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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > The Next Generation

The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old October 21 2012, 03:54 PM   #16
BillJ
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

Dream wrote: View Post
Gore-ac wrote: View Post
Hope it's not edited out of the HD version of the episode.
Why don't you want it edited?

They would simply be fixing a mistake if they did it.
Part of the charm of any given work of art is the flaws in it.
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Old October 21 2012, 04:44 PM   #17
marksound
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

I've always assumed it was intentional. It's hard to believe that with the number of people involved in a production like that, no one noticed that Burton was wearing the wrong uniform.

Then again, if they were rushed for time and the scene was shot in between alt-universe scenes ...
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Old October 21 2012, 05:59 PM   #18
sojourner
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

Maybe the scene was originally intended to be used earlier in the episode, but the director realized in the editing room that it would make a great book end to the episode.
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Old October 22 2012, 09:03 PM   #19
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

The timeline at the end of the episode is the same one as the timeline at the beginning of it.
Not exactly. In the beginning, Starfleet didn't know what had happened to the E-C. In the end, Starfleet did, as later evidenced by "Redemption". Yar's antics in the past apparently made a small but significant difference after all.

So the episode features at least three different realities, one in line with preceding TNG, one in line with succeeding TNG, and one involving a past that never was the past of either of the other two. One does wonder if the final scene with LaForge and Guinan could be taken to represent a fourth...

That is, Picard in at least two realities would be asking Guinan "Is something wrong?", but in one of those, he would be wearing the high collar and the cuffs, and so would his Chief Engineer. And we'd cut to that one for the very final shot. (Naturally, the LaForge of that universe would be better versed in Tasha Yar, and thus a better source of information for Guinan - but Guinan of that universe should be well versed in her, too.)

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Old October 22 2012, 09:08 PM   #20
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

Great episode
I also noted that a lot of crew in that alternate universe also wore the uniform from seasons one and two.

Crazy kids stuff eh?

Outrageous it is!
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Old October 22 2012, 09:21 PM   #21
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

Timo wrote: View Post
The timeline at the end of the episode is the same one as the timeline at the beginning of it.
Not exactly. In the beginning, Starfleet didn't know what had happened to the E-C. In the end, Starfleet did, as later evidenced by "Redemption". Yar's antics in the past apparently made a small but significant difference after all.
The only reason Starfleet found out in "Redemption" is because of Sela. There's no evidence that Sela did not exist before YE.

John Mason wrote: View Post
Great episode
I also noted that a lot of crew in that alternate universe also wore the uniform from seasons one and two.
At first, the 'new' uniform (the one with the collar) was only used for senior officers. Junior officers continued to wear the one without the collar. Eventually this was phased out completely.
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Old October 22 2012, 09:31 PM   #22
Dukhat
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

Dream wrote: View Post
Hopefully they can digitally edited that out or something for the Blu-Ray.
If they're going to edit anything, they should edit those ridiculously out-of-scale Birds of Prey, not Geordi's uniform collar.

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
The only reason Starfleet found out in "Redemption" is because of Sela. There's no evidence that Sela did not exist before YE.
Not quite. In "Redemption," when Guinan asked Picard what he knew about the Ent-C, he replied that it had been destroyed while defending Narendra III from the Romulans. Contrast this to YE, where all he knew about the Ent-C was that it was mysteriously lost with no explanation. Also, contrast this to "The Neutral Zone," where it was stated that the Federation had zero contact with the Romulans for 70 years. But this wouldn't be the case if Starfleet knew about the Ent-C's destruction at Narendra, thanks to the changed timeline in YE. Sela was just an after-effect of the timeline change.
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Old October 22 2012, 09:35 PM   #23
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

Dukhat wrote: View Post
Contrast this to YE, where all he knew about the Ent-C was that it was mysteriously lost with no explanation.
The only time we ever see that is in the "war future". In the beginning of the episode, nobody has any idea what that ship is - meaning, nobody even thinks to consider it's the Enterprise-C - until it emerges from the rift, at which point the timeline shifts. And of course in the war future, the Ent-C was indeed mysteriously lost, because it was snatched out of the battle by the rift.

If, before this episode took place, somebody had asked Picard about the Ent-C, he would have said it was destroyed at Narendra Three, because that's what was supposed to happen, and which (in the normal timeline) actually DID happen.
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Old October 22 2012, 09:44 PM   #24
Dukhat
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
The only time we ever see that is in the "war future". In the beginning of the episode, nobody has any idea what that ship is - meaning, nobody even thinks to consider it's the Enterprise-C - until it emerges from the rift, at which point the timeline shifts. And of course in the war future, the Ent-C was indeed mysteriously lost, because it was snatched out of the battle by the rift.

If, before this episode took place, somebody had asked Picard about the Ent-C, he would have said it was destroyed at Narendra Three, because that's what was supposed to happen, and which (in the normal timeline) actually DID happen.
Yes, upon reflection, you're correct. However, that still doesn't explain the line from "TNZ" about the Federation having no contact with the Romulans for 70 years. If Starfleet knew the Romulans destroyed the Ent-C, then wouldn't that constitute "contact?" Furthermore, wouldn't Starfleet have considered that an act of war?

(In reality, it's obvious that there was a premise change between TNG and YE, and not something that came about because of a change in the timeline )
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Old October 22 2012, 09:50 PM   #25
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

Dukhat wrote: View Post
However, that still doesn't explain the line from "TNZ" about the Federation having no contact with the Romulans for 70 years. If Starfleet knew the Romulans destroyed the Ent-C, then wouldn't that constitute "contact?"
Not really. I interpret the "no contact" to mean that the Federation had no diplomatic relations with the Romulans in that time. Besides, if taken literally, and thus assuming the Federation had absolutely no idea what the Romulans were doing all that time, then the Romulans attacking Narendra Three AT ALL would be an inconsistency, because surely Starfleet would know about something like that...

In the end, we can only stick with the fact that "TNZ" was written over two years before "YE" was, and so you can't expect total consistency.
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Old October 23 2012, 07:42 AM   #26
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

We know that "no direct contact" allows for such things as Federation and Romulan fleets posturing at each other, as happened in "Angel One" just months before "The Neutral Zone"...

Perhaps it would allow for an actual publicly known space battle as well, then.

Or does the dialogue in "TNZ" mean that the Romulans have been avoiding direct contact until recently, and the events of "Angel One" are part of the change that prompted the briefing in the teaser in the first place?

Riker's comment about "This first encounter, coming so suddenly after all this time" seems to preclude such an interpretation. But if "Angel One" did not amount to a first encounter, despite involving multiple starships, why should Riker think this one-ship mission at hand would be any different?

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Old October 23 2012, 08:14 AM   #27
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

Gore-ac wrote: View Post
Worf's beard is right! I too believe the episodes should be preserved the way they were made, mistakes and all, rather than being constantly tinkered with like the Star Wars movies.

Also, it is kind of amusing.

Seriously though, I don't mind either way in this case, because this mistake isn't glaring enough to puncture and kill my suspension of disbelief. If the blooper is too obvious by half, then I'd rather have it edited out.
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Old October 23 2012, 10:45 AM   #28
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

I hadn't noticed it before, so thanks for pointing it out!

I'm in the camp that doesn't mind if they 'fix' it or not. It's certainly within their remit to fix production errors, which they so far have where possible. I'm not sure this one would be feasible on their timescale, though. It's kind of a fiddly awkward thing to fix.
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Old October 24 2012, 05:55 AM   #29
Gil T.Azell
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

Then maybe the time line still isn't right after all Tasha bore Sela?
Maybe this was a hint of things to come??
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Old October 24 2012, 07:24 AM   #30
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Re: Yesterday's Enterprise blooper??

Best not to go there...time travel and parallel dimensions do not go well together, unless one likes to be confused.
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