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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old December 16 2012, 11:34 PM   #16
SalvorHardin
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

Timo wrote: View Post
Anyone else suddenly really want to know what happened to Nibiru Prime?
Supposedly, nuKirk saves a community from a volcanic eruption. I can't see why that would be necessary, because the community appears to possess clothing, weaponry and even some sort of holy scrolls. It's not just an isolated bunch, then, but part of a larger whole that has certainly had enough time to proliferate across the planet. Stopping one volcano from offing one village doesn't sound like a worthwhile effort by any standard; had Pike opted not to do it, Nibiru history might be different (since they were already into their historical era, apparently!), but not drastically so. NuKirk would need clairvoyance to decide that this particular community warranted saving...

OTOH, if all that was left of the Nibiru was located within the kill zone of the volcano, efforts to save them appear fairly pointless.

Timo Saloniemi
So, if their number is small or they have managed to proliferate across the planet and one village won't be missed, Kirk should just tell them to go f' themselves and die because they are not worth the effort?

As for the volcano, it depends what kind of volcano it is and in what kind of geologic period the planet is.
It could be powerful enough to wipe their civilization out with tsunamis, volcanic winter etc
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Old December 16 2012, 11:46 PM   #17
Verteron
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

Has anyone considered that in the light of the events of the first film, the Federation may have decided to reinterpret the Prime Directive to a less 'hands-off' approach, with regards to natural disasters?

I know it doesn't fit 100%, but you can imagine that fallout from the Romulan/Vulcan incident led to a lot of panicking in the Federation Council, who decided to help out planets/polites with natural disasters rather than ignore them, lest they have any more of their own worlds blown up by annoyed people...
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Old December 17 2012, 12:03 AM   #18
BillJ
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

Verteron wrote: View Post
Has anyone considered that in the light of the events of the first film, the Federation may have decided to reinterpret the Prime Directive to a less 'hands-off' approach, with regards to natural disasters?
What we see in the nine minutes actually matches up with the TOS version of the Prime Directive. So there's really no need to try to explain it.
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Old December 17 2012, 12:09 AM   #19
Hartzilla2007
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
We know that Kirk gets in some kind of trouble with Pike which could be because of a PD violation.
So either Kirk is there without Starfleet knowing about it, which I doubt or they do know about it but are mad because he does something to reveal himself to the natives (making the Enterprise visible to save Spock perhaps?)
Well considering the teaser has the Enterprise rising out of water and Spock is in the parts of the movie dealing with the bad guy I think we can make a guess at what Kirk does that annoys Pike.
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Old December 17 2012, 12:13 AM   #20
Captain_Amasov
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

You just reminded me of this: http://blip.tv/sf-debris-opinionated...alysis-5638650
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Old December 17 2012, 12:33 AM   #21
Phily B
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

Maybe the writers saw the fan reaction to how the PD is and made it what it actually should be rather than the literal interpretation, not to mention sfdebris and his break down of it a while back. TNG did a good job with the PD at times, then AWFUL especially that one in season 2 with Data and the little girl. I'm glad the writers are fixing that part of the PD.

It's also possibly that the volcano is some kind of super volcano that could possibly be about to erupt and wipe out every living thing on the planet? I doubt the Enterprise would pick it up otherwise, unless they had an outpost monitoring the culture on the planet like in WWTW.
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Old December 17 2012, 01:58 AM   #22
Santa Kang
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

Next thing you know, the Enterprise will be saving a planet from an asteroid collision.
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Old December 17 2012, 02:04 PM   #23
Timo
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

Kirk should just tell them to go f' themselves and die because they are not worth the effort?
Of course not. He should refrain from telling them anything!

People die all the time, everywhere. What would be the point of spending valuable starship time in saving some from a volcano? The very act might mean that a larger number of people die elsewhere for lack of starship support. Should Kirk next try and give mouth-to-mouth to all the drowning children on the planet? Act as bodyguard to all the women walking in a fog? Stand by to talk down any doctors wanting to pull the plug on their fathers' life support machinery?

At least the devastation in "Paradise Syndrome" and "Pen Pals" was to be total, potentially warranting starship intervention.

It's also possibly that the volcano is some kind of super volcano that could possibly be about to erupt and wipe out every living thing on the planet?
I guess so, but that would invalidate the bit where
.

Timo Saloniemi
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Old December 17 2012, 02:48 PM   #24
SalvorHardin
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

Timo wrote: View Post
Kirk should just tell them to go f' themselves and die because they are not worth the effort?
Of course not. He should refrain from telling them anything!

People die all the time, everywhere. What would be the point of spending valuable starship time in saving some from a volcano? The very act might mean that a larger number of people die elsewhere for lack of starship support. Should Kirk next try and give mouth-to-mouth to all the drowning children on the planet? Act as bodyguard to all the women walking in a fog? Stand by to talk down any doctors wanting to pull the plug on their fathers' life support machinery?

At least the devastation in "Paradise Syndrome" and "Pen Pals" was to be total, potentially warranting starship intervention.
What valuable starship time? What else do they have to do that's more important?
Their job is to explorer and seek out new life. They found life that is in danger and they can help. That's what they do.

Timo wrote: View Post
It's also possibly that the volcano is some kind of super volcano that could possibly be about to erupt and wipe out every living thing on the planet?
I guess so, but that would invalidate the bit where
.

Timo Saloniemi
Nothing is invalidated.
The scroll luring (if that's what it actually is) is a temporary measure so that they don't get incinerated by the lava rain and until Spock can permanently solve the big problem.
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Old December 17 2012, 02:55 PM   #25
Phily B
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

It could be part of a bigger eruption, I dunno.
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Old December 17 2012, 04:32 PM   #26
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

If the Enterprise is quick enough, gathering that much water on take off, it may still be covered in sheets of water as it moves over land to beam Spock out of the volcano and leave.

Which would not reveal the existance of aliens or starships to the natives. On the other hand, it may look to them that some sort of sea god rose up and quelled the volcano...
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Old December 17 2012, 04:58 PM   #27
starburst
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

The Prime Directive is all well and good until your on the end being refused help by more advanced powers which could easily get you out of a jam but refuse to...as illustrated time and time again on Stargate with the Asgard, Ancients and Tollan.

Im not an advocate for Starfleet to go around literally putting out bush fires on a daily basis but the whole not interfering with a less developed world when you can help is a little inhuman.

The same argument could be had with under developed countries today going through a drought, famine or natural disaster.

Could you imagine the reaction if the world had said "sorry about your tsunami but your less developed than us so we cant help you"
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Old December 17 2012, 05:00 PM   #28
SalvorHardin
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

Chemahkuu wrote: View Post
If the Enterprise is quick enough, gathering that much water on take off, it may still be covered in sheets of water as it moves over land to beam Spock out of the volcano and leave.

Which would not reveal the existance of aliens or starships to the natives. On the other hand, it may look to them that some sort of sea god rose up and quelled the volcano...

Imagine after a few thousand years when these guys get television:
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Old December 17 2012, 05:01 PM   #29
Admiral Buzzkill
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

Kirk violated the Prime Directive pretty much any time he felt like it.

Frankly, if there are aliens out there watching this planet I hope they have a Prime Directive - all of us here might not agree with their definitions of "offering help," after all.
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Old December 17 2012, 06:41 PM   #30
Jeyl
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Re: Prime Directive violation?

NuSpock here believes that it is better to die a potentially horrible death than allow these scroll worshipping white folk to even glimpse the Enterprise. Why? Because something might happen. We don't know what it is, but we do know that something *might* happen so every Starfleet officer must choose suicide no matter what.

Oh, Prime Directive. If you're not justifying our heroes into letting an entire species go extinct, you're justifying our heroes into killing themselves over something that cannot be proven. This is Dogma.
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