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Old October 21 2012, 12:03 AM   #1
Knight Templar
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Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

It seems like this idea was all the rage back in the late 1980s to early 1990s about (in particular) dealing with rebellious teenagers and/or close relatives who were addicts or some kind of persistent offender.

Now you never hear a word about it. I looked it up on wikipedia and some people even define it as being abusive.
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Old October 21 2012, 12:03 AM   #2
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

^ Probably because it IS abusive.
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Old October 21 2012, 12:05 AM   #3
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

Knight Templar wrote: View Post
It seems like this idea was all the rage back in the late 1980s to early 1990s about (in particular) dealing with rebellious teenagers and/or close relatives who were addicts or some kind of persistent offender.

Now you never hear a word about it. I looked it up on wikipedia and some people even define it as being abusive.
What is your precise definition of tough love?
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Old October 21 2012, 12:05 AM   #4
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

Not necessarily. Letting your teenage son spend the night in jail after he screws up instead of rushing right down to post bail would be tough love and that's certainly not abusive.
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Old October 21 2012, 12:06 AM   #5
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

Yeah, what exactly are we talking about here?
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Old October 21 2012, 12:19 AM   #6
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

Boundaries. Not letting someone who is fucking up their life damage others.
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Old October 21 2012, 01:02 AM   #7
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

teacock wrote: View Post
Boundaries. Not letting someone who is fucking up their life damage others.
Agreed. and not being an enabler. Not making someones recovery especially "easy" just because they are family. Let someone you love suffer the consequences of their actions.

I know some parents that let their teenagers drink all they want at home because they don't want them doing it away from home or driving.

How can someone ever learn if you constantly give them a "soft landing".
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Old October 21 2012, 01:06 AM   #8
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

Knight Templar wrote: View Post

I know some parents that let their teenagers drink all they want at home because they don't want them doing it away from home or driving.
Why do they assume they aren't?
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Old October 21 2012, 01:33 AM   #9
auntiehill
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

Letting someone be responsible for, and/or face the repercussions of their actions is, in some cases, entirely necessary. But, like anything, the individual has to decide when and where, and to what degree, the response is appropriate.

Obviously, very young children do require assistance, as one wouldn't let a small boy walk home in dangerously cold weather because he forgot his coat, even after you reminded him. You'd find a way to get his coat to him, and give him an earful when you did so. You could later decide on a small punishment, like taking away a toy or a privileged, because he failed to listen, but you certainly wouldn't risk the child getting frostbite just to prove your point.

But if someone is an addict or alcoholic, and you keep giving them money, guess what? They will take that money and go buy drugs & booze with it. You're enabling their addiction. As hard as it is, you can't cave in. You can offer them a place to stay while they detox, or offer to drive them to rehab, or something similar. If you keep making it easy for them to continue their self-destructive behavior, then it's like giving them permission. My sister was a drug addict and alcoholic for 25 years, and that might not have gone on for so long if my parents didn't keep bailing her out. She stole from them, lied constantly, destroyed their property, neglected and abandoned her child, sent her husband into a nervous breakdown and gave my mom stress-related heart problems. It wasn't until the courts took her child away that she finally stopped.

It's obviously a matter of degrees, the age and maturity of the person involved and the severity of the problem.A child who refuses to do homework pays by spending her summer vacation in summer school or perhaps even gets held back a year. Someone who continually breaks the law, however, will pay by spending some time in jail. That's how life is. You don't help someone by not letting them see the consequences of their actions.
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Old October 21 2012, 01:49 AM   #10
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

Knight Templar wrote: View Post
It seems like this idea was all the rage back in the late 1980s to early 1990s about (in particular) dealing with rebellious teenagers and/or close relatives who were addicts or some kind of persistent offender.

Now you never hear a word about it. I looked it up on wikipedia and some people even define it as being abusive.
You're so vague about your meaning that you make discussion difficult, especially since I'm half convinced this will be leading toward some sort of gay reeducation camp or "you shouldn't teach your kids about anything other than abstinence from sex" pivot at some point in the near future given your track record.

If you're talking about simply setting boundaries and not enabling misbehavior in teens, that hasn't gone out of style just because the phrase "tough love" might have fallen out of favor, nor is the anecdotal observation of a few of your neighbors letting their kids get drunk evidence of any widespread change in attitudes.

Not giving your kids money because it might be spent on drugs is a perfectly reasonable response (but it must be followed up with keeping a close eye on the teen to make sure they aren't turning to theft in order to raise the money). Sending them off to boot camps that don't work to get screamed at or abused by other people when what they really need is close parental support (which doesn't mean enabling) and professional treatment is not.

Since in the past you've made it abundantly clear that you think shunning your own child and kicking them out of the house for their misbehaviors (which in your eyes include such things as being born gay) is perfectly acceptable, I'm going to go ahead and say that no, that kind of "tough love" is not popular, nor should it be. It's barbaric and abusive and a total abdication of your parental responsibilities whilst patting yourself on your back for doing what your warped mind considers the right thing, and parents who practice it with underage children should be arrested.

Whatever this topic is ultimately about, it should be noted that crime among teenagers is way down, as is cigarette, alcohol, and other drug use (with the exception of a slight rise in the use of marijuana --which is actually safer than cigarettes or alcohol anyway; not that I'm recommending it for teens), so the alleged enabling of teenagers you think is going on everywhere doesn't seem to have to negative effect you think it does.
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Old October 21 2012, 04:56 AM   #11
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

The Mediocre Pumpkin wrote: View Post
Knight Templar wrote: View Post
It seems like this idea was all the rage back in the late 1980s to early 1990s about (in particular) dealing with rebellious teenagers and/or close relatives who were addicts or some kind of persistent offender.

Now you never hear a word about it. I looked it up on wikipedia and some people even define it as being abusive.
You're so vague about your meaning that you make discussion difficult, especially since I'm half convinced this will be leading toward some sort of gay reeducation camp or "you shouldn't teach your kids about anything other than abstinence from sex" pivot at some point in the near future given your track record.

.
I suggest you check out my threads. I'm not the one who brings in questions of homosexuality or similar issues in. For some reason people seem obsessed with introducing it into every thread I post in (or it seems that way to me).
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Old October 21 2012, 08:35 AM   #12
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

I've been on the receiving end of tough love back in the day.. my parents understood that you couldn't always be a friend to their kid but when needed could put their foot down and not waver an inch (my dad moreso than my mom ).

Of course i "hated" them at the moment it happened and ranted on length to my friends but as the years progressed i realized that they always had the best intentions and it needed to be done at the time.

This is why some parents (even back then) have a hard time with tough love.. they can't handle their kid being raving mad at them and would rather avoid the confrontation and let the kid go. However the long term results are always bad.. kids learn that they can get away with everything so why bother behaving at all?
I have friends who were in the late 30s/early 40s when their kids were at this stage and they didn't put their foot down on time.. result were many embarrassments amongst us, their adult friends, when their kids once again failed to obey and did stuff they were not supposed to do. Finally they realized their mistake and changed the program.. was tough at first but it worked.
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Old October 21 2012, 08:43 AM   #13
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

This thread is useless unless the OP is going to define terms and be more specific.
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Old October 21 2012, 09:30 AM   #14
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

Kestra wrote: View Post
This thread is useless unless the OP is going to define terms and be more specific.
Totally agreed.
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Old October 21 2012, 01:57 PM   #15
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Re: Whatever Happened to "tough love"?

I tried it once, but my wife didn't hear the safety word (what with the ball-gag and all) and ended up punching me in the eye.
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