RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 140,936
Posts: 5,478,955
Members: 25,057
Currently online: 480
Newest member: JeremiahJT

TrekToday headlines

Trek Shirt And Hoodie
By: T'Bonz on Nov 27

A Klingon Christmas Carol’s Last Season
By: T'Bonz on Nov 27

Attack Wing Wave 10 Expansion Pack
By: T'Bonz on Nov 27

New Star Trek Funko Pop! Vinyl Figures
By: T'Bonz on Nov 26

QMx Mini Phaser Ornament
By: T'Bonz on Nov 26

Stewart as Neo-Nazi Skinhead
By: T'Bonz on Nov 26

Klingon Bloodwine To Debut
By: T'Bonz on Nov 25

Trek Actors In War Of The Worlds Fundraiser
By: T'Bonz on Nov 25

Star Trek: The Next Generation Gag Reel Tease
By: T'Bonz on Nov 24

Shatner In Haven
By: T'Bonz on Nov 24


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Misc. Star Trek > Trek Literature

Trek Literature "...Good words. That's where ideas begin."

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old March 15 2014, 04:22 PM   #691
Pauln6
Rear Admiral
 
Pauln6's Avatar
 
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
Pauln6 wrote: View Post
Awesome. I'll sleep more soundly tonight! Hopefully the skin tone will eventually darken once the artists learn that she's not white but at least she isn't blonde any more!
Chapel, in TOS, went from blonde to brunette to blonde again (for TAS) and brunette again for TMP. 'Cos wigs and hair dye and experimentation.

Deranged Nasat wrote: View Post
So he's not a Deltan, then?
'Cos he's bald?

I'm still wondering if he's Norman, picked up at the same time as "the Mudd incident" referenced in STiD.
Interesting thought - lol. Could lead us to take Chapel to Exo II as well! It would be nice if they tied together their intelligent robot stories so we don't have quite so many running around with parallel origins...

I preferred Majel as brunette personally but as far as the comic characters go you have Marcus (blonde Caucasian), Rand (Blonde Causasian) and Zahra (blonde and very pale South Asian so as to appear Caucasian). It does play into the whole 'whitewashing' argument. Fashion choice of make-believe characters aside, I can't see any real-world point in making the only South Asian character in the comic look less and less South Asian.

As it happens, Zahra may not be the blonde since in the only name check we get, her hair cannot be seen (I have only skimmed through so far). I certainly hope her hair is back to black!
__________________
Star Trek/Babylon 5/Alien crossover www.youtube.com/user/pauln6

Other Worlds Role Playing Game
http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/produc...ducts_id=97631
Pauln6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 06:34 PM   #692
Oso Blanco
Commodore
 
Oso Blanco's Avatar
 
Location: Berlin, Germany
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise

Pauln6 wrote: View Post
I can't see any real-world point in making the only South Asian character in the comic look less and less South Asian.

As it happens, Zahra may not be the blonde since in the only name check we get, her hair cannot be seen (I have only skimmed through so far). I certainly hope her hair is back to black!
Again: The blonde chick was already identified as Zahra in Star Trek Ongoing #26 (The Khitomer Conflict, Part 2). She has a pretty big part there!

And can someone explain to my why the original Zahra should be South Asian? Neither the character nor the actress looks remotely South Asian to me.

Since the TOS looking Zahra has already appeared in one of the earlier Ongoing issues, we can easily assume that those two Zahras are two different characters.
__________________
Time is the fire in which we burn
Oso Blanco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 06:52 PM   #693
Pauln6
Rear Admiral
 
Pauln6's Avatar
 
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise

Oso Blanco wrote: View Post
Pauln6 wrote: View Post
I can't see any real-world point in making the only South Asian character in the comic look less and less South Asian.

As it happens, Zahra may not be the blonde since in the only name check we get, her hair cannot be seen (I have only skimmed through so far). I certainly hope her hair is back to black!
Again: The blonde chick was already identified as Zahra in Star Trek Ongoing #26 (The Khitomer Conflict, Part 2). She has a pretty big part there!

And can someone explain to my why the original Zahra should be South Asian? Neither the character nor the actress looks remotely South Asian to me.

Since the TOS looking Zahra has already appeared in one of the earlier Ongoing issues, we can easily assume that those two Zahras are two different characters.
I do applaud them for expanding Zahra's role even if I am pining for Rand a little bit (I wish they would let Rand be Kirk's Yeoman and at least feature her doing something). However, in issues prior to 26 she wasn't blonde. As has been pointed out, the character is perfectly entitled to dye her hair but this essentially turns a non-Caucasian character into a Caucasian one. I simply wonder why they would want to do that.

I did try to find out what nationality/ethnicity Maurishka Taliferro actually was but I couldn't find any information in a quick search. Still, in a comic the more significant issue is more that she is non-Caucasian so the coloration of her skin tone should be darker. I guessed South Asian because she has straightish hair, lightish skin, and exotic eyes. Of course the ethnicity of a character does not equal the actors - we have Ricardo Montalbahn playing Indian and Fahran Tahir was playing a South American.
__________________
Star Trek/Babylon 5/Alien crossover www.youtube.com/user/pauln6

Other Worlds Role Playing Game
http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/produc...ducts_id=97631
Pauln6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 07:14 PM   #694
Oso Blanco
Commodore
 
Oso Blanco's Avatar
 
Location: Berlin, Germany
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise

Pauln6 wrote: View Post
As has been pointed out, the character is perfectly entitled to dye her hair but this essentially turns a non-Caucasian character into a Caucasian one. I simply wonder why they would want to do that.
It could be that they are two different characters who happen to have the same name.

Pauln6 wrote: View Post
I guessed South Asian because she has straightish hair, lightish skin, and exotic eyes.
Seems more Arabic to me.
__________________
Time is the fire in which we burn
Oso Blanco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 07:26 PM   #695
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise (Reviews included)

Actually Maurishka Taliaferro looks closer to African than Indian to me, a similar mix to Halle Berry, say. But it's hard to tell just by sight. I do find a reference to a Maurishka Palace Apartments in Mangalore, India, suggesting her first name is of Indian origin, although her surname seems Italian. She might be of quite diverse ancestry.

Zahra, meanwhile, is an Arabic name, but one that has spread to the Indian subcontinent and is common as a surname in Malta. So that doesn't exactly pin it down.

In any case, you're right -- if the colorist is rendering her as a pale-skinned blonde, that's a serious mistake.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 11/16/14 including annotations for "The Caress of a Butterfly's Wing" and overview for DTI: The Collectors

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 08:10 PM   #696
NotLKH
Lieutenant
 
NotLKH's Avatar
 
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise

Pauln6 wrote:
...I wish they would let Rand be Kirk's Yeoman and at least feature her doing something...
Exactly what is a yeoman? Let alone "Kirk's Yeoman". Being somebody's yeoman sounds somewhat slavish. And, ultimately, it seemed Rand's job duties amounted to something like bringing Kirk his coffee when he'd wake up in the morning. Hardly something you'd need to graduate from starfleet acadamy for.
NotLKH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 08:22 PM   #697
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise

NotLKH wrote: View Post
Exactly what is a yeoman? Let alone "Kirk's Yeoman". Being somebody's yeoman sounds somewhat slavish. And, ultimately, it seemed Rand's job duties amounted to something like bringing Kirk his coffee when he'd wake up in the morning. Hardly something you'd need to graduate from starfleet acadamy for.
Yeoman is a naval enlisted rating responsible for clerical and administrative work -- basically the equivalent of a secretary or aide. Essentially Rand was to Kirk as Radar was to Col. Potter on M*A*S*H -- the person who handled the clerical duties for the commanding officer.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 11/16/14 including annotations for "The Caress of a Butterfly's Wing" and overview for DTI: The Collectors

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 08:27 PM   #698
Oso Blanco
Commodore
 
Oso Blanco's Avatar
 
Location: Berlin, Germany
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise (Reviews included)

Christopher wrote: View Post
In any case, you're right -- if the colorist is rendering her as a pale-skinned blonde, that's a serious mistake.
Do I have to say this a third time? It's not an error! That blonde girl is the same that we saw on the bridge in STID, and according to Ongoing #26 (The Khitomer Conflict, Part 2) her name is Zahra!

Is it so unimaginable that there are two people sharing the same name?
__________________
Time is the fire in which we burn
Oso Blanco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 08:36 PM   #699
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise (Reviews included)

Oso Blanco wrote: View Post
Is it so unimaginable that there are two people sharing the same name?
In real life, no, but in fiction, it would be considered a mistake in its own right to give two unrelated characters the same name, because that would confuse the audience. So this is a disingenuous objection. Given that Zahra had already been established as a crewmember with dark hair and skin, showing us a pale blond crewmember named Zahra is a mistake of one sort or another, whether it's the colorist defaulting to white or the artist getting confused about which character is which.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 11/16/14 including annotations for "The Caress of a Butterfly's Wing" and overview for DTI: The Collectors

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 08:44 PM   #700
Pauln6
Rear Admiral
 
Pauln6's Avatar
 
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise (Reviews included)

Oso Blanco wrote: View Post
Christopher wrote: View Post
In any case, you're right -- if the colorist is rendering her as a pale-skinned blonde, that's a serious mistake.
Do I have to say this a third time? It's not an error! That blonde girl is the same that we saw on the bridge in STID, and according to Ongoing #26 (The Khitomer Conflict, Part 2) her name is Zahra!

Is it so unimaginable that there are two people sharing the same name?
It most likely IS an error. Yes, the character WAS drawn to appear like the actress from STiD but most likely there was not a decision to change the character's ethnicity. I would have thought a mix up between Rand and Zahra was more likely.

It's not unimaginable that they have the same name - they could be adopted sisters or even be a married couple. But just having two characters of different ethnicity who just happen to have the same name would be lame. I mean, why would you?
__________________
Star Trek/Babylon 5/Alien crossover www.youtube.com/user/pauln6

Other Worlds Role Playing Game
http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/produc...ducts_id=97631
Pauln6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 08:44 PM   #701
Oso Blanco
Commodore
 
Oso Blanco's Avatar
 
Location: Berlin, Germany
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise (Reviews included)

Christopher wrote: View Post
In real life, no, but in fiction, it would be considered a mistake in its own right to give two unrelated characters the same name, because that would confuse the audience. So this is a disingenuous objection. Given that Zahra had already been established as a crewmember with dark hair and skin, showing us a pale blond crewmember named Zahra is a mistake of one sort or another, whether it's the colorist defaulting to white or the artist getting confused about which character is which.
The blonde Zahra from The Khitomer Conflict is clearly meant to be the same character that we saw in STID, so the colorist is not wrong. It may be that she was given the wrong name in the comic, though ... but until we hear otherwise, we will have to assume that there are two people with the name Zahra on the Enterprise.
__________________
Time is the fire in which we burn
Oso Blanco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 10:34 PM   #702
trampledamage
Clone
 
trampledamage's Avatar
 
Location: hitching a ride to Erebor
Re: IDW Star Trek Ongoing...

Okay, everything is now in this thread - apologies if the conversations are a bit confused.

I'm not going to sticky the thread though - if you can't find it, search for "Ongoing".
__________________
Space is disease and danger wrapped in darkness and silence - Dr. McCoy

And he says that like it's a bad thing...
trampledamage is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15 2014, 11:58 PM   #703
Pauln6
Rear Admiral
 
Pauln6's Avatar
 
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise

NotLKH wrote: View Post
Pauln6 wrote:
...I wish they would let Rand be Kirk's Yeoman and at least feature her doing something...
Exactly what is a yeoman? Let alone "Kirk's Yeoman". Being somebody's yeoman sounds somewhat slavish. And, ultimately, it seemed Rand's job duties amounted to something like bringing Kirk his coffee when he'd wake up in the morning. Hardly something you'd need to graduate from starfleet acadamy for.
I don't view the yeoman's job as demeaning in itself; it's just a plot device to keep a character in the orbit of the captain. The issue is what you do with the character once they're there. If all they do is ask stupid questions and serve coffee then yes, you have a problem but it's no different to TOS Uhura acting like a telephone operator or Mayweather just being eye candy. The issue is the implementation of the character. If Rand or any of the yeomen had been guys in TOS, that implementation would still have sucked.

On the other hand if you treat them like technicians or security officers whose job it is to also do the captain's admin then you can view them in a whole other light.

However, you do actually have to use the character in order to develop them and the admin job or handing out coffee is a good place to start. Probably Rand's best scene in TOS was handing out Sulu's food. Personally I would treat the yeoman as an additional security guard and that is what they started to do in the IDW comic. However, they went too far in forgetting that Rand is ALSO a yeoman. She hasn't done a single admin task to date.

Still, Carol makes irregular appearances, as has Keenser. Zahra (both of them), Cupcake, Boma, and Kai, so if it's their intention to gradually develop a broad spectrum of supporting characters then I approve. I'm just hoping a few more of them will be aliens!

Edit: Just read issue 31 - looks interesting. I think 2-issues for an origin story should be ok. You can just see a wisp of Zahra's blonde fringe inside her helmet though!

We don't know what Chapel is doing on the frontier but it might be interesting if this story led to her return to track down Korby and the artificial beings are connected.
__________________
Star Trek/Babylon 5/Alien crossover www.youtube.com/user/pauln6

Other Worlds Role Playing Game
http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/produc...ducts_id=97631

Last edited by Pauln6; March 16 2014 at 01:13 AM.
Pauln6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 16 2014, 02:04 AM   #704
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: IDW Star Trek Ongoing...

A yeoman is a secretary, clerk, or personal aide. It doesn't make any sense to treat one as a security guard. That's an entirely different specialization.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 11/16/14 including annotations for "The Caress of a Butterfly's Wing" and overview for DTI: The Collectors

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 16 2014, 04:40 AM   #705
Therin of Andor
Admiral
 
Therin of Andor's Avatar
 
Location: New Therin Park, Andor (via Australia)
View Therin of Andor's Twitter Profile
Re: IDW: Ongoing #31: I, Enterprise

Christopher wrote: View Post
Yeoman is a naval enlisted rating responsible for clerical and administrative work -- basically the equivalent of a secretary or aide. Essentially Rand was to Kirk as Radar was to Col. Potter on M*A*S*H -- the person who handled the clerical duties for the commanding officer.
There was also Steve Trevor's yeoman, Diana Prince, who was secretly TV's "Wonder Woman".
__________________
Thiptho lapth! Ian (Entire post is personal opinion)
The Andor Files @ http://andorfiles.blogspot.com/
http://therinofandor.blogspot.com/
Therin of Andor is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
#31, 0718, comics, gatt, idw

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:09 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.