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View Poll Results: Jessica Nigri
Thumbs Up 49 53.26%
Thumbs Down 23 25.00%
Thumbs Sideways 20 21.74%
Voters: 92. You may not vote on this poll

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Old July 19 2012, 06:31 PM   #151
Rhaven
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

I've read this entire thread, I even re-read several pages. IDK Maybe RJ just doesn't see it?
Some women get uncomfortable with some of the posts in this thread. Some have voiced that as well as some of the guys. As a newby, I was almost afraid to say something, but figured what could it hurt?
So, my thoughts, if you care to hear them. Certain attitudes are never going to change. Opinions will vary and most won't even try to protest some of the things said. They are fixed opinions and attitudes and all the rebuttals in the world will change nothing. It will just cause a circular arguement, and no one ever wins those. Consider the source, shake your head at the absurdity and move on.

And Emilia, the elephant avatar is priceless!
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Old July 19 2012, 06:34 PM   #152
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

To say that attitudes will never change is just giving up.

There was a time when you could own people as property. There was a time when women had no political power at all. There was a time when people were openly slaughtered for religious heresy.

A lot has changed, and there is still more work yet to do.
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Old July 19 2012, 06:38 PM   #153
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

Not giving up at all. There are those that will never change. It's those I'm speaking of. Sorry, I should have qualified that.
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Old July 19 2012, 06:40 PM   #154
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

Yeah, but like I said before, those people will eventually die, and their backward ways will be buried right along with 'em.
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Old July 19 2012, 06:43 PM   #155
{ Emilia }
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

Rhaven wrote: View Post
Not giving up at all. There are those that will never change. It's those I'm speaking of. Sorry, I should have qualified that.
I get your point. Arguing on forums is often frustrating because people rarely step back, look at the discussion and admit or realize that they were wrong.

The discussion is still not in vain, though. Even if the sexist guys won't reconsider their behaviour there will always be a couple of people who read this thread and actually get it. People who otherwise just never would have thought about these issues.

So even if you can never (or rarely) convince those who won't change (or don't want to change) the discussion might still have an influence on the audience.

The audience is part of the discourse even if most people don't realize it. By shaping the discourse we're changing things already. In the best case we're changing the way the audience sees things and "constructs" their reality.
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Old July 19 2012, 06:53 PM   #156
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

Emilia and Robert, yes. I agree with both of you.
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Old July 19 2012, 06:54 PM   #157
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

Personally, I think this has been the best "Babe" of the week thread. A discussion of the unspoken sexism in geek culture has been a long time coming.
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Old July 19 2012, 07:20 PM   #158
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

Aragorn wrote: View Post
Hint for the next BOTW (no direct answers):

"I'll tell you a riddle. You're waiting for a train, a train that will take you far away. You know where you hope this train will take you, but you don't know for sure. But it doesn't matter. How can it not matter to you where that train will take you?"
Good choice.
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Old July 19 2012, 08:39 PM   #159
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

thestrangequark wrote: View Post
...when you see every woman who is posting in this thread telling you you're wrong, don't you think it might be time to rethink your position?
One would think...
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Old July 19 2012, 09:28 PM   #160
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

thestrangequark wrote: View Post
RJDiogenes wrote: View Post
I listen to everybody. That doesn't mean I agree. I love tsq and she's absolutely right about the rotten things that go on in this world, but I don't agree that it relates to this thread. Should we really modify our behavior or culture based on the lowest denominator? Should I (or you) stop admiring the artistic nudes at the museum (or on deviantArt) because some slobs in NYC ain't got no couth? If we do that, to coin a phrase, don't the terrorists win?
But I never said anything even remotely like that. You know I wouldn't; I'm an artist...I paint nudes...I paint female nudes. I've shared them here! That's a slippery-slope logical fallacy and completely misrepresents what I tried to say.

Anyway, the behaviors are clearly the same: just because the venue is different doesn't mean the attitude and how it affects women changes. A poster in this very thread admitted to doing this on FB, albeit unwittingly, wich perfectly illustrates the point I'm trying to make: this attitude isn't isolated. If it were isolated to this thread, it might be fine, but it carries over into other threads, onto other websites, and into the real world (where it began). Every time I post a picture in the picture thread I do so knowing that in all likelihood there will soon be one or more crass comments made about it, it is something I have accepted as the trade-off for sharing photos with my friends. That is the reality of the environment on this board. Is that the environment we should be promoting?

As to the story about the midwives and the calendar, there is a reason it makes an impression -- it's the same reason people usually find Chippendales funny and are so surprised by the success of 50 Shades of Grey, and that is: women do not do this as much as men, and women don't have a several millennia-long history of sexually repressing men. It's turnabout, it's unexpected, and that's what makes it humorous. The baggage matters here, because Women's Lib is not complete.

Calling people out on their sexism and actively discussing how this thread and the behavior in it make the women here feel is not "Letting the terrorists win." Who is the terrorist in this hyperbolic scenario? Me? Because I don't want to lie down and accept that people saying crass things about my appearance is just part and parcel of posting on the BBS or taking a walk in the city? Because I recognize the very obvious relationship between men thinking it's okay to behave this way in this thread, and men thinking it's okay to behave this way in the Picture Thread, on Facebook, and on the street?

Women have left the board because of this attitude. Women have stopped posting pictures here because of this attitude. People have said to me, "If New York's so bad, why don't you move?" and "If you don't want the attention, why do you dress the way you do?" And my answer is: Not talking about this is letting them win. Giving up sharing pictures with my friends because of this is letting them win. Moving away from a city I love, or changing my style would be letting them win.

RJ, you know I like you and we've always gotten along fine, but when you see every woman who is posting in this thread telling you you're wrong, don't you think it might be time to rethink your position?
Brilliantly said, you deserve an award for the wonderful posts you've posted on this and other subjects recently.
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Old July 19 2012, 09:39 PM   #161
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

your sig made me LOL, Bob.
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Old July 19 2012, 10:43 PM   #162
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

Thumbs up
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Old July 19 2012, 11:13 PM   #163
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

Bob the Skutter wrote: View Post
Brilliantly said, you deserve an award for the wonderful posts you've posted on this and other subjects recently.
Why, thank you. I tend to take issue with awards, but as this award is for me it is fine. I assume it involves cash and a tiara?
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Old July 19 2012, 11:16 PM   #164
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

thestrangequark wrote: View Post
Bob the Skutter wrote: View Post
Brilliantly said, you deserve an award for the wonderful posts you've posted on this and other subjects recently.
Why, thank you. I tend to take issue with awards, but as this award is for me it is fine. I assume it involves cash and a tiara?
No tiara, no cash, just a thank you from me and probably many other. No cash alternative.
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Old July 19 2012, 11:17 PM   #165
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Re: Jessica Nigri: Babe of the week #29 (July 2012)

thestrangequark wrote: View Post
Bob the Skutter wrote: View Post
Brilliantly said, you deserve an award for the wonderful posts you've posted on this and other subjects recently.
Why, thank you. I tend to take issue with awards, but as this award is for me it is fine. I assume it involves cash and a tiara?
Would you accept a... thumbs up?

(I'M KIDDING, I'M KIDDING.)
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