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Fan Productions Creating our own Trek canon!

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Old January 7 2014, 11:14 PM   #286
Barbreader
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

[QUOTE=JarodRussell;9096238Why do fan film groups need tax free status when there is no income/profit?[/QUOTE]

First, I would all love to see Renegades taken up by CBS. It is a truly original take on Trek, so writers would have new places to go with it. I look forward to it. The people involved are truly talented, and it is among the most promising proposals out there.

On the tax issue:
Just as donations to the Opera, Museums, and universities are deductible to the donor, donations to other 501(c)(3) organizations can be deducted against OTHER income on taxes. A fan film group that works regularly with the acting or film department of a university would have a very solid claim to tax deductible status.

Likewise, if I am a professional actor, producer, director, and I make a movie (say, "Europa" for example) and I spend $250,000 on it. (It was a low budget film, well reviewed, but they didn't make the budget public, so it could have been $1 million or more, I don't know.) Now, it takes in only $150,000 in the theaters, of which $50,000 goes to the theaters and advertisers, so I net $100,000. I can take a LOSS on my taxes (against other income) of $150,000 (that's $250,000-my net of $100,000). In a partnership, the loss would be divided among the investors.
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Old January 26 2014, 02:42 PM   #287
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

My biggest concern with Renegades is that it's aspirations to be a series pilot will ruin it as a standalone film (which is what I think it's far more likely to end up being). Will we get closure, or will it end with a million plot threads started and left dangling?
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Old January 27 2014, 05:51 AM   #288
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

I have no concerns about Renegades. I look forward to seeing it upon its release. I have my own opinions on the matter of it being pitched to CBS as a potential pilot for a potential series (With all respect, I don't see it happening) but until we see the thing, there's little reason to speculate or worry about anything other than hoping it will be good.
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Old January 27 2014, 03:34 PM   #289
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: View Post
My biggest concern with Renegades is that it's aspirations to be a series pilot will ruin it as a standalone film (which is what I think it's far more likely to end up being). Will we get closure, or will it end with a million plot threads started and left dangling?
This is mostly self contained story. There are a some threads (mostly involving some things in the characters past that they are looking to hopefully resolve) left open, but not in a way would 'leave people hanging' . It was written in a way to be a pilot but not leave story important elements hanging if it is just a standalone film.
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Old January 27 2014, 04:01 PM   #290
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

it is rather a bummer that renegades was shot with the intention of it being a stand alone story, I was so looking forward to another star tv series
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Old January 27 2014, 04:03 PM   #291
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

That's good to know. Thanks!
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Old January 27 2014, 05:16 PM   #292
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

curtiskoeppel wrote: View Post
it is rather a bummer that renegades was shot with the intention of it being a stand alone story, I was so looking forward to another star tv series
It is shot as both, as mentioned, the Renegades have things in their recent past that they are looking for answers for. There is another broader mystery that is touched upon that will delved into in more detail if this goes to series. These things are written in a way so they are 'not' critical to the main story, but can be elaborated on in future episodes setting up a some nice arcs. From day one, we knew it had to be written a certain way that it would satisfy people, if it was either a stand alone or regular series.
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Old January 27 2014, 08:39 PM   #293
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

The whole thing about "Renegades" or "Equinox" being a "Pilot" is total nonsense. Sky Conway and I have had this conversation. You can claim you are pitching CBS all you want, but CBS doesn't accept solicitations. And they have been very clear that they WILL NOT EVER pick up a fan film. They have also said they will NEVER bring back legacy Star Trek.

I just get annoyed at all the people who think somehow CBS is going to see one of these projects and pick it up.

First, none of these projects are union crews. That alone means it could never be real Star Trek. When I talked to one of the top people in CBS, he told me point blank, that there are 50 years of contracts and union agreements that tie up how Star Trek gets made, and even the simple idea of listing fan films on Startrek.com would literally take the CEOs of CBS and Paramount sitting in a room together and hashing it out.

Second, my co-producer and I know more top people at CBS than any other fan film, and I can tell you that they have said it will never happen.

Yes, I know Star Trek fans think they can do anything because 45 years ago they (or more likely their parents) brought Star Trek back for a 3rd season. Well, that was a long time ago and it doesn't work that way. The Enterprise Season 5 campaign, while run by nice, sweet, well intentioned people has ZERO chance of getting that done. And CBS has said so. Star Trek: Titan on Facebook hits me as a scam since they have taken money.

So I look at Renegades as a great independent Star Trek project that will raise the bar for what a fan film is. They have raised almost $ 370,000 and from being on set and seeing the great work, I think it will top World Enough and Time as the best Star Trek Fan Film yet. But don't delude yourself that it will be picked up.
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Old January 27 2014, 09:38 PM   #294
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

Alec, we are still going to try to pitch this, as seemingly low as the odds may be. I have always been realistic here in saying a series may not happen and I have never diluted anyone. I even have a post in this thread that takes about pilot processes, mentioning unions and possible complete re-shoot under studio controlled conditions. We are not naive toward these things. This is why the story is mostly self contained with seeds that could be developed should any continuance occur.

My own belief is that if they liked the pilot and wanted to go with it, it would have to be completely re-shot under CBS studios, actors contracted in, some story changes to occur, etc.. etc... That said, if it is a stand alone, I am happy with that also.


BTW, yes Titan is a complete and utter scam by a guy that lives in the netherlands who has a pipe dream that if Titan gets enough Facebook likes it will get made. Yeah keep dreaming!
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Old January 27 2014, 10:42 PM   #295
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

Tom wrote: View Post
BTW, yes Titan is a complete and utter scam by a guy that lives in the netherlands who has a pipe dream that if Titan gets enough Facebook likes it will get made. Yeah keep dreaming!
Oh my 'Here's a picture of the USS Titan - give us 100 likes and CBS WILL MAKE A SERIES!! WOW!!' How on Earth is all that rubbish still on the internet?! That's basically the whole campaign - about a year ago I asked who they were and does Frakes/Sirtis etc know about it; they deleted the comment.

I'm glad Renegades is being made even if it is a one-off feature film. The premise is interesting and it's nice to have some familiar face back in Trek, being a potential presentation on how things could move forward.
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Old January 27 2014, 10:50 PM   #296
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

Loken wrote: View Post
The whole thing about "Renegades" or "Equinox" being a "Pilot" is total nonsense. Sky Conway and I have had this conversation. You can claim you are pitching CBS all you want, but CBS doesn't accept solicitations. And they have been very clear that they WILL NOT EVER pick up a fan film. They have also said they will NEVER bring back legacy Star Trek.

I just get annoyed at all the people who think somehow CBS is going to see one of these projects and pick it up.

First, none of these projects are union crews. That alone means it could never be real Star Trek. When I talked to one of the top people in CBS, he told me point blank, that there are 50 years of contracts and union agreements that tie up how Star Trek gets made, and even the simple idea of listing fan films on Startrek.com would literally take the CEOs of CBS and Paramount sitting in a room together and hashing it out.

Second, my co-producer and I know more top people at CBS than any other fan film, and I can tell you that they have said it will never happen.

Yes, I know Star Trek fans think they can do anything because 45 years ago they (or more likely their parents) brought Star Trek back for a 3rd season. Well, that was a long time ago and it doesn't work that way. The Enterprise Season 5 campaign, while run by nice, sweet, well intentioned people has ZERO chance of getting that done. And CBS has said so. Star Trek: Titan on Facebook hits me as a scam since they have taken money.

So I look at Renegades as a great independent Star Trek project that will raise the bar for what a fan film is. They have raised almost $ 370,000 and from being on set and seeing the great work, I think it will top World Enough and Time as the best Star Trek Fan Film yet. But don't delude yourself that it will be picked up.
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Last edited by doubleohfive; January 28 2014 at 12:28 AM.
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Old January 27 2014, 11:43 PM   #297
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

Doubleohfive,

I don't know what your problem is with Loken, but as far as I'm concerned, as somebody who's worked in the television and film business for about 25 years (no, not in Hollywood like you, but so what), I completely agree with what Loken wrote up there. He is looking at things in a very objective way, programming-wise...

Sorry, but you have brought in some completely irrelevant quotes that have nothing to do with point/counterpoint as concerns Loken's opinion on Renegades's chances at network pick-up.
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Old January 27 2014, 11:47 PM   #298
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

Bixby wrote: View Post
Doubleohfive,

I don't know what your problem is with Loken, but as far as I'm concerned, as somebody who's worked in the television and film business for about 25 years (no, not in Hollywood like you, but so what), I completely agree with what Loken wrote up there. He is looking at things in a very objective way, programming-wise...

Sorry, but you have brought in some completely irrelevant quotes that have nothing to do with point/counterpoint as concerns Loken's opinion on Renegades's chances at network pick-up.
And that's fine. You're free to disagree. As am I.

You can believe he's being pragmatic or approaching it from a reasonable standpoint, but my experience with him has proven to be quite different.

On a separate note, I didn't realize you also worked in TV, or for so long. If I may ask, what do you do?
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Last edited by doubleohfive; January 28 2014 at 12:13 AM.
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Old January 28 2014, 12:09 AM   #299
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

Doubleohfive:

I think Loken had a bit more nuanced message than you seem to indicate. He said:

"So I look at Renegades as a great independent Star Trek project that will raise the bar for what a fan film is. They have raised almost $ 370,000 and from being on set and seeing the great work, I think it will top "World Enough and Time" as the best Star Trek Fan Film yet. But don't delude yourself that it will be picked up."

I think Loken supports Renegades, but just doesn't support a representation that their project is some kind of network "pilot."

Please be careful; you deliberately seem to be attempting to be nothing more than a provocateur.
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Old January 28 2014, 12:13 AM   #300
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Re: Star Trek: Renegades

As usual, you are right Greg. I will amend my previous posts to be less hostile. Thank you, and Bixby, for your measured and reasonable response.
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