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Old November 24 2012, 11:05 PM   #751
Mojochi
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

Silvercrest wrote: View Post
So, will the last episode see everyone dying, Rick turning his gun on himself, and the screen fading to black while the walkers close in? If so, why watch?
Not necessarily, but look at the arc. How many characters who were in the first season are still around now? Rick, Carl, Daryl, Merle, Andrea, Glen, & Carol. You can't seriously expect all of them to be around for the next two seasons, right? We've lost as many or more notable characters from the Atlanta camp in the same amount of time already.

This show stands alone as being able to go on after losing any of its main characters. People are still going to watch. The show is called "The Walking Dead", not "The Georgian Survivors of The Zombie Apocalypse". As characters die, new ones are introduced, like Hershel, Maggie & Michonne. Are their stories less worthwhile than those of Rick, Daryl, & Glenn?

I don't think so. I'd think differently if it were almost any other show, but this one can pull it off. The show isn't about Rick. It's about the zombie apocalypse, & anybody who's alive during that will have stories which can be just as interesting


Bob Morton wrote: View Post
What is the point to the show?
If you're looking for a guage by which to interpret the show's direction, then watch the webisodes. Most shows' webisodes at least use some people from the supporting cast of the show, but not TWD. Totally arbitrary individuals who are also in the world of the walking dead

Every single character we have can die, as long as the stories stay fresh, imho
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Old November 25 2012, 03:57 AM   #752
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

I don't see why the show would need to change, it works fine the way it is. Not every show needs to have a specific set goal, some are just about a specific character, or group of characters lives. TNG didn't have a set goal, it was just about the E-D crew's lives. 24 didn't have a set goal (over the whole series, each season did have a specific goal) it just followed Jack's life. As long as people are interested in the lives of the characters these kinds of shows can go on indefinitely. As long as their lives are interesting, I don't have a problem with that.
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Old November 25 2012, 10:50 AM   #753
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

I agree. Most shows throughout history have not had an endgame. It's all about the characters and the stories. These people are just trying to survive and find a safe place in a hostile world-- maybe in the longer term they want to rebuild civilization, but right now they just need to make it to next week.
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Old November 25 2012, 12:35 PM   #754
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

Silvercrest wrote: View Post
I'm not desperate for a fairytale ending. But having no goal is a problem. If they have no goal, then whatever ending they achieve will only elicit, "meh, so what?"
But they have a goal, it's "Don't get eaten by the dead or murdered by the living", I'm not sure what you're expecting, this is not a quest where some people search for a magic stone, turn every zombie back into a living human and magically restore society to what it was before with a redeemed and living Shane making sweet love to Rick (because Lori was clearly an incarnation of the evil that wanted to kill them all).

What kind of shows do you watch because I can't think of many that have a set goal that the characters have to reach, usually the goals are things like get money, find love, have fun or help victim of the week.
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Old November 25 2012, 03:54 PM   #755
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

Takeru wrote: View Post
Silvercrest wrote: View Post
I'm not desperate for a fairytale ending. But having no goal is a problem. If they have no goal, then whatever ending they achieve will only elicit, "meh, so what?"
But they have a goal, it's "Don't get eaten by the dead or murdered by the living", I'm not sure what you're expecting, this is not a quest where some people search for a magic stone, turn every zombie back into a living human and magically restore society to what it was before with a redeemed and living Shane making sweet love to Rick (because Lori was clearly an incarnation of the evil that wanted to kill them all).

What kind of shows do you watch because I can't think of many that have a set goal that the characters have to reach, usually the goals are things like get money, find love, have fun or help victim of the week.
But I do see what Silvercrest means. I am quite confident that the writers will give us some kind of dramatic closure, which is always the most important for me. Something that wraps up the themes and provides structure to the character arcs is very common in television series. TNG did this quite well, and Lost (despite its plotholes) did this effectively as well.

In addition to that, I bet that we will get more answers as to how the outbreak happened.
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Old November 25 2012, 05:28 PM   #756
TREK_GOD_1
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

theenglish wrote: View Post
In addition to that, I bet that we will get more answers as to how the outbreak happened.
I'm not so sure; after Return of the Living Dead and Romero's films (and the 28 films, though they are not traditional zombie films), most avoided direct explanations for the outbreak. Most either tip-toe around it, or avoid it outright, as the writers/producers know fans will rip apart any attempt to point to a hardline answer, as the "science' of it would be chuckle-inducing at best (as in the suggested formula behind the outbreak in the 2008 Day of the Dead reboot).

The TV Walking Dead's CDC trip was careful to skate around providing answers, only revealing that everyone is alleged to be infected--with...something.

On the other side, many want to avoid a religious explanation, as many productions often dip into the atheist pool with characters openly balking at the outbreak being a form of prophecy unfolding, or a general statement on mankind's "sentence" (TWD has several characters like this, including a cut scene of a pissy Dale listening to a radio broadcaster exploring the religious idea).

So, we end up with no reason at all---it just happens, so on that note for both character and viewer, there's not much hope or answer, other than to keep running...and how long can that go on before it becomes stale, or stuck in repeat mode of temporary safety, infighting, external threats, and a shock zombie attack on a main cast member?
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Old November 25 2012, 06:13 PM   #757
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

TREK_GOD_1 wrote: View Post
So, we end up with no reason at all---it just happens, so on that note for both character and viewer, there's not much hope or answer, other than to keep running...and how long can that go on before it becomes stale, or stuck in repeat mode of temporary safety, infighting, external threats, and a shock zombie attack on a main cast member?
If you are watching this show for the zombie plot then I would agree, but TWD only uses the zombie apocalypse setting as a backdrop to the main story. The main story is the interaction between the main characters and how they react when faced with the end of the world. This is why the show is so popular, not because of the zombies (although that what might have gotten people in the door).

Like the best of Star Trek, this show rises above its own premise to be a thoroughly human drama.

The show could easily have been about survivors on a deserted island or have been placed after a nuclear holocaust, or even people stranded on another world or in the distant past. If you were to have taken the quality of the writing in TWD and given it to Terra Nova then that show would have been the success and TWD would have been cancelled after its first few episodes.

So, yes, if you are waiting for plot developments that surprise you and the characters are not your main reason for watching then I would suggest finding another show than interests you--there are many out there.
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Old November 25 2012, 09:09 PM   #758
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

theenglish wrote: View Post
TREK_GOD_1 wrote: View Post
So, we end up with no reason at all---it just happens, so on that note for both character and viewer, there's not much hope or answer, other than to keep running...and how long can that go on before it becomes stale, or stuck in repeat mode of temporary safety, infighting, external threats, and a shock zombie attack on a main cast member?
If you are watching this show for the zombie plot then I would agree, but TWD only uses the zombie apocalypse setting as a backdrop to the main story. The main story is the interaction between the main characters and how they react when faced with the end of the world. This is why the show is so popular, not because of the zombies (although that what might have gotten people in the door).
That's the point: TWD's reason to be is horror--specifically what video games companies refer to a "survival horror," which includes human drama. however, if TWD is only using that bait with the intent of just being another relationship drama, then it will lose its audience, as they can get that with CSI, Grey's Anatomy, or any other ensemble drama.

The reason to be cannot be used as a gimmick that's pushed aside in favor of doing what every other TV ensemble drama of the past 40 years have all done in one way or another, or ultimately, what's the point?

Like the best of Star Trek, this show rises above its own premise to be a thoroughly human drama.
Arguably, TNG's--if not the entire Rick Berman era's strongest (as in most popular) moment was The Best of Both Worlds 2-parter, which was as much about the traditional sci-fi trappings of invasion by a strange, threatening force as the drama of Picard being assimilated into the collective. The lesson there is that ST did not need to abandon strong sci-fi elements guiding a story in order to tell the so-called "human adventure" in the form of the triumph and agony of life.

They should support each other as seen in TBoBW, not one element edging the other into the background.

If you remove the governor being morbid with his scabby, dead daughter, and keeping a collection of severed heads, then what does he--and his town become? Certainly, every survivor or group does not need the ghoul factor to operate in that world (like Rick's group pre and post farm with zombie barn), but as the series moves on, it just becomes another talking head exercise if the "survival" is separated from the "horror."

TWD is not yet at that point, but it could go in that direction, if the series followed the ideas of some fans who think its only about people with problems (with each other).
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Old November 25 2012, 10:09 PM   #759
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

I agree with you that the strength of BoBW comes from the combination of elements, as does much of Trek--but if the series were only BoBW every week then it wouldn't have lasted seven seasons.
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Old November 25 2012, 10:51 PM   #760
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

Mutenroshi wrote: View Post
Now that Glenn and Maggie are in Woodbury, I fear that
*shudder* I'm not sure even TWD would go that far on basic cable, but... maybe.

So I guess we're not gonna get Head!Lori as an ongoing element? Shame, but I did like the way they had Rick's hallucinations play out for one episode at least.

*insert requisite bitching about Andrea*
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Old November 26 2012, 04:03 AM   #761
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

Aaaahhh, next week is so FAAAAARRRRRRR away.
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Old November 26 2012, 04:56 AM   #762
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

Creepy Milton is looking for the Little Girl Teddy Bear Factor. The irony is that he's either a shitty scientist, or has absolutely no practical knowledge of walker behavior. I'm leaning toward the latter, & adding it to the list of things that makes me think Woodbury is primarily populated by people largely sheltered from the horrors of the new paradigm, unlike Rick's group

It is a mindless ravenous cannibal, so long as there is anything present upon which to feed. He's not conducting a controlled experiment so long as he & Andrea are in the room. If he ever figures that out, he might be on to something, & the more I watch him fumble about in piss poor form, the more I realize I'd probably be him. Once I saw one do something like go pick up its teddy bear, I'd want to know wtf that is all about
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Old November 26 2012, 05:17 AM   #763
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

Hey--Glenn "mans up" a little. Will it last?

At last, the big battle is on the horizon.

Will Andrea see her old comrades and turn on the governor now--or in the second half of this season next year?

Who lives...who dies?
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Old November 26 2012, 06:57 AM   #764
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

Uh Oh! looks like The Walking Dead is developing the "no one trades basic information" disease. Hope it doesn't last.
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Old November 26 2012, 07:14 AM   #765
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Re: The Walking Dead Season 3

TREK_GOD_1 wrote: View Post
Hey--Glenn "mans up" a little.
He had to. Maggie was at stake.

TREK_GOD_1 wrote: View Post
Who lives...who dies?
As of this episode, the Governor is officially a dead man.

sojourner wrote: View Post
Uh Oh! looks like The Walking Dead is developing the "no one trades basic information" disease.
It also had the "do dumb things to serve the plot" syndrome. Running into a cabin to be surrounded by zombies, and setting a zombie to kill your captive, then leaving comes to mind.
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