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Old November 30 2012, 01:29 AM   #1
Captain McBain
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Data vs. T-1000

Comparing the two androids, which one do you think would be considered more advanced?

Data can probably move faster, is likely more intelligent, and undoubtedly has faster processing speed than the T-1000.

The T-1000 is greatly more durable than Data, is able to shapeshift, can become his own weapons, etc.
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Old November 30 2012, 01:31 AM   #2
Davros
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

If Data has a phaser it would probably be a short fight. But then again next gen phasers didn't seem as formidable as the ones from the original show.
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Old November 30 2012, 02:28 AM   #3
Guy Gardener
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

Data can punch like a shot gun.

If he can keep the t-1000 constantly split into at least two parts he should be fine.

Once it turns into metal goo, the T-1000 doesn't seem to have any offensive or strategic abilities, it just recombines. Any air tight containers used to divide it's full mass into at least two even sized portions should be able to keep it fixed in a non intelligent state.

Maybe even clingwrap or cellophane.

unless I was misunderstanding the movie?
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Old November 30 2012, 02:42 AM   #4
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

The T-1000 can use contractions in speech. Data seems pathologically unable to do so. That's a victory on the linguistic front for the T-1000, then.
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Last edited by Wereghost; November 30 2012 at 03:05 AM.
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Old November 30 2012, 03:36 AM   #5
Guy Gardener
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

I thought that Data's emotion chip allowed him to contract?

Lore could contract and he was an earlier model.
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Old November 30 2012, 09:14 AM   #6
Wereghost
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
I thought that Data's emotion chip allowed him to contract?

Lore could contract and he was an earlier model.
Actually, Memory Alpha provides clarification:
Besides humor and romance, Data also had trouble using contractions in regular speech, although this was part of his programming by Dr. Soong.(TNG: "Conspiracy", "Datalore")
In an alternate timeline, Data appeared to have mastered contractions by the 2390s. (TNG: "All Good Things...")

However in some episodes such as "The Naked Now" Data uses some contractions.
Looks like The Naked Now is anomalous.
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Old November 30 2012, 01:26 PM   #7
Captain McBain
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

Davros wrote: View Post
If Data has a phaser it would probably be a short fight. But then again next gen phasers didn't seem as formidable as the ones from the original show.
Guy Gardener wrote: View Post
Data can punch like a shot gun.

If he can keep the t-1000 constantly split into at least two parts he should be fine.

Once it turns into metal goo, the T-1000 doesn't seem to have any offensive or strategic abilities, it just recombines. Any air tight containers used to divide it's full mass into at least two even sized portions should be able to keep it fixed in a non intelligent state.

Maybe even clingwrap or cellophane.

unless I was misunderstanding the movie?
I wasn't asking who'd win in a fight; if the two are unarmed, the T-1000 should be able to win eventually. I was asking which of the two would be considered to be more advanced.
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Old November 30 2012, 05:14 PM   #8
Silvercrest
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

In your initial post, the only thing you addressed about the T-1000 was its physical capabilities and weapons. It's a natural conclusion.
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Old November 30 2012, 05:20 PM   #9
Mister Fandango
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

Data has technobabble. That wins by default, as there is no defense against technobabble except for more technobabble.

For sheer advancement, T-1000 wins for the materials its constructed out of, but Data wins for his positronic brain.
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Old November 30 2012, 09:31 PM   #10
Captain McBain
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

Silvercrest wrote: View Post
In your initial post, the only thing you addressed about the T-1000 was its physical capabilities and weapons. It's a natural conclusion.
I plainly indicated in my first sentence what the point of this thread was.
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Old November 30 2012, 10:01 PM   #11
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

Mister Fandango wrote: View Post
For sheer advancement, T-1000 wins for the materials its constructed out of, but Data wins for his positronic brain.
It's unclear how the terminator's brain (neural processor?) would stack up in comparison to Data's positronic brain.

All the termintors were depicted as highly intelligent, and not simply "machines" when it came to their individual intellectual capacities. The "heroine" terminator in TSCC did seem to be increasingly sapient, just not in a Human way.

So Data doesn't automatically come out ahead in the brains category.

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Old November 30 2012, 10:19 PM   #12
Trekker4747
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

Captain McBain wrote: View Post
Comparing the two androids, which one do you think would be considered more advanced?

Data can probably move faster, is likely more intelligent, and undoubtedly has faster processing speed than the T-1000.

The T-1000 is greatly more durable than Data, is able to shapeshift, can become his own weapons, etc.
Without giving Data any weapons, in a fight, Data would pose as much challenge to the T-1000 as that pudgy security guard in the psych-ward did. The T1K wouldn't even need to try.

As far which is the "better android"/artificial "life-form" Data is far superior in every measurable way.

Keep in mind the T1K was made in the 21st century, presumably either from human 21st century theories or artificial intelligence capabilities likely limited to knowledge humans had come up with by the the 21st century. Data is from the 24th century and presents centuries worth of advancements. Even giving the machines in the Terminator future all of the credit in the world they're not 300 years more advanced than humans.

Data's processors, like all 24c computers, are likely based on FTL nano processors. We've seen that terminators still use things like big, clunky, chips. The T-1000 may be a meta-material based on a nanite-levels of technology but it's still likely hard circuitry limited to processing inside relativity.

We've seen Data as being capable of moving at great speed to complete tasks and we've only ever seen all incarnations of Terminators move not too much faster than a human.

They're likely evenly matched as far as strength goes.

Durability is very much trickier. We see Data take various levels of damage over the course of the series which in even the most extreme cases simply left him deactivated until repairs could be made. Having hard circuitry has this drawback. The T-1000 for all intents and purposes is indestructible but he has limits too. If you follow the logic of the extended version of T2 and BTS information the freezing by the LiN2 and following shattering, melting, and reconstitution was meant to "damage" the terminator. Which is why we see him and his shape-shifitng abilities getting glitchy towards the end of the last act. (In the EC we see him "involuntarily" taking the form of things he contacts, we see his shape rippling and even "processing illogic" like when he imitates Sarah Connor without killing her, in defiance of his programed directives.)

Whenever we see Data take on no-crippling damage we see him recover right away and keep on ticking (the few times he's gotten struck and taken superficial damage he mostly ignores it), the T-1000 when he takes great damage apparently needs to take a moment to reorganize himself. (See: The couple times the Ahnold Terminator takes out the T-1000, he lies on the ground until his body reforms then he moves on.)

So, in a one-on-one fight the T-100 wins simply because he can take greater, almost unlimited, amounts of damage (likely limitless damage in a hand-to-hand combat) and the cutting weapons he can create would likely be very devastating to Data.

In a "which is the better machine", Data wins. If only on the fact he can "evolve and grow" alone.
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Old November 30 2012, 10:42 PM   #13
Mister Fandango
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

T'Girl wrote: View Post
Mister Fandango wrote: View Post
For sheer advancement, T-1000 wins for the materials its constructed out of, but Data wins for his positronic brain.
It's unclear how the terminator's brain (neural processor?) would stack up in comparison to Data's positronic brain.

All the termintors were depicted as highly intelligent, and not simply "machines" when it came to their individual intellectual capacities. The "heroine" terminator in TSCC did seem to be increasingly sapient, just not in a Human way.

So Data doesn't automatically come out ahead in the brains category.

Well, except he does because the T-1000, who we're discussing, was outsmarted by a snot-nosed kid who had a big hunk of less sophisticated metal protecting him. Hell, he could barely put two and two together when it came to puzzle solving, needing to use police radios and second rate detective techniques to track down how quarry. And despite being physically advanced in every conceivable way, still lost spectacularly.

Data, on the otherhand, outsmarted an entire starship of highly trained 24th-century military personnel, took control of an entire ship (that normally requires a huge compliment of people to perform tasks), and didn't even come close to being stopped when he did so. There's also plenty of other examples where he pulled off similar if not superior acts of cunning. Hell, he even impersonated Sherlock Holmes to great effect on a regular basis, with the Enterprise computer creating Professor Moriarity -- a fictional supergenius -- just to give him a bit of a challenge for fun.
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Old November 30 2012, 10:44 PM   #14
Garak
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

Everyone who watches this fight wins.
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Old December 1 2012, 02:35 AM   #15
Captain McBain
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Re: Data vs. T-1000

[/QUOTE]
Well, except he does because the T-1000, who we're discussing, was outsmarted by a snot-nosed kid who had a big hunk of less sophisticated metal protecting him. Hell, he could barely put two and two together when it came to puzzle solving, needing to use police radios and second rate detective techniques to track down how quarry. And despite being physically advanced in every conceivable way, still lost spectacularly.

Data, on the otherhand, outsmarted an entire starship of highly trained 24th-century military personnel, took control of an entire ship (that normally requires a huge compliment of people to perform tasks), and didn't even come close to being stopped when he did so. There's also plenty of other examples where he pulled off similar if not superior acts of cunning. Hell, he even impersonated Sherlock Holmes to great effect on a regular basis, with the Enterprise computer creating Professor Moriarity -- a fictional supergenius -- just to give him a bit of a challenge for fun.[/QUOTE]

The T-1000 had to lose, since it was the antagonist. Also, Data had to win, since he was on the side of the protagonists.

So, that comparison really doesn't prove too much. I was more interested in comparing just Data and the T-1000. I figured it was interesting since although Data is possibly more advanced in some ways, Data simply cannot do many things which the T-1000 takes for granted.
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