phase II.

Ilia was a navigator, where else should she be?

[T'Girl]

AtoZ wrote:

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Can somebody tell me why a ship counselor sat on the bridge next to the captain? That never made any sense to me at all.

My impression is that Troi was on the bridge solely because of her empathic abilities, and not that she was a councilor.

Picard did remark once that it was rare that a ship's councilor would be a Betazed, and we never saw (small sampling) another Starfleet vessel with the councilor right on the bridge. There was a councilor on DS9, but they were not part of the command staff, we never saw one on DS9 until Erza joined the station. Voyager had no third seat on the bridge for one, and there was no obvious councilor prior to the ship being pulled into the delta quad.

[Carcazoid]

Counselor.

[T'Girl]

Meh, sounds the same.

[Carcazoid]

Merry Christmas wrote:

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Meh, sounds the same.

Sounds the same but the meaning is different.

Trekkies (-ers, -ors, -ists, whatever) are supposed to be the intellligent ones. If you want to be it, be it. Just sayin'.

[gottacook]

TNG adopted the suggestion made by "Tribbles" writer David Gerrold in his 1973 book The World of Star Trek that any new series should feature an "away team" (he'd used the term "contact team") because the captain of a starship should not be endangering himself by routinely leading landing parties as Kirk did.

Another major difference, of course, was that Picard didn't repeatedly get involved with alien women (or female androids), as Kirk had.

In those two important respects (and probably some others) TNG was simply more sensible - which could be said to work against it as an entertainment, as some here have suggested.

[Nerys Myk]

Merry Christmas wrote:

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Meh, sounds the same.

But you're writing.

[Captain Rob]

Borjis wrote:

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except the case of Suzie Plakson...she was hotter looking WITH the makeup. Klingon or Vulcan.

That's only because Suzie's best assets weren't on her face. Voice acting ability excepted.

[Forbin]

Borjis wrote:

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except the case of Suzie Plakson...she was hotter looking WITH the makeup. Klingon or Vulcan.

Hm. Maybe. I met her in person at a Creation con, and she's pretty much gorgeous.

btw - saw "Devil's Due" last night on BBC America, with a classic example of my above complaint. Marta DuBois, who just exudes sexiness and classic beauty, with goofy frickin' ridges on her forehead. OY!

[AtoZ]

Given the potential for battle and ultimate demise, I find it highly strange that there would be children on a starship, especially given the oft sensitive nature of their mission. I know conceptually there may have been reasons for it, to me it just seemed silly.

As for the ships counselor on the bridge, situated beside the Captain, it has always seemed to me to be ridiculous and contrived. But then again it was made in the 80's, and they did allow a kid at the wheel when in reality he should have been nowhere near the bridge, no matter how good we ultimately may have felt about him.

Having pressed those views, I liked TNG for the most part. When they were "on", they were really on.

[Delta Vega]

Main difference for me was that Star Trek was great


And The Next Generation was shit

[BillJ]

Delta Vega wrote:

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Main difference for me was that Star Trek was great


And The Next Generation was shit

I love TOS. I love TNG.

[Lance]

AtoZ wrote:

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I concur with the 10 posters before me. Can somebody tell me why a ship counselor sat on the bridge next to the captain? That never made any sense to me at all. Or that there were kids on the ship.

There is a school of thought which says that Deanna's role on the crew is actually one of the most important, which is why she gets to sit there with the Captain and the Executive Officer. Look at the number of times Starfleet crews went mad in TOS (Captain Tracey and Commodore Decker being cases that spring immediately to mind, but there were others). The responsibilities of command were such that there was a great emotional turmoil that could engulf the commander, and often times (as with Decker) they could make decisions which were lacking in good judgement. The Counsellor's role is arguably to keep tabs on the Captain's state of mind, and certainly Deanna openly questions Picard on more than a few occasions (sometimes in the Ready Room, sometimes very publically on the bridge). Even as late as Nemesis Picard still declares that a ship's counsellor is a statutory requirement for the effective running of a starfleet vessel, and that just because Troi is running off to the Titan doesn't mean she won't have a replacement.

The role which Troi plays in the character dynamic of TNG was basically played by Doctor McCoy in TOS. But McCoy isn't nominally a bridge officer (although he spends more than enough time hanging around up there -- hasn't he got a job to do in sickbay or something? ), so he isn't theoretically going to always be there beside the Captain in the most high stress situations. Troi is right there all the time.