RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 138,250
Posts: 5,348,757
Members: 24,613
Currently online: 620
Newest member: Chairslinger

TrekToday headlines

MicroWarriors Releases Next Week
By: T'Bonz on Jul 25

Ships Of The Line Design Contest
By: T'Bonz on Jul 25

Next Weekend: Shore Leave 36!
By: T'Bonz on Jul 25

True Trek History To Be Penned
By: T'Bonz on Jul 25

Insight Editions Announces Three Trek Books For 2015
By: T'Bonz on Jul 24

To Be Takei Review by Spencer Blohm
By: T'Bonz on Jul 24

Mulgrew: Playing Red
By: T'Bonz on Jul 24

Hallmark 2015 Trek Ornaments
By: T'Bonz on Jul 24

Funko Mini Spock
By: T'Bonz on Jul 23

IDW Publishing Comic Preview
By: T'Bonz on Jul 23


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Entertainment & Interests > TV & Media

TV & Media Non-Trek television, movies, books, music, etc.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old November 2 2012, 09:04 AM   #31
teacake
Admiral
 
teacake's Avatar
 
Location: Militant Janeway True Path Devotees Compound. With Sehlats.
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

I consider it a perfect film. There is not a single line in it that doesn't serve a purpose and illustrate a character. I've seen it about 7 times on the big screen.

I hate Melanie she needs to kick that milksop to the curb.

I still find Scarlett rather intimidating
__________________

"Damnit Spock. God damnit!" Kirk ST:V
■ ■ ■
Janeway does Melbourne
teacake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 12:13 PM   #32
stj
Rear Admiral
 
stj's Avatar
 
Location: the real world
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

Scarlett O'Hara is all about triumph of the will. "I will never go hungry again" and "tomorrow is another day" are parallels, not ironic contrasts. They're the fadeout scenes for a reason.

It's true there is a dramatic irony throughout the whole movie in that Scarlett thinks she's in love with Ashley. So, unlike much (most?) drama ironic readings can at least be contemplated.

But there's never any irony in the movie's infatuation with Scarlett's elemental force. That's what some people love about the character, and why the movie can be so upfront about how truly appalling the character really is. Magnificent bastard, flawed hero, shades of grey, it's a trendy motif, although it's still unusual to apply to a woman. (And more likely therefore to grate, instead of being appreciated.)
__________________
The people of this country need regime change here, not abroad.

Last edited by stj; November 3 2012 at 01:31 AM.
stj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 02:33 PM   #33
teacake
Admiral
 
teacake's Avatar
 
Location: Militant Janeway True Path Devotees Compound. With Sehlats.
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

The "upfront"ness as you call it never fails to impress.
__________________

"Damnit Spock. God damnit!" Kirk ST:V
■ ■ ■
Janeway does Melbourne
teacake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 03:27 PM   #34
Kirkman1987
Commodore
 
Kirkman1987's Avatar
 
Location: Missouri
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

teacock wrote: View Post
I hate Melanie she needs to kick that milksop to the curb.
I know what you mean, although I can't bring myself to ever hate someone with the likeness of Oliva De Havilland

Regarding the appeal of Scarlett as a character and the theme of survival in the story, it's of course important to remember that in the 30's a lot of the audience could relate all too well to the story because of the depression.
Kirkman1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 06:03 PM   #35
BORU
Commodore
 
Location: Baltimore, Maryland USA
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

Read the book, saw the movie and while Scarlett was not everyone's cup of tea I do believe the actress captured the character better than anyone could have. As to the sequel Scarlett (TV mini-series) Joanne Whalley and Timothy Dalton... Oh Lord love a duck! Mitchell must have been rolling in her grave because that thing went here, there and everywhere. Sadly Ms. Whalley is no Vivian Leigh but much like a train wreck I had to watch it till the end.
BORU is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 09:45 PM   #36
Sci
Admiral
 
Sci's Avatar
 
Location: "We hold these truths to be self-evident..."
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

What do I think of Gone With the Wind?

Well, I dunno. I suppose I should ask myself how I would feel about a tragic romance focusing on the Nazi guards at a concentration camp during World War II. Since a romance about Confederate slavers is pretty much just as disgusting.
__________________
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic Socialism, as I understand it." - George Orwell, 1946
Sci is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 09:50 PM   #37
doubleohfive
Fleet Admiral
 
Location: Hollywood, CA
Send a message via Windows Live Messenger to doubleohfive
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

Sci wrote: View Post
What do I think of Gone With the Wind?

Well, I dunno. I suppose I should ask myself how I would feel about a tragic romance focusing on the Nazi guards at a concentration camp during World War II. Since a romance about Confederate slavers is pretty much just as disgusting.
I'm don't think you got the point of the film.
__________________
"You are the product. You feeling something. That's what sells. Not them. Not sex. They can't do what we do and they hate us for it."
--Don Draper
doubleohfive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 10:12 PM   #38
Hound of UIster
Rear Admiral
 
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

No he understood the film perfectly.

Sci wrote: View Post
What do I think of Gone With the Wind?

Well, I dunno. I suppose I should ask myself how I would feel about a tragic romance focusing on the Nazi guards at a concentration camp during World War II. Since a romance about Confederate slavers is pretty much just as disgusting.
Very true.
Hound of UIster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 10:19 PM   #39
doubleohfive
Fleet Admiral
 
Location: Hollywood, CA
Send a message via Windows Live Messenger to doubleohfive
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

Perhaps that's what the film is about on a superficial level, yes. But as has been demonstrated in the ongoing discussion of this thread, there's clearly more going on than just what you and Sci walked away with.
__________________
"You are the product. You feeling something. That's what sells. Not them. Not sex. They can't do what we do and they hate us for it."
--Don Draper
doubleohfive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 10:27 PM   #40
Sci
Admiral
 
Sci's Avatar
 
Location: "We hold these truths to be self-evident..."
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

doubleohAHHHHHH!!!!! wrote: View Post
Perhaps that's what the film is about on a superficial level, yes. But as has been demonstrated in the ongoing discussion of this thread, there's clearly more going on than just what you and Sci walked away with.
I'm sure plenty's going on there. I just think none of it matters in the face of the fact that it romanticizes slavers.
__________________
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic Socialism, as I understand it." - George Orwell, 1946
Sci is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 10:35 PM   #41
doubleohfive
Fleet Admiral
 
Location: Hollywood, CA
Send a message via Windows Live Messenger to doubleohfive
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

Sci wrote: View Post
doubleohAHHHHHH!!!!! wrote: View Post
Perhaps that's what the film is about on a superficial level, yes. But as has been demonstrated in the ongoing discussion of this thread, there's clearly more going on than just what you and Sci walked away with.
I'm sure plenty's going on there. I just think none of it matters in the face of the fact that it romanticizes slavers.
You must really hate Star Wars then, as it romanticizes terrorism.
__________________
"You are the product. You feeling something. That's what sells. Not them. Not sex. They can't do what we do and they hate us for it."
--Don Draper
doubleohfive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 10:39 PM   #42
Sci
Admiral
 
Sci's Avatar
 
Location: "We hold these truths to be self-evident..."
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

doubleohAHHHHHH!!!!! wrote: View Post
Sci wrote: View Post
doubleohAHHHHHH!!!!! wrote: View Post
Perhaps that's what the film is about on a superficial level, yes. But as has been demonstrated in the ongoing discussion of this thread, there's clearly more going on than just what you and Sci walked away with.
I'm sure plenty's going on there. I just think none of it matters in the face of the fact that it romanticizes slavers.
You must really hate Star Wars then, as it romanticizes terrorists. Right?
Star Wars doesn't romanticize terrorists. The only acts of terrorism in the Star Wars films are acts of state terrorism -- the destruction of the planet Alderaan by the Galactic Empire, for instance. The Rebel Alliance never attacks civilian targets.

ETA:

Confederate slavers deserve no films romanticizing them, ever. These people were violent, murderous oppressors who in a just world would have been tried for crimes against humanity.
__________________
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic Socialism, as I understand it." - George Orwell, 1946
Sci is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 10:46 PM   #43
doubleohfive
Fleet Admiral
 
Location: Hollywood, CA
Send a message via Windows Live Messenger to doubleohfive
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

Fair enough. Terrorism was the wrong word to use. How about warfare? Either way, the point of the matter is there's a lot more going on in Gone With The Wind. I'm not telling you you are wrong for not seeing it because you can't get over the glorification and romanticism of slavery, I'm just saying that not everyone has that problem and can see beyond it for what the underlying point of the film is.
__________________
"You are the product. You feeling something. That's what sells. Not them. Not sex. They can't do what we do and they hate us for it."
--Don Draper
doubleohfive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 10:56 PM   #44
Sci
Admiral
 
Sci's Avatar
 
Location: "We hold these truths to be self-evident..."
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

doubleohAHHHHHH!!!!! wrote: View Post
Fair enough. Terrorism was the wrong word to use. How about warfare? Either way, the point of the matter is there's a lot more going on in Gone With The Wind. I'm not telling you you are wrong for not seeing it because you can't get over the glorification and romanticism of slavery, I'm just saying that not everyone has that problem and can see beyond it for what the underlying point of the film is.
It is my contention that the glorification and romanticism of slavery overshadows whatever else might matter and be good in the story, and that these elements should never be treated as anything other than the most important elements of the story. They distinctly mark Gone With the Wind as a work of racist propaganda designed to minimize the suffering of those held prisoner by slavers and to glorify the lives of their oppressors. This invalidates everything else that might be good about the film, just like Triumph of the Will's glorification of the Nazi regime invalidates everything else that might be good about that film.
__________________
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic Socialism, as I understand it." - George Orwell, 1946
Sci is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2 2012, 10:59 PM   #45
doubleohfive
Fleet Admiral
 
Location: Hollywood, CA
Send a message via Windows Live Messenger to doubleohfive
Re: Gone With The Wind- What do you think of it?

Sci wrote: View Post
doubleohAHHHHHH!!!!! wrote: View Post
Fair enough. Terrorism was the wrong word to use. How about warfare? Either way, the point of the matter is there's a lot more going on in Gone With The Wind. I'm not telling you you are wrong for not seeing it because you can't get over the glorification and romanticism of slavery, I'm just saying that not everyone has that problem and can see beyond it for what the underlying point of the film is.
It is my contention that the glorification and romanticism of slavery overshadows whatever else might matter and be good in the story, and that these elements should never be treated as anything other than the most important elements of the story. They distinctly mark Gone With the Wind as a work of racist propaganda designed to minimize the suffering of those held prisoner by slavers and to glorify the lives of their oppressors. This invalidates everything else that might be good about the film, just like Triumph of the Will's glorification of the Nazi regime invalidates everything else that might be good about that film.
In your opinion. It is not an invalid opinion, certainly, but it is also not the only opinion, nor should it suggest that those of us who can see beyond your interpretation of the film are somehow condoning the racism (whether implicit or explicit) in the film.
__________________
"You are the product. You feeling something. That's what sells. Not them. Not sex. They can't do what we do and they hate us for it."
--Don Draper
doubleohfive is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:17 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.