RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 138,382
Posts: 5,357,277
Members: 24,628
Currently online: 425
Newest member: suryaprabu02

TrekToday headlines

The Gene Roddenberry Project Kickstarter
By: T'Bonz on Jul 30

Moore: No Deep Space Nine Regrets
By: T'Bonz on Jul 30

Pegg Star Wars Rumor
By: T'Bonz on Jul 30

Borg Cube Fridge
By: T'Bonz on Jul 29

Free Enterprise Kickstarter
By: T'Bonz on Jul 29

Siddig To Join Game Of Thrones
By: T'Bonz on Jul 29

Sci-Fried To Release New Album
By: T'Bonz on Jul 28

Star Trek/Planet of the Apes Crossover
By: T'Bonz on Jul 28

Star Trek into Darkness Soundtrack
By: T'Bonz on Jul 28

Horse 1, Shatner 0
By: T'Bonz on Jul 28


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > Star Trek - Original Series

Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old December 18 2012, 06:23 PM   #1
King Daniel Into Darkness
Admiral
 
King Daniel Into Darkness's Avatar
 
Location: England again
Garth's uniform

I know Garth is nucking futs when we meet him, but under his robe and crown and mismatched boots, what's the uniform he's wearing? Is it supposed to be an older or alternate Starfleet uniform? It looks vaguely Babylon 5-ish.
__________________
Star Trek Imponderables, fun mashups of Trek's biggest continuity errors! Ep1, Ep2 and Ep3
King Daniel Into Darkness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 18 2012, 08:13 PM   #2
Nerys Myk
Fleet Admiral
 
Nerys Myk's Avatar
 
Location: House of Kang, now with ridges
Re: Garth's uniform

It looks vaguely Enterpriseish.

According to MA it's a reuse of a costume used in Journey to Babel and the Galileo Seven.
__________________
The boring one, the one with Khan, the one where Spock returns, the one with whales, the dumb one, the last one, the one with Kirk, the one with the Borg, the stupid one, the bad one, the new one, the other one with Khan.
Nerys Myk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 18 2012, 08:43 PM   #3
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: Garth's uniform

Yup, it's the same outfit Commissioner Ferris wore in "Galileo Seven." In "Babel" it was just worn by some extra in the background.

So it would seem to be a civilian garment, perhaps the 2260s version of a business suit, rather than any kind of uniform.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 18 2012, 09:21 PM   #4
King Daniel Into Darkness
Admiral
 
King Daniel Into Darkness's Avatar
 
Location: England again
Re: Garth's uniform

Yes! Thanks, all

It is indeed the suit first seen in "The Galileo Seven"
__________________
Star Trek Imponderables, fun mashups of Trek's biggest continuity errors! Ep1, Ep2 and Ep3
King Daniel Into Darkness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 18 2012, 09:26 PM   #5
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: Garth's uniform

Hey, that's got a little cape on it, hasn't it? So maybe something fancier than a business suit.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 18 2012, 09:32 PM   #6
ChristopherPike
Rear Admiral
 
ChristopherPike's Avatar
 
Re: Garth's uniform

If Garth is basically a 23rd Century Napoleon, again stuck on Elba, then it would make more sense that it's an old period Starfleet dress uniform.

His look is certainly no more bonkers than having clothes brushes for epaulettes.



Pointing out that a Federation commissioner wore something similar, isn't really much of an indication of intent with TOS. They reused costumes frequently without much thought to an overall continuity. Colonel Green, Zefram Cochrane, aliens from the Andromeda and mining colony personal all wore flight/jumpsuits for instance... despite being many centuries between those characters. Looking at those mining overalls for instance, they have a touch of retroactive continuity forward in time from Enterprise, as a potential uniform that's been discarded and become "spaceage army surplus".
__________________
STAR TREK: ENTERPRISE Season 5 on Netflix Facebook page

Last edited by ChristopherPike; December 18 2012 at 09:51 PM.
ChristopherPike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 18 2012, 10:17 PM   #7
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: Garth's uniform

On the other hand, if it is high-end civilian formal wear of the period, it's not unreasonable that Garth might wear it as part of his "imperial" ensemble. It's true that TOS did reuse various items without regard for continuity, but in cases where it actually works to assume continuity, why not?
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 18 2012, 10:32 PM   #8
ChristopherPike
Rear Admiral
 
ChristopherPike's Avatar
 
Re: Garth's uniform

Surely whether it's Ferris, some guy on his way to Babel or a Fleet Captain... they're all super formal attire for Federation big wigs.

Commissioners and Ambassadors who even might be high ranking ex-Starfleet like Garth or possibly even still current, on temporary assignment.

That guy who turned out to be Redjac wore a more basic business suit... and of course, Samuel Cogley.

If you don't think it's some pre-Cage era style uniform, then that's that. At the end of the day, there's isn't much continuity between the pilot uniforms and the Kelvin ones, or Enterprise for matter. Nothing to indicate how TOS became TMP, or from there to TWOK. Anykind of visual clues how one evolved into the other, never seemed to have much rhyme or reason. Some badges and piping carried over, which could denote rank, but not as clear cut as in the 24th Century.

Last edited by ChristopherPike; December 18 2012 at 10:44 PM.
ChristopherPike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 18 2012, 10:42 PM   #9
Spike730
Captain
 
Spike730's Avatar
 
Location: Austria
Re: Garth's uniform

Nothing about this outfit screams uniform to me.
Spike730 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 18 2012, 11:24 PM   #10
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: Garth's uniform

ChristopherPike wrote: View Post
Commissioners and Ambassadors who even might be high ranking ex-Starfleet like Garth or possibly even still current, on temporary assignment.
But why does everything have to be Starfleet all the time? Realistically, civilians should hugely outnumber Starfleet officers. Our view of the Trek universe has always been filtered through Starfleet, and that can create the illusion that Starfleet is the entire Federation, but realistically, it should be just one finite organization that watches over the trillions of non-military people who live on the Federation's many worlds. The odds of any randomly chosen person in the Federation being a member of Starfleet should thus be extremely low. That's just common sense, or should be.

Besides, there's nothing about Ferris's attire that even suggests Starfleet. It's got no insignias or markings of any kind, so it can't be a military uniform. It looks like civilian wear, and it's worn by a member of the civilian government. (If Ferris had any military standing, he wouldn't have needed to invoke a special regulation under "galactic emergency procedures" in order to prove his authority to give Kirk orders.) There's no reason to doubt it was intended as civilian attire.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 19 2012, 12:32 AM   #11
ChristopherPike
Rear Admiral
 
ChristopherPike's Avatar
 
Re: Garth's uniform

Duplicate post for some reason.
ChristopherPike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 19 2012, 12:32 AM   #12
ChristopherPike
Rear Admiral
 
ChristopherPike's Avatar
 
Re: Garth's uniform

And yet for Garth's costume to fully work as that well-worn comedic image of Napoleon madness, this would have to been thought of as a uniform.



Look he's even decorated. Having him strut around, believing in his legendary Starfleet status, even more eccentrically topped off with a fur coat, simply wouldn't be as funny if it were civillian wear!

__________________
STAR TREK: ENTERPRISE Season 5 on Netflix Facebook page

Last edited by ChristopherPike; December 19 2012 at 12:44 AM.
ChristopherPike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 19 2012, 12:58 AM   #13
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: Garth's uniform

I'm willing to concede that Garth's outfit may have been a repurposing. What I disagree with is the completely unsubstantiated speculation that Commissioner Ferris was somehow in Starfleet.

If it were just what Garth were wearing in the episode proper, I could believe he cobbled it together from what was available on Elba II. Note that it's just the jacket without the shirt underneath that Ferris had. The problem is the photo, which does seem to be treating it as a dress uniform. But clearly they just stuck him in front of a door while he was in costume and took a picture (and reversed it when they matted it in) without putting any more care or thought into it. I'm inclined to discount the photo and assume he was actually meant to be in a Starfleet dress uniform there. Those medals look too haphazard and garish to be the real thing.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 19 2012, 02:43 AM   #14
GSchnitzer
Co-Executive Producer
 
GSchnitzer's Avatar
 
Location: Gaithersburg, Maryland, USA, Terra
Send a message via AIM to GSchnitzer Send a message via Windows Live Messenger to GSchnitzer Send a message via Yahoo to GSchnitzer
Re: Garth's uniform

Well, it's not just Commissioner Ferris' costume, but Anton Karidian's, too.



In "Whom Gods Destroy," Garth of Izar wore the "smoking jacket" that Anton Karidian wore in "The Conscience of the King." It's a light green/dark green sort of paisley pattern with fur at the cuffs. Garth always wore one arm in the sleeve but the other side was simply draped over his shoulder like a cape. It made him look a bit "off balance." For Garth, the inside of this coat/cape/frock thing was lined with gold lame.

We can't see if the lame was present when Karidian wore it. Here's Karidian:



Garth wore this cape/coat/frock thing over the jacket that was worn by Commisioner Ferris in "The Galileo Seven." Ferris also wore some kind of cravate around his neck that Garth didn't wear; Garth just had an open collar.



Ferris' coat also crops up in "Journey to Babel:"



And, of course, Garth had boots of two mismatched colors (his left boot was gold and his right boot was metallic blue)--to reinforce the "off balance" look. Here he is in all his off-kilter, "How Not to Dress" splendor: left arm in the sleeve, right side worn like a cape and mismatched boots:



Also, although it's hard to make out, John Gill wears the Commissioner Ferris costume in his photo on the monitor above Spock's station.
__________________
Greg Schnitzer
Co-Executive Producer
Star Trek Phase II
http://www.startrekphase2.com
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3348883/
GSchnitzer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 19 2012, 02:50 AM   #15
TOSalltheway
Lieutenant Commander
 
Re: Garth's uniform

Colonel Green, Zefram Cochrane, aliens from the Andromeda and mining colony personal all wore flight/jumpsuits for instance.

Well...Colonel Green and Cohrane are from around the same time. The Andromedans copied our looks, they could have copied the clothing too. Maybe they were on that planet waiting three hundred years before Kirk and crew found them?
TOSalltheway is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:30 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.