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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old December 12 2012, 04:05 PM   #1
anh165
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Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

If we re-call all the TOS enemies that Kirk & Crew encountered - they were all defeated within 1-2 episodes with almost no implication of complete doom for Earth/Starfleet otherwise.

A bit of team work, use of wits, blue phaser beams or even some kirk-fu subdued any threat, land or in space.

In this alternative timeline, what could possibly give the mysterious TOS era villain such chops to be a bigger threat than the future Romulan Nero posed?

And why wasn't such a villain, device, power not encountered and threatened Earth in the original TOS time line?
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Old December 12 2012, 04:09 PM   #2
Tom
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

With out knowing the entire plot. Who knows what changes int he new timeline lead up to this threat.
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Old December 12 2012, 04:27 PM   #3
Romulan_spy
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

This is my theory: after the events of the first movie, the villain feels that Starfleet is too weak and unprepared to face potential threats. He points to how badly Starfleet handled Nero. If it was not for the heroism of Kirk, Spock and the Enterprise, Earth would have been blown to bits. As it was, the entire planet Vulcan got blown up and Starfleet lost lots of ships. So, the villain decides to force a confrontation between Starfleet and the Klingons in order to in his mind force Starfleet to take things more seriously. Hence, the line in the trailer about Earth not being safe. He attacks Earth to prove to Starfleet how vulnerable they are.
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Old December 12 2012, 04:29 PM   #4
Shilliam Watner
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

anh165 wrote: View Post

In this alternative timeline, what could possibly give the mysterious TOS era villain such chops to be a bigger threat than the future Romulan Nero posed?

And why wasn't such a villain, device, power not encountered and threatened Earth in the original TOS time line?
Who's to say what threat is to come? It is a alternate reality. We don't know. The villain in the movie is going after Nero's technological papers he wrote while at Rura Penthe. Starfleet can't risk having those papers in the Klingon's hands at their home world on Kronos.
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Old December 12 2012, 04:40 PM   #5
The Wormhole
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

anh165 wrote: View Post
And why wasn't such a villain, device, power not encountered and threatened Earth in the original TOS time line?
Because in the prime timeline Lt. Harrison was content to do his job on the Enterprise and not cause any trouble. Obviously something is different in the Abramsverse that has turned him evil.
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Old December 12 2012, 04:45 PM   #6
SalvorHardin
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

The synopsis spoke of a threat from within.
Nero destroyed several starships as if they were nothing, destroyed Vulcan and threatened Earth directly.
Maybe that caused some starfleet members (Weller and his buddies) to start asking for less exploration and peaceful missions and a move towards more aggressiveness and militarization.
Enter Cumberbatch, who is used by those factions to spread even more terror and force even those who still view starfleet as a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada to change their views.
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Old December 12 2012, 04:54 PM   #7
Franklin
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
The synopsis spoke of a threat from within.
Nero destroyed several starships as if they were nothing, destroyed Vulcan and threatened Earth directly.
Maybe that caused some starfleet members (Weller and his buddies) to start asking for less exploration and peaceful missions and a move towards more aggressiveness and militarization.
Enter Cumberbatch, who is used by those factions to spread even more terror and force even those who still view starfleet as a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada to change their views.
Could be. Could also be an atmosphere where some hawks in Starfleet see a chance to marginalize the Klingons. After all, Nero destroyed 47 of their ships. They have to be substantially weakened.

Of course, those are more political motives than vengeful ones. But in Cumberbatch's case, they could be tied together, somehow.

Still, what's very odd is that the first words out of the mouth of this "one man weapon of mass destruction" in the movie are, "I can save her," to the father of the sick (dying?) child. That opening scene intrigues me to no end.
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Old December 12 2012, 05:03 PM   #8
bullethead
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

Franklin wrote: View Post
SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
The synopsis spoke of a threat from within.
Nero destroyed several starships as if they were nothing, destroyed Vulcan and threatened Earth directly.
Maybe that caused some starfleet members (Weller and his buddies) to start asking for less exploration and peaceful missions and a move towards more aggressiveness and militarization.
Enter Cumberbatch, who is used by those factions to spread even more terror and force even those who still view starfleet as a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada to change their views.
Could be. Could also be an atmosphere where some hawks in Starfleet see a chance to marginalize the Klingons. After all, Nero destroyed 47 of their ships. They have to be substantially weakened.
Why go after the Klingons? After all, they lost 47 ships. Even if you ignore the Ongoing comics, the Romulans have suffered precisely nothing in terms of losses from the Nero situation and has reaped great benefits in terms of having to deal with politically and militarily weakened Federation and Klingons.
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Old December 12 2012, 05:17 PM   #9
Nerys Myk
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

anh165 wrote: View Post
If we re-call all the TOS enemies that Kirk & Crew encountered - they were all defeated within 1-2 episodes with almost no implication of complete doom for Earth/Starfleet otherwise.

A bit of team work, use of wits, blue phaser beams or even some kirk-fu subdued any threat, land or in space.

In this alternative timeline, what could possibly give the mysterious TOS era villain such chops to be a bigger threat than the future Romulan Nero posed?

And why wasn't such a villain, device, power not encountered and threatened Earth in the original TOS time line?
Watch "Space Seed" followed by the Wrath of Khan.
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Old December 12 2012, 05:35 PM   #10
anh165
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

Santa Kang wrote: View Post
anh165 wrote: View Post
If we re-call all the TOS enemies that Kirk & Crew encountered - they were all defeated within 1-2 episodes with almost no implication of complete doom for Earth/Starfleet otherwise.

A bit of team work, use of wits, blue phaser beams or even some kirk-fu subdued any threat, land or in space.

In this alternative timeline, what could possibly give the mysterious TOS era villain such chops to be a bigger threat than the future Romulan Nero posed?

And why wasn't such a villain, device, power not encountered and threatened Earth in the original TOS time line?
Watch "Space Seed" followed by the Wrath of Khan.
Ok so if Khan gets woken up from suspended animation by a crew who has very little idea what he was all about, what exactly does Khan acquire that makes him a 'one man weapon of mass destruction'? As he wasn't so in Space Seed - even if he captured the Enterprise, which could easily be neutralised by other starfleet ships.

A one man weapon of mass destruction - that is one heck of a billing to someone who could have easily been so in the original time line.
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Old December 12 2012, 05:38 PM   #11
Nerys Myk
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

anh165 wrote: View Post
Santa Kang wrote: View Post
anh165 wrote: View Post
If we re-call all the TOS enemies that Kirk & Crew encountered - they were all defeated within 1-2 episodes with almost no implication of complete doom for Earth/Starfleet otherwise.

A bit of team work, use of wits, blue phaser beams or even some kirk-fu subdued any threat, land or in space.

In this alternative timeline, what could possibly give the mysterious TOS era villain such chops to be a bigger threat than the future Romulan Nero posed?

And why wasn't such a villain, device, power not encountered and threatened Earth in the original TOS time line?
Watch "Space Seed" followed by the Wrath of Khan.
Ok so if Khan gets woken up from suspended animation by a crew who has very little idea what he was all about, what exactly does Khan acquire that makes him a 'one man weapon of mass destruction'? As he wasn't so in Space Seed - even if he captured the Enterprise, which could easily be neutralised by other starfleet ships.

A one man weapon of mass destruction - that is one heck of a billing to someone who could have easily been so in the original time line.
Khan gets his hands on a weapon that can destroy plants. For the sake of argument lets call it the "Genesis Wave".
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Old December 12 2012, 05:39 PM   #12
anh165
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

Tom wrote: View Post
With out knowing the entire plot. Who knows what changes int he new timeline lead up to this threat.
It would have to be some clever bit of writing to logically connect the actions of Nero to the rise of someone of such danger.
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Old December 12 2012, 05:41 PM   #13
Nerys Myk
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

anh165 wrote: View Post
Tom wrote: View Post
With out knowing the entire plot. Who knows what changes int he new timeline lead up to this threat.
It would have to be some clever bit of writing to logically connect the actions of Nero to the rise of someone of such danger.
You mean like how Kruge was connected to Khan?
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Old December 12 2012, 05:43 PM   #14
anh165
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

Santa Kang wrote: View Post
anh165 wrote: View Post
Santa Kang wrote: View Post
Watch "Space Seed" followed by the Wrath of Khan.
Ok so if Khan gets woken up from suspended animation by a crew who has very little idea what he was all about, what exactly does Khan acquire that makes him a 'one man weapon of mass destruction'? As he wasn't so in Space Seed - even if he captured the Enterprise, which could easily be neutralised by other starfleet ships.

A one man weapon of mass destruction - that is one heck of a billing to someone who could have easily been so in the original time line.
Khan gets his hands on a weapon that can destroy plants. For the sake of argument lets call it the "Genesis Wave".
The genesis device is one single torpedo which did not exist until around 20+ years after the events of TOS.

And again, even if it isn't genesis, but some other device or superpower of great magnitude existed in the 2250's, surely this would have happened in the original time line.
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Old December 12 2012, 05:46 PM   #15
anh165
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Re: Whoever the villain is - why now big 'threat' to Starfleet?

Santa Kang wrote: View Post
anh165 wrote: View Post
Tom wrote: View Post
With out knowing the entire plot. Who knows what changes int he new timeline lead up to this threat.
It would have to be some clever bit of writing to logically connect the actions of Nero to the rise of someone of such danger.
You mean like how Kruge was connected to Khan?
Kruge is just a Klingon commander who wanted Genesis, if Khan never got his hands on Genesis leading to the accidental formation of a new planet, Kruge would just have gone on about doing other things - he would still be a klingon commander, he wouldn't be anymore powerful or threatening.
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