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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > The Next Generation

The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old November 7 2012, 03:09 AM   #16
Dream
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Re: The Host and Continuity

They should have just called the spieces on DS9 something completely new instead calling it Trill. It wouldn't have been hard to invent a new species similar to the Trill their symbiotes. Way to many recons happened by trying to make it fit.
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Old November 7 2012, 08:17 AM   #17
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Re: The Host and Continuity

It only took one. There was an another?
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Old November 8 2012, 04:00 PM   #18
Worf'sParmach
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Re: The Host and Continuity

Sandoval wrote: View Post
It's just a bit of a retcon like everything else - in The Host the symbiont took over the host's body, in DS9 it's a merging of the two.

No need to over-think it too much, just the evolution of a concept when it jumped from a one-shot TNG episode to being used regularly in DS9.
Exactly. I think sometimes we all forget that these are just TV shows.

Dream wrote: View Post
They should have just called the spieces on DS9 something completely new instead calling it Trill. It wouldn't have been hard to invent a new species similar to the Trill their symbiotes. Way to many recons happened by trying to make it fit.
I agree. Once they decided the forehead makeup wasn't what they wanted and the no-transporting thing was impractical, they should have just renamed it.
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Old November 8 2012, 04:16 PM   #19
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Re: The Host and Continuity

To the contrary, I think DS9 dropped the ball in not being even more innovative and contrarian with its approach of what "Trill" means. The no-transporting thing was an obvious untruth and obfuscation in "The Host" already, and no obstacle even at the conclusion of the episode - and the TNG piece also laid the groundwork for there being an infinite number of potential host species. The spots were fine for Jadzia Dax, but the stories would have benefited from our heroes never knowing which face would go with a tummy that held a Trill. The concept of a "host species" was the unnecessary one, and rather uninteresting in the end.

Timo Saloniemi
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Old November 8 2012, 04:23 PM   #20
Tiberius
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Re: The Host and Continuity

Timo wrote: View Post
the stories would have benefited from our heroes never knowing which face would go with a tummy that held a Trill.
I don't understand how you think this would work unless the host changed every few episodes. Could you give an example of the sor of story you mean? A description in a few sentences?

The concept of a "host species" was the unnecessary one, and rather uninteresting in the end.

Timo Saloniemi
Unnecessary? I can't think of another way to pass on several lifetimes of experiences from one body to another without invoking some kind of magic.
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Old November 8 2012, 07:40 PM   #21
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Re: The Host and Continuity

I think what Timo is saying (though I could be horribly wrong) is that the Trill should just be a symbiont species and that the host could be any species.
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Old November 8 2012, 07:56 PM   #22
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Re: The Host and Continuity

Nothing wrong with the Trill as deplicted in TNG. It was the first time they were shown.

It's DS9 that completely ignored how they were shown in TNG. They should have just called them a different species if they didn't want to put so much ugly alien makeup on the pretty Terry Farrell.
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Old November 9 2012, 01:18 AM   #23
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Re: The Host and Continuity

Worf'sParmach wrote: View Post
I think what Timo is saying (though I could be horribly wrong) is that the Trill should just be a symbiont species and that the host could be any species.
Ah, I getcha now.
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Old November 9 2012, 10:32 AM   #24
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Re: The Host and Continuity

I would had really liked to see a Trill Klingon.
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Old November 9 2012, 10:41 AM   #25
Timo
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Re: The Host and Continuity

I don't understand how you think this would work unless the host changed every few episodes. Could you give an example of the sor of story you mean? A description in a few sentences?
What I mean is that the Trill species (the slugs) or certain Trill individuals (again slugs) might have had an agenda involving some infiltrating, and the unpredictability in the choice of host species would mean our heroes would never know if a person they interacted with was in fact part of the Trill agenda.

The Trills could be an actual threat (they want Starfleet out of Bajor?), or then more like comedic relief (this luscious Trill is out to lure our young men & women to the slippery slope?), or anything in between (what face does this notorious Trill bank robber wear?).

The concept of changing faces every now and then would have worked against the background of "The Host", in which a Trill did change faces twice. The concept of one and the same host staying till its life is over would also have allowed for the above plots, too, however.

AND for the Trill Klingon. Although I think Jadzia was a fun take at that very thing...

Timo Saloniemi
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Old November 9 2012, 11:24 AM   #26
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: The Host and Continuity

"The Host" is just another episode later ignored/retconned into oblivion. Like everyone's amazement at "theoretically possible" invisibility and much of what Spock said about 22nd century starship technology during his shipwide mission broadcast during "Balance of Terror" was wiped away by Enterprise. Just like TOS' trips to the rim and centre of the galaxy can't have feasibly happend in the Voyager universe.

Such is television. I know some of you will go "No, it actually all fits perfectly, you see... [insert incredibly conveluted explanations here]" but a retcon is a retcon.
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Old November 9 2012, 12:05 PM   #27
Tiberius
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Re: The Host and Continuity

Timo wrote: View Post
I don't understand how you think this would work unless the host changed every few episodes. Could you give an example of the sor of story you mean? A description in a few sentences?
What I mean is that the Trill species (the slugs) or certain Trill individuals (again slugs) might have had an agenda involving some infiltrating, and the unpredictability in the choice of host species would mean our heroes would never know if a person they interacted with was in fact part of the Trill agenda.

The Trills could be an actual threat (they want Starfleet out of Bajor?), or then more like comedic relief (this luscious Trill is out to lure our young men & women to the slippery slope?), or anything in between (what face does this notorious Trill bank robber wear?).

The concept of changing faces every now and then would have worked against the background of "The Host", in which a Trill did change faces twice. The concept of one and the same host staying till its life is over would also have allowed for the above plots, too, however.

AND for the Trill Klingon. Although I think Jadzia was a fun take at that very thing...

Timo Saloniemi
I see what you mean, and it has a lot of potential. But for it to work, the Trill would need to be able to change hosts a great deal more often than what we saw.
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Old November 9 2012, 12:30 PM   #28
Timo
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Re: The Host and Continuity

Or then there wouldn't be a single recurring Trill slug character with many faces, but rather a group of slugs coming and going. The DS9 concept could have accommodated a constant flow of visiting characters whom the heroes are supposed to trust even though they only work with them for one or two episodes, and a certain percentage of these could have come with a tummy-hidden agenda. Sort of like the Founders, but less sinister.

I know some of you will go "No, it actually all fits perfectly, you see... [insert incredibly conveluted explanations here]" but a retcon is a retcon.
And Star Trek essentially consists of nothing but retcons. Why should there be something bad about that? There's no preplanning in this sort of television, there is only postplanning... But postplanning is what gives us backstories, continuity and plot twists, all of these sort of by definition.

Timo Saloniemi
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Old November 9 2012, 05:21 PM   #29
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Re: The Host and Continuity

KingDaniel wrote: View Post
Such is television. I know some of you will go "No, it actually all fits perfectly, you see... [insert incredibly conveluted explanations here]" but a retcon is a retcon.
Yep
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