TNG: The Persistence of Memory by David Mack Review Thread (Spoilers!)

[VDCNI]

Read it - went for above average.

Very much a Mack book, the infiltration section at the end reminded me a bit of Warpath and as with most of his books it has a very military feel at times which did mean that the very fantastical TOS story of an immortal man who was once Leonardo felt even more out of place here than it did in Immortal Coil.

That said the Enterprise focused storyline was good, a nice balance of action and character even if a lot of the main cast barely got a look in. The Breen felt a bit one note though here - somewhat generic shock troops.

The

Soong

sequences were mainly interesting, offering a different perspective on the Federation and recent events though some of it dragged - mainly the casino stuff. It also added another conspiracy going on in the background that we previously knew nothing about.

As for the two major talking points

I can't say I was bothered either way about Data coming back, I would have happily had him stay dead but I'll wait and see if the next two books make his return worthwhile. Just please don't go in the Countdown direction - that was terrible.

I can't say I'm happy at all about Choudhury dying, yes it's more realistic if people die in Starfleet but it does feel like the Enterprise has lost more of its fair share of characters recently and it would be nice to have some stability. Plus yet another loss for Worf, we've been here before haven't we. I did have a feeling that she wasn't going to make it out alive once they got to the planet.

Looking forward to the next two books though.

I know this is a spoiler thread but I've used spoiler tags just in case, hardly anyone would have read it yet after all.

[Hartzilla2007]

VDCNI wrote:

---

I can't say I was bothered either way about Data coming back, I would have happily had him stay dead but I'll wait and see if the next two books make his return worthwhile. Just please don't go in the Countdown direction - that was terrible.

Oh you have got to be s@#ting me, you mean David Mack actually did it, sigh well I guess my reading TNG era is coming to n end soon, if the authors are just going back to the same reset button stuff Abrams had the sense to get rid of, and no I don't buy the "it came at a cost" thing, which I frankly find is a bunch of crap if you kill someone and bring them back to life its a cop out plan and simple. And they probably are going in that direction even though IT CONTRADICTS THE FREAKING MOVIE!

I can't say I'm happy at all about Choudhury dying, yes it's more realistic if people die in Starfleet but it does feel like the Enterprise has lost more of its fair share of characters recently and it would be nice to have some stability. Plus yet another loss for Worf, we've been here before haven't we. I did have a feeling that she wasn't going to make it out alive once they got to the planet.

I take it this is the justification to try to justify the whole making a mockery of death thing, while still pretending death has any say in the trek universe (which is bulls@#t at this point) meh, she'll be back when the next guy wants to hit the reset button I mean this book brought back a not even minor character to finish reseting Indistinguishable from Magic.

To say I am not happy with these events is a serious understatement of epic proportions.

[Christopher]

What I like about the outcome of the book is this:

Data's "resurrection" is ambiguous enough to satisfy both sides of the resurrection debate. Those who wanted to see Data return can choose to believe this new android is the same person as Data, just with some new abilities added. But those who dislike the idea of resurrection can choose to believe that this isn't truly Data, but a new entity that simply has Data's memories; and it's not a reset button because Data 2.0 hasn't put on a Starfleet uniform, isn't on the Enterprise crew, and has attributes that Data never had. So no, it isn't a copout, and it doesn't contradict Nemesis either.

My view is that the new "Data" isn't a resurrection of the original, but more of a composite entity -- Data's memories combined with the neurology and cognitive structure of the Soong android. I see him as being Data in the same way that Ezri is Dax -- the essence of what Data was is in there, but combined with a new "host" to produce something different. Except that the Dax symbiont has an unbroken physical existence from one host to the next, so it's clearly the same continuous entity, whereas Data 2.0 merely has a copy of the original Data's memories, so it's more problematical to claim any direct continuity of personhood.

So I think if Data had to be brought back, this was the best way to do it -- since it's not merely a reset to the old status quo, but a whole new version of the character offering whole new story potentials. Although I'm speaking rhetorically when I say "if Data had to be brought back." This was not a situation where Dave was instructed to resurrect Data or anything like that. IIRC, what he told me is that he just realized it was the best resolution to the story he'd been developing.

I've always been one of the most vocal opponents to the idea of resurrecting Data, but Dave found a way to do it that satisfied all my concerns and is actually quite clever and interesting. So I hope others will give the book a chance before jumping to conclusions.

[Sho]

Christopher wrote:

---

I don't think so. The first book, at least, has virtually nothing to do with the Typhon Pact storyline.

Hmm. Ok, given that I've at least read Coil and am way too curious about this one I think I'll plunge ahead and start reading it tomorrow, spoilers for the parts of TNG I'm not caught up on be damned ...

[Relayer1]

Although not a huge fan of 'Coil' I have some faith in the author and what I have picked up so far does look very promising...

[toughlittleship]

I for one won't miss

Choudhury

at all.

[E-DUB]

Since I can't do the whole "spoiler box thing", I'll just say that Christopher's thoughts on the matter echo my own and leave that at that.

As for the book itself, I loved it and can't wait to see what happens next.

[rfmcdpei]

[QUOTE=Hartzilla2007;7177555]

VDCNI wrote:

---

I can't say I was bothered either way about Data coming back, I would have happily had him stay dead but I'll wait and see if the next two books make his return worthwhile. Just please don't go in the Countdown direction - that was terrible.

Oh you have got to be s@#ting me, you mean David Mack actually did it, sigh well I guess my reading TNG era is coming to n end soon, if the authors are just going back to the same reset button stuff Abrams had the sense to get rid of, and no I don't buy the "it came at a cost" thing, which I frankly find is a bunch of crap if you kill someone and bring them back to life its a cop out plan and simple. And they probably are going in that direction even though IT CONTRADICTS THE FREAKING MOVIE!

How does it contradict the movie?

As for this being a reset button, the general outlines of this solution to Data's death--use the engrams he copied into B4's mind to bring him back, in B4's body or another--were evident as soon as they were presented in Nemesis.

[Christopher]

rfmcdpei wrote:

---

How does it contradict the movie?

My guess is that he's assuming

that Data is brought back within B-4's body, the usual speculative "Data resurrection" scenario, which would contradict the movie because the movie made it clear that B-4's neural net was too unsophisticated to handle Data's software. But the novel doesn't contradict that at all, since it takes a different route to bringing Data 2.0 into existence, and indeed the fundamental incompatibility between B-4's brain and Data's memories is a driving element of the plot.

[Sho]

Christopher, how does the book's method compare to the replay theory?

[WarsTrek1993]

*Resists the urge to click spoiler tags while awaiting a chance to buy this book.*

I hope some more risks are taken in this trilogy, though. I like when authors shake the universe up, example:

Destroying Deep Space Nine, which took some balls.

[Christopher]

Sho wrote:

---

Christopher, how does the book's method compare to the replay theory?

The book takes a different approach.

[rfmcdpei]

BillJ wrote:

---

It's funny, for a democratic body ran by a civilian government. It seems Starfleet has an awful lot of power to come in and take over without even consulting the government. Like a battalion commander shutting down Ohio without first consulting elected officials.

Do we know that no consultation with the civilian government occurred?

Starfleet is a branch of government of the Federation, not of Galor IV. Presumably any consultations would have occurred at the level of the Federation, i.e. the President and Federation Council.

[JD]

VDCNI wrote:

---

I can't say I'm happy at all about Choudhury dying, yes it's more realistic if people die in Starfleet but it does feel like the Enterprise has lost more of its fair share of characters recently and it would be nice to have some stability. Plus yet another loss for Worf, we've been here before haven't we. I did have a feeling that she wasn't going to make it out alive once they got to the planet.

Damn, I liked her a lot. Poor Worf too, the guy is just doomed when it comes to love. I think if I were him at this point I'd just not get involved with anyone else.

[Stoek]

David Mack wrote:

---

I'll just tell y'all right now: Anyone who hasn't read Jeff Lang's TNG novel Immortal Coil should get their hands on a copy ASAP and read it before diving into the Cold Equations trilogy. I do my best to recap the important details from IC in the trilogy, but the entire trilogy is a direct sequel to Immortal Coil.

You have been duly advised.

Clearly the Trek is strong with me. Just a few weeks ago I underwent an inexplicable and undeniable compulsion to buy a copy of IC for Kindle. I enjoyed it immensely (again) and now am doubly glad that I did so.