"The Dark Knight Rises" Review and Discussion Thread (spoilers)

[JarodRussell]

Flying Spaghetti Monster wrote:

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11 things that didn't work in TDKR

and more things

But... but... all of that worked... for me... in my opinion.

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

I was thinking about this today so I thought I'd share.

If Nolan wanted to have an eight-year gap, why not do it during the film rather than before it. At present, having Bruce learn to be Batman twice in the same film seems a bit redundant anyway.

But if he was in prison for eight years that might give him time to recover from a back breaking while Gotham goes to hell, and Bane could really set up class warfare.

Plus doin it this way would make Modine's character make sense. Maybe have it so it takes place a few months after the Dark Knight, so when Batman comes on the scene to rescue the stock market people, Modine's reaction to having his men chase Batman would make sense. Him being so obsessed with getting Batman in the film was not very realistic after 8 years.

My friend think that the whole movie should have have held onto the theme of economic warfare rather than pissing away a few stupid references to it. It's exactly the kind of crime Batman can't fight because he and Wayne Enterprises had helped fuel the fires after all!

[TV's Frank]

Flying Spaghetti Monster wrote:

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I was thinking about this today so I thought I'd share.

If Nolan wanted to have an eight-year gap, why not do it during the film rather than before it. At present, having Bruce learn to be Batman twice in the same film seems a bit redundant anyway.

But if he was in prison for eight years that might give him time to recover from a back breaking while Gotham goes to hell, and Bane could really set up class warfare.

Plus doin it this way would make Modine's character make sense. Maybe have it so it takes place a few months after the Dark Knight, so when Batman comes on the scene to rescue the stock market people, Modine's reaction to having his men chase Batman would make sense. Him being so obsessed with getting Batman in the film was not very realistic after 8 years.

My friend think that the whole movie should have have held onto the theme of economic warfare rather than pissing away a few stupid references to it. It's exactly the kind of crime Batman can't fight because he and Wayne Enterprises had helped fuel the fires after all!

The first sequence of Bruce Wayne training to be Batman again is for the physical aspect whereas the second sequence is for his spiritual side, at least this is how I read the film. He trains himself physically but is unprepared spiritually to reclaim being Batman, hence the 2nd sequence later in the film during his recovery. And I liked that the film addresses these multi-layered aspects of Bruce Wayne/Batman.

[TV's Frank]

JarodRussell wrote:

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But... but... all of that worked... for me... in my opinion.

For me as well!

[Warped9]

I'm currently reading The Dark Knight Manual: Tools, Weapons, Vehicles and Documents From The Batcave. Cool book, written in the first person (Bruce Wayne) and there's a reference to the first five years as Batman.

This tells me that Batman operates for a few years before that year he spends going after the upper echelons of organized crime, the year the Joker refers to in TDK. That backs up a reference in TDKR about Bruce's "years" as Batman. The idea seems to be that Bruce was Batman for at least five years from BB to the events of the TDK. Also we don't know how long he operated as an outlaw after the events of TDK. In TDKR it merely makes a reference to eight years since the last confirmed sighting.

[Trekker4747]

Warped9 wrote:

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I'm currently reading The Dark Knight Manual: Tools, Weapons, Vehicles and Documents From The Batcave. Cool book, written in the first person (Bruce Wayne) and there's a reference to the first five years as Batman.

This tells me that Batman operates for a few years before that year he spends going after the upper echelons of organized crime, the year the Joker refers to in TDK. That backs up a reference in TDKR about Bruce's "years" as Batman. The idea seems to be that Bruce was Batman for at least five years from BB to the events of the TDK. Also we don't know how long he operated as an outlaw after the events of TDK. In TDKR it merely makes a reference to eight years since the last confirmed sighting.

I guess that makes sense. But it seems odd that The Joker was operate mostly unseen for "a few years" between BB and TDK before becoming a much larger part of Batman's life. It also seems odd that it took that long for Wayne Manor (and the Batcave) to be constructed.

Again, to me it seems like TDKR just wasn't "thought out" in how it was to fit into the movie series which seemed to be all about establishing a "status quo" for Batman's career and adventures that'd continue after movie series ended. Even Joker references this in "TDK" when he says, "I can see us doing this forever." That's obviously a wink-wink to the audience that that is exactly what is going to happen even if we never get to see it.

But then TDKR just says, "Fuck it! He stopped being Batman shortly after the events of TDK, the Batcave was a waste of time and resources, and... Batman is crippled."

It seems like quite a disconnect between each movie and the previous outing(s.)

[Captaindemotion]

^I also find the 5 years gap hard to reconcile with BB and TDK.

5 years before Batman encountered The Joker, despite Gordon pointing out the calling card to him at the end of BB, and Batman vowing to investigate it? 5 years to repair Wayne Manor? 5 years of Jonathan Crane being at large? 5 years and Batman didn't change his outfit until the start of TDK?

[Warped9]

Bruce doesn't appear in truly physical difficulty at the end of TDK yet in TDKR he looks in pretty rough shape. That does argue that something else happened after TDK. For sure it doesn't make any sense that he'd been Batman for only a year before events in TDK.

If you use the time between BB and TDK (2005-2008) then he could have been operative for three years and then maybe another two mostly out of sight. And so the eight year period mentioned in TDKR is still supported by the last confirmed sighting while he really ceased operations only six years before.

Seriously, though, that whole eight year absence is rather silly unless the last sighting isn't referring to the events of TDK and Batman remained operative for quite sometime after Dent's death.

Makes me wonder if anyone even bothered plotting this out at least on a piece of scrap paper to have it make more clear sense.

[Captaindemotion]

^It's been a while since I watched TDK but yes, I'd also agree that I couldn't quite figure out how or when Bruce was supposed to have been so badly injured as to require the cane.

[Warped9]

Considering that Bruce and Alfred do seem to look distinctly older quite a few years might have passed in continuity since TDK.

[Captaindemotion]

^Yeah, we do know that 8 years are supposed to have passed between them, there's no argument about that. The issue is really about how Bruce was so badly injured.

[Dream]

Captaindemotion wrote:

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^It's been a while since I watched TDK but yes, I'd also agree that I couldn't quite figure out how or when Bruce was supposed to have been so badly injured as to require the cane.

I liked how in Batman Beyond, Bruce got his limp after Joker stabbed him in his leg forcing him to retire. Joker being Batman's nemesis was the one to end his career. They should have done something like that for the end of TDK.

[Jax]

I don't get the why does he limp arguement, Bruce Wayne was Batman for over 8 years and his body suffered chronic injuries that caught up with him eventually, why does it need to be just 1 big event? you try doing what he did for years n years and see how your bones handle it.

[Dream]

Jax wrote:

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I don't get the why does he limp arguement, Bruce Wayne was Batman for over 8 years and his body suffered chronic injuries that caught up with him eventually, why does it need to be just 1 big event? you try doing what he did for years n years and see how your bones handle it.

Nope, Joker in TDK states Batman has only been around for a year. Batman hasn't been seen for eight years between the end of TDK until the start of TDKR.

[Warped9]

^^ No, I just watched TDK the other night. Joker doesn't say Batman has been around for only a year. He actually says that a year ago the mob thought they were untouchable or something to that effect. Remember, too, that all those escaped Arkham inmates also had to be rounded up after BB. Batman might not have been able to devote all his attentions to the mob.