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Old May 26 2013, 12:20 PM   #211
Robert Comsol
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

@ Godblessed1701

I'm happy you like it but please try not to exaggerate (I might get delusions of grandure ). Keep in mind these are not drawings of my own but at this stage just copies of the studio set plans which I use as jigsaw puzzle pieces for assembly and alignment.

The tough part is to examine the actual TOS footage, reflect it in these corridor segments and stay clear as good as possible of contradictions. Which is one of the reasons why I'm currently somehow stuck. Each time I find a solution, there's a nasty contradiction that comes along as a "price tag".

There's almost an infinite amount of possible combinations but I'm still looking for the optimal one (i.e. most solutions, least contradictions).

@ CDR6

Nice that you assume I'm still sane. I'm most definitely obsessed and never before in my life have I been that deep into the subject. While some feel sticking to the actual information onscreen is "slavish" I consider it to be a challenge which is the driving force of this project.

And, of course, I'm myself curious how this turns out in the end.

Bob
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Old June 1 2013, 12:43 AM   #212
Robert Comsol
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

blssdwlf wrote: View Post
I guess Kirk's chair is on grid 3C42 but the other parts of the bridge is on 3F100 ?
Now that I'm almost finished with the sketches for Decks 5 (revised), 6 and 7 and finally arrived at alignment proposals for the main corridors that work out fine (IMHO) I'm able to propose an alternate suggestion.

Starting at the starboard stern and moving counter-clockwise I have Transporter Room # 1 and # 2 on Deck 6, # 3 on Deck 5, # 4 on Deck 6 and # 5 on Deck 5.

I noticed that the shortest evacuation route from Kirk's cabin 3F 121 in "Journey to Babel" would lead to transporter room # 3 while the shortest route from the isolation bedroom 5R 671 would lead to transporter room # 5.

Therefore the first number might merely indicate which transporter room is the assigned one in case of evacuating the ship by the means of transporters (like they did in "This Side of Paradise").

The alphabetic letter might still indicate a power grid or else.

Bob
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Old June 10 2013, 12:36 PM   #213
Robert Comsol
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

Main Deck 5 (130607) – FINAL DRAFT

When I started on the deck plans for the saucer I was confident it would be a walk in the park but turned out to be a fine example of “pride cometh before the fall”…

While my first Deck 5 presentation (an ill-fated attempt to accommodate all Medical Wards “4” on one deck) – post 156 - may have been accurate in a broader sense, I think we can all agree that there was an obvious lack of credibility.

To avoid another “Deck 5 Disaster” I established a couple of restrictions to submit myself to:

· accuracy (compatibility with onscreen footage) always comes first (but obviously isn’t enough to produce satisfactory results)
· areas not seen onscreen can be different from what we expect these to look like
· results have to be credible and reasonable from a real life point of view (“would somebody capable possibly design it this way?”), e.g. turbo shaft network
· corridor alignment should be the same on several decks (pipes run mostly vertical in- and outside the walls of the ship)
· if possible there should be optimal symmetry, i.e. corridors set apart mostly by even 60° slices as suggested by the Season One studio set design and the hexagonal nature of the Briefing Lounge (the corridor alignment template I designed to guide me through drafting Decks 5 thru 7 thus turned out to have a major design flaw – both Season One corridors should have been towards port and bow, the longer Season Two/Three corridor should have been on the starboard side!)
· turbo lift rides that start near the sickbay studio set location and appear to be vertical have to start near the diagonal main turbo shaft (connecting the saucer with the engineering hull)
· character movement should make sense without invoking “Crazy Ivans”
· rationalizations by assuming heavy reconstruction of areas in the ship should be kept at an absolute minimum
· door signs in corridors may be taken with a grain of salt, but within the context of one story / episode these do not change

My notorious approach (drafting Decks 5, 6 and 7 now simultaneously) had been “The creators did exactly know what they were doing” and if there was a problem, then it was possibly an option I hadn’t considered or overlooked.
And there were plenty of problems, mostly because of my erroneous corridor alignment template as each time I arrived at a solution something else was displaced and no longer screen-accurate. This wasn’t “Journey to Babel” but “Going to Jerusalem” that plagued me for the last weeks.

Maybe the spirit of Matt Jefferies listened to my prayers (and those of my family, I should add) as I finally discovered an arrangement for Deck 5 (and the others, yet to be illustrated) which I believe to be as optimal as possible, because it answers more questions than it raises new ones, and is compatible with the aforementioned restrictions I set to get there. I feel this one even to be somewhat eerie as it turned out much better than I could have possibly hoped for and it does appear that the creators did precisely know what they were doing; the amount of positive coincidences would be rather staggering, IMHO.

Medical Ward 4 now does have the character of a hospital wing because it is located on the starboard side and Decks 6 and 7, all transporter rooms/sections of the saucer are now on Deck 6 (as is the turbo shaft network which apparently would have a Y-shape). Conjectural areas not seen onscreen are blank, as usual and for the moment during this stage of WIP:



Section One

is conjectural, of course, but I like the idea of an Officer’s Lounge (in contrast to the Briefing Lounge on Deck 4 which could effectively be just a part of the Crewmen’s Lounge).

The one thing that is not conjectural here, is that to get to “Officers Quarters 6F-53 77-99” that’s the corridor you’d have to take, assuming Kirk’s Season Two and Three cabins are on Deck 5, because the one time this direction sign is visible best is in “The Mark of Gideon (MG)” (please also note the wall opening of the "turbo lift circumventing" corridor in the TrekCore screencap!).

But there can’t be a stairway down because you’d arrive in a turbo shaft tube or Life Support Control on Deck 6. Neither can there be a stairway up, because then you’d have to explain why Kirk came out with unconscious Odona from Recreation Room 3 (he could have taken the same route back), and these officers quarters would have to be at the center anyway, given the erratic nature this direction sign has been endlessly reused.

Another thing is the issue of an optimal place in the saucer for guest quarters (vacated temporarily by the officers that usually live there). Obviously, guests residing on the large Deck 6 would get eventually lost, thus Deck 5 is a better choice; this would also explain the repetitive nature of the OQ direction sign throughout the ship: guests would always find their way back without permanently asking crew members for directions!

Obviously Kirk and Odona must have taken a ladder to get to Deck 3 and the viewport and although I placed it at the (unseen) Jefferies Tube location, I believe it would be better to have it inside the corridor near the main line that’s illustrated on the schematic of the Enterprise on the Bridge.

While I’m unable to explain the meaning of a cabin “6F” (maybe some kind of an unspecified tradition in the 23rd Century), the other cabins are roughly corresponding to degrees (if “0°” would start on the port side). I believe that the “center cabin type” we saw in “The Conscience of the King” is some kind of standard interior cabin that has previously not gotten the proper exposure, probably because Franz Joseph didn’t have access to the Season One studio set blueprints of “Charlie X” were the basic configuration and idea had been featured.

Section 2

is separated from Section 3 through a bulkhead door at 11 o’clock and the turbo lift (connecting to the distribution turbo shaft on Deck 6 below) at 5 o’clock (I swear, I didn’t notice until I started to put the intersection numbers here!).
At 2D is the transfer point from Deck 4 down to Deck 5 used by Lokai and Bele in LB. The angled in “hangar deck door” has caused me headaches, but here it aligns very nicely with the rectangular walls of the Engineering Control Room on Deck 6 thru 7 below.
How L&B got to the transporter room on Deck 6 exactly can remain a subject of speculation. Possibly Lokai took the 2D-2A-2B-2C-2F-3D route while Bele instead took the longer 2D-2A-2B-2E-2F-3D route (because it was close to his guest cabin, previously occupied by Ambassador “AK” Kollos in TB?).

In AT Spock exited the adjacent turbo lift at 2B and seemed confused where to go. In this new draft I moved the exam room up between 2A and 2B because of the opposite briefing room (on the set the director had exchanged the red turbo lift door for a grey briefing room door and thus changed the alignment of the actual studio set for in-universe examinations!). That briefing room may have previously been the Season One Chapel and 2D also underwent reconstruction prior to LB (a clever way to get the problematic Season One chapel we discussed here recently out of the way, isn’t it? The chapel from TW will be on Deck 7 near the morgue).

In the first draft of Deck 5 the scene from “The Changeling (Cg)” had put the doctor’s office where the actual exam room should be. We also discussed this strange shot and edit in this thread. I will respect the scene on Deck 6, but if you prefer to have it take place on Deck 5 instead it’s right there at 2B (after the turbo lift stop had been removed to allow for more corridor space). The one thing that is canon is that in LZ they apparently entered the lab with the hyperbaric chamber through the doctor’s office where actually the exam room should be. Thus we have at least three episodes which suggest this “odd” sickbay arrangement (the studio set compliant reproduction will be on Deck 7).

Since we saw that doctor’s office as McCoy’s in AT (and Cg) judging by McCoy’s “crocodile” on the wall (a unique and personal feature), I presume he vacated it prior to “The Deadly Years” and Dr. Sanchez moved in there.

Unfortunately I wasn’t able to correct the alignment of the corridor 2E-2F after I had scanned and commented the final draft. In “Is There In Truth No Beauty” Lawrence Marvick gets into a turbo lift that instantly moves vertically or diagonally, thus it has to connect straight to the diagonal turbo shaft at 9 o’clock, as there are no other access points available (the spots on Decks 6 and 7 are already taken).

Section 3

As I’ve mentioned before I believe that the ship’s internal description provided in The Making of Star Trek referred to the pilot version of the ship. For only 203 crew members on board a sickbay only on Deck 7 was probably sufficient. But once they doubled the crew size, it made sense to have additional medical facilities, and interestingly the first connection between the “astro-medicine ward” and Deck 5 occurred in MT:

SULU [OC]: Deck Five, section three. Deck Five, section three. Report.
SECURITY: Security 3 A here. 3 B in sight. (door sign “astro-medicine ward” clearly visible in background!)

According to my revised corridor alignment template the 3 o’clock location was the perfect place to put this Season One corridor there with some fascinating ramifications for the outer Season Two/Three corridor…

The corridors at 12 and 4 o’clock are entirely conjectural (they mostly serve to illustrate what I’m confident Matt Jefferies had in mind as a template) and will most likely be removed in the final CAD version of this deck.
Add to this that in MT there was a door between the cabin and the “astro-medicine ward” (briefing room?) at 3 o’clock which could actually contain a narrow “Charlie X” corridor as a shortcut to the outer corridor (so please ignore the bathroom you still see illustrated), at least it was featured as such in another scene from NT with the same two security crewmen!

As the deck with guest quarters, this appears to be a suitable location for Khan’s cabin from SS. After he knocked out the security guard he immediately ran from 3B to 3E which would lead to the transporter room below on Deck 6 (accessible via stairs in the 3 o’clock corridor) where he met with Lt. McGivers (interesting: Kirk apparently kept him from his rendezvous with McGivers, so she showed some initiative by threatening transporter chief Kyle with her phaser which should have been Khan’s task…).

However, this would have to be the same corridor (in JB with a correct “Transporter Section” direction sign, replacing the “Officers Quarters” one from SS) Kirk, Spock and McCoy arrived having walked from 3E to 3B and thus require to assume that reconstruction occurred in 3B prior to JB. Here, it’s actually a good thing if the corridor end from SS with the turbo lift was removed to have a longer corridor and the turbo lift stop was just placed further inwards (atop the turbo shaft on Deck 6). It helps to better rationalize why the three didn’t just use the TI turbo lift at 3F (as the upcoming decks will show this turbo lift first travels down to Deck 7, then up to Deck 6).

I believe the corridor arrangement at 12 o’clock in the 3F section is self-explanatory and doesn’t really require a comment.

However, we had been discussing these enigmatic cabin numbers in this thread and I won’t exclude the possibility that “3F” might also indicate the power grid and/or the assigned transporter room in case of an emergency for such a cabin. So I leave this entirely up to the reader how to interprete “3F” in an in-universe context, but obviously I just couldn’t pass the opportunity to present 3F as a section of Deck 5.

Of course, there’s still corridor 3D that has to be the one with Lt. Uhura’s cabin (and possibly seen as the last corridor glimpse of Bele in LB). Why?
I need to draw your attention to the strange corridor end in “Uhura’s corridor”. Where does the turbo lift come from? In “The Naked Time” the door at the end of the corridor was a turbo lift, but this is not the case here, it is just some kind of bulkhead or room door (there’s no turbo shaft behind). Towards the left is the standard corridor (with the A-frame), so the turbo lift Kirk is about to exit can’t come from the left either, thus it has to be a turbo lift location above or below the horizontal turbo shafts on Deck 6. But because all corridors on Deck 7 are already taken (in the upcoming drafts) and there isn’t space for Uhura’s cabin on Deck 8 (unless I reduce the main corridor radius the same way I did for the engineering hull!) Deck 5 looks like the only place where it could or should go.

However, Uhura’s cabin is vis-à-vis the “Life Sciences Department Botany Section” (ET) some of us assume to be on Deck 8 (which could also explain her arrival on this deck in “The Naked Time”. Apparently she just wanted to go to her cabin for a quick make-up but she looked sufficiently beautiful and tasty to the Salt Vampire…). Opinions?

Next, I’m illustrating the final drafts for Decks 6 and 7 which will probably help to show all decks in a coherent context, but first I need a break.
I still need to check how some Trek BBS threads developed during my absence…stay tuned and feel free to cast comments or stones.

Bob
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Last edited by Robert Comsol; June 10 2013 at 01:34 PM.
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Old June 10 2013, 01:30 PM   #214
Mytran
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

Wow - that's a big piece of work! I like how you've given some alternative possibilities to a couple of the Sickbay scenes - with more coming along in lower decks, should be fun!

As regarding Lawrence Marvick's "instant vertical turbolift ride, I think it is only really a problem if you interpret the motion indicator as a physical window into the turboshaft, instead of (as I believe) just a mechanism to give the occupant a general indication of where they are going. Having a general indicator also allows flexibility for the duration of rides, as well as those times when 50 or more of those bars slide past!
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Old June 10 2013, 02:37 PM   #215
blssdwlf
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

Mytran wrote: View Post
As regarding Lawrence Marvick's "instant vertical turbolift ride, I think it is only really a problem if you interpret the motion indicator as a physical window into the turboshaft, instead of (as I believe) just a mechanism to give the occupant a general indication of where they are going. Having a general indicator also allows flexibility for the duration of rides, as well as those times when 50 or more of those bars slide past!
Yep that's a good idea!
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Old June 10 2013, 05:54 PM   #216
Robert Comsol
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

Mytran wrote: View Post
Wow - that's a big piece of work! I like how you've given some alternative possibilities to a couple of the Sickbay scenes - with more coming along in lower decks, should be fun!
That's a lesson I learned from the Star Wars Cross-Sections book, i.e. the TIE fighter. The descriptions do not identify the "glowing donuts" inside the hexagonal structures of the panels as the two ion engines (aka fusion reactors) but the illustrator kept this possibility as an option.

Hence I've adopted the concept of trying to keep such options open for those that prefer a different interpretation (e.g. "3F").

Mytran wrote: View Post
As regarding Lawrence Marvick's "instant vertical turbolift ride, I think it is only really a problem if you interpret the motion indicator as a physical window into the turboshaft, instead of (as I believe) just a mechanism to give the occupant a general indication of where they are going. Having a general indicator also allows flexibility for the duration of rides, as well as those times when 50 or more of those bars slide past!
I agree that the duration of these TOS turbo lift rides are erratic, at best, and a real pain in the "shaft", but there is still a clear and visual onscreen distinction between vertical/diagonal or horizontal travel, regardless whether the lights seen from within the turbo lift car are displays or physical windows...

I'm not sure, yet, but I believe I've covered all onscreen turbo lift rides in the past drafts and in those yet to come. If I missed any, please don't hesitate to mention these!

Bob
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Old June 10 2013, 06:42 PM   #217
Mytran
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

There's actually not as many scenes set inside turbolifts as you might think - but in the case of Marvick's Ride (TM) I think the sole use of up/down bars is justified, as your turboshaft doesn't really go anywhere else - the horizontal motion is only for a few metres until it connects with the main diagonal pathway, why would the turbolift bother with left/right bars at all?
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Old June 10 2013, 10:50 PM   #218
publiusr
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

Lots of empty space to put your own ideas. Maybe a small zoo--TAS stuff, etc.
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Old June 10 2013, 11:16 PM   #219
Robert Comsol
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

Mytran wrote: View Post
There's actually not as many scenes set inside turbolifts as you might think - but in the case of Marvick's Ride (TM) I think the sole use of up/down bars is justified, as your turboshaft doesn't really go anywhere else - the horizontal motion is only for a few metres until it connects with the main diagonal pathway, why would the turbolift bother with left/right bars at all?
Since the Marvick turbo lift in an upgraded illustration of Deck 5 would have to move horizontally the same distance as Spock's turbo lift in "Amok Time" I see your point. But if I remember correctly, we didn't see the last meters of turbo lift travel in "Amok Time".

An alternate approach would be to have "Uhura's turbo lift" at the 9 o'clock position in the deck plan (it could just "drop down" into the diagonal turbo shaft) and have the Marvick turbo lift drop down at the 6 o'clock position onto Deck 6 where it continues to travel horizontally. The TB footage would just have to allow for sufficient "drop space" down to Deck 6...

Which reminds me to get back to our problem of the rather short turbo lift ride to the Bridge in WNM. I just noticed that the WNM transporter room corridor I had featured in the engineering hull deck plans would be an almost perfect mirror image of the 10 o'clock corridor with the angled in "hangar deck door".

We'll see that on Deck 6 and apparently the transporter room from WNM and "Day of the Dove" could be one and the same...

@ publiusr

Yes, the empty spaces will allow us to put things there we haven't seen onscreen. TAS material will definitely be considered (Deck 7 will be a good start with the starboard impulse engine room), though I believe the zoology lab would be a facility better suited for the engineering hull.

Great feedback and inspiration, keep it coming. I definitely do not see all the options available.

Bob
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Old June 12 2013, 02:23 PM   #220
blssdwlf
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

Curious - I'm looking for "JB" or the matching corridor where Kirk fights off the Orion but do not see it there on the diagram. Can you point out where it is?
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Old June 12 2013, 03:37 PM   #221
Robert Comsol
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

^^ between 3E and 3F (I don't subscribe to the idea of S-shaped corridors in the saucer and consider this one a to be a production glitch that has to be excused, in case that's what you're aiming at).

I got some more outer corridor confusion to offer.

Obviously, this is the outer corridor Bele must have passed either between 2E-2F or 3D-3E: http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/3x...ieldhd1431.jpg

It happens to be exactly the same as TB:
http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/3x...autyhd0506.jpg

Judging by the wall panels it can't be the corridor from TW:
http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/3x...nwebhd1079.jpg

And the door signs in "Uhura's corridor" are different:
http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/3x...yiushd0693.jpg

Looks like I have to pay better attention to these outer corridors as well.

Bob
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Old June 13 2013, 02:59 AM   #222
blssdwlf
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

Actually I was looking for the half-wide corridor next to Kirk's cabin
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Old June 13 2013, 12:08 PM   #223
Robert Comsol
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

^^ Oops...mea culpa. It's there but apparently I didn't erase the corridor floor lines to better simulate the opening. It's between Kirk's bedroom and Recreation Room 4, i.e. the corridor where Spock suddenly popped up to join Kirk and McCoy (perfect Vulcan timing ).

At first, I couldn't make up my mind whether there was a bathroom at the end of the corridor or a stairway down to Deck 6.

I went for the stairway solution because it's going to be the same stair area Spock used in "Wink of an Eye" on Deck 6 to join with Kirk and the security crewmen to examine Environmental Engineering.

The inevitable problem with horizontal turboshafts is that these separate the sections on Deck 6 from one another, thus the crew either has to "climb" over these shafts or "crawl" beneath them.

Bob
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Old June 14 2013, 12:30 AM   #224
Donny
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

@Robert Comsol:

Just spent the last 15 minutes studying your Deck 5 plan. The thought, time, and research you've put into this is simply amazing. I shall refer to these as guides from time to time for my own project. Keep it coming!

Btw, ever think about what drives us to do this? I'm sure you're like me, where real life is spent just thinking about our respective projects, untangling everything in our heads, impatiently awaiting the next bit of time we have available to get some solid work done. It's an obsession, and a labor of love, for sure.

Keep it up!
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Old June 14 2013, 01:40 PM   #225
blssdwlf
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Re: Kirk's Television Enterprise Deck Plans WIP

@Bob - two more questions...

Is the outer area of the deck still only 7' tall? That seems a bit short, considering a door is only 6'6".

Second, in the previous deck illustration you had put a turbolift next to the s1 engine room but there was none in "The Naked Time". Are you assuming future engine rooms are at the same location and they added the turbolift afterwards?
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