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View Poll Results: Prometheus - Poll
A + 16 6.90%
A 27 11.64%
A - 32 13.79%
B + 43 18.53%
B 33 14.22%
B - 21 9.05%
C + 19 8.19%
C 8 3.45%
C - 15 6.47%
D 12 5.17%
F 6 2.59%
Voters: 232. You may not vote on this poll

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Old June 13 2012, 11:25 AM   #451
RoJoHen
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

Saul wrote: View Post

TremblingBluStar wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
None of the characters got any kind of development.
None? At all? We find out Shaw's father died. We find out she cannot have children. There are two examples of how her character was developed.
That's not development. That's just the character's background details. If we discover she likes the color Blue that's not development.
Thank you, I agree. Background information is not development. Development means that the characters grow and change as a result of the events of the film. I mean, I suppose Shaw changed a bit from believing that we would meet our gods to discovering that our creators were just aliens with bioengineered weapons, but she still wants to find them and meet them.
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Old June 13 2012, 02:19 PM   #452
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

chardman wrote: View Post
Another thing... several people have questioned why Weyland apparently ordered David to infect Halloway. The thing is, why do so many assume that Weyland had anything to do with it in the first place? It's pretty clear to me from David's conversation with Halloway about their various creators, that David has some sort of pseudo-emotional resentment of humanity, and his creator in particular. (Note how he flinches when Weyland later dismisses him as having no soul, and it's kind'a hard to not accept this resentment as genuine.) I'm fairly sure that a number of David's actions are the result of a personal agenda that Weyland is most likely completely un-aware of.
Assuming there's a connection does make sense, though. David recovers the cylinder from the cavern, then speaks to Weyland onboard the ship, then goes off and infects Holloway after being told to "try harder." In one of the many interviews I've read with Lindelof over the last few days, he said that "try harder" translates for an android as "try a different way until you get results." He also suggested, though did not outright state, that Weyland may have explicitly told David to find out what would happen if a human were infected with what David had discovered.

Also, just a small correction - the bit about a soul happens during the briefing near the beginning of the film, rather than "later."

In any event, I think you're right about there being some resentment, though I think it's also coupled with contempt for humanity. He resents that he'll never have a soul as his creator conceives of one, but at the same time he realizes that he is probably superior to humans in many other ways. I think he sees a potential in himself for something more than what he has been doing, but has to wait until Weyland has died in order to fully explore that potential ("all children want their parents to die"). David already understands quite well that getting an answer to your question ("why did you create us?") may be wholly unsatisfying ("because we could"), and so views the Prometheus mission to find humanity's creators to be a pointless exercise.
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Old June 13 2012, 02:27 PM   #453
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

Set Harth wrote: View Post
I was thinking of the OT. There's no line in the prequels that "got a number wrong" in the sense of the Prometheus math mistake.
What number of any consequence was wrong in the OT?

I'm not saying details aren't important - but if it doesn't affect the plot... well, then it's not important.
And I didn't say Scott was Lucas. I said he's turning into Lucas. This process takes time.
You do realize the man is 75 years old, right? He'll be dust before he ever reaches the lack of storytelling talent Lucas possesses.

RoJoHen wrote: View Post

Thank you, I agree. Background information is not development. Development means that the characters grow and change as a result of the events of the film. I mean, I suppose Shaw changed a bit from believing that we would meet our gods to discovering that our creators were just aliens with bioengineered weapons, but she still wants to find them and meet them.
True. I got that wrong.

Either way, I don't see how it can be claimed there was no character development. First off, there were only two survivors, both of whom were clearly changed by their experience. Yes, Shaw still wants to find the Engineers, but not for the reason she wanted at the beginning.

I see her having a similar character arc as Ripley, who we didn't see change much by the end of the first Alien, but in the second film she was clearly affected and changed by the first film.
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Old June 13 2012, 02:38 PM   #454
PsychoPere
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

That's like the eighth time that link has been posted now.

(But it is an interesting read nonetheless.)
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Old June 13 2012, 02:48 PM   #455
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

PsychoPere wrote: View Post
That's like the eighth time that link has been posted now.

(But it is an interesting read nonetheless.)
Haha, sorry.

Just saw the movie yesterday, liked it. Will post my thoughts a little later.
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Old June 13 2012, 06:36 PM   #456
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

Gep Malakai wrote: View Post
Some thoughts on the film from the production designer and VFX supervisor on Moon:

http://www.gavinrothery.com/my-blog/...rometheus.html
The guy makes a lot of very good points (especially about the crew basically acting like a bunch of kids on a field trip ), and there's no disputing that the writing doesn't really hold up well under scrutiny...... but what can I say? Despite the many flaws, the movie still works for me.
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Old June 13 2012, 08:43 PM   #457
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

TremblingBluStar wrote: View Post
You do realize the man is 75 years old, right? He'll be dust before he ever reaches the lack of storytelling talent Lucas possesses.
We can rebuild him. We have the technology.

Gavin Rothery wrote:
The science in this whole film is total bullshit. At one point Vickers says they're half a billion miles away from Earth. Although it fluctuates, that's pretty much Earth to Jupiter. Miss Vickers is leading this mission.
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Old June 13 2012, 08:54 PM   #458
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

davejames wrote: View Post

The guy makes a lot of very good points (especially about the crew basically acting like a bunch of kids on a field trip ), and there's no disputing that the writing doesn't really hold up well under scrutiny...... but what can I say? Despite the many flaws, the movie still works for me.
IMO there is nothing worse than overly picky sci-fi fans. Star Trek XI can also be nitpicked to death. I remember some of the complaints:

*Red matter that looked like red thick paint.
*Why would you build a Starship on planet earth v. in orbit?
*The character 'Nero,' - yea another poorly written Trek bad guy.
*Here we go again with another time travel paradox to solve plot problems
*Giant space drills - yea like you need a giant drill when you have anti-matter that can destroy an entire sector. Why bother?
*If you're oging to skydive to a space drill, wouldn't it be smart to bring a parachute along?

I could keep going.

I still loved the movie. And I still enjoyed Prometheus.
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Old June 13 2012, 08:58 PM   #459
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

DarthTom wrote: View Post

*If you're going to skydive to a space drill, wouldn't it be smart to bring a parachute along?
They did have parachutes...
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Old June 13 2012, 09:05 PM   #460
DarthTom
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

BillJ wrote: View Post
DarthTom wrote: View Post

*If you're going to skydive to a space drill, wouldn't it be smart to bring a parachute along?
They did have parachutes...
And backup parachutes.
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Old June 13 2012, 09:07 PM   #461
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

chardman wrote: View Post
Warped9 wrote: View Post
That's the problem. This movie provided absolutely no answers.
You attributed this quote to me and I never said this.

I did say something along the lines of not everything is peeled out in big bright letters.
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Old June 13 2012, 09:15 PM   #462
DarthTom
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

Warped9 wrote: View Post

I did say something along the lines of not everything is peeled out in big bright letters.
Blade Runner ended with as many unanswered questions as Prometheus don't you think?

In other words, Scott has a habit of making the viewer keep guessing after the film about the implications of the future.
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Old June 13 2012, 09:30 PM   #463
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

That's what I like about him and that's what I like about this film especially.
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Old June 13 2012, 09:38 PM   #464
DarthTom
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

Mutenroshi wrote: View Post
That's what I like about him and that's what I like about this film especially.
I agree with you. Most films follow as noted below a standard story arc with 3 parts. Scott's films do not. The lack of resolution on major plot issues isn't a problem for me.




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Old June 13 2012, 09:50 PM   #465
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Re: PROMETHEUS - Grade and Discuss

Saul wrote: View Post
Quite a good review.

TremblingBluStar wrote: View Post
RoJoHen wrote: View Post
None of the characters got any kind of development.
None? At all? We find out Shaw's father died. We find out she cannot have children. There are two examples of how her character was developed.
That's not development. That's just the character's background details. If we discover she likes the color Blue that's not development.
In a better film Shaw's infertility would have been mentioned way earlier, and I think in a better film her reaction to finding out she was pregnant would have been very different. Here's a woman who can't have children, who's religious, and who's just seen the man she loves horribly killed. Now David tells her she's pregnant.

I'm not saying there'd have to be any big long moral debate, no endless soul searching, and clearly she's going to want it out of her, but just a moment or two where Rapace showed a smidgen of indecision about what was growing inside her...that would have been character development.

But this is a film that went from infertility to sex to pregnancy to C-Section in the space of, what, 10 minutes? Character development was clearly never really on the cards.

DarthTom wrote: View Post
davejames wrote: View Post

The guy makes a lot of very good points (especially about the crew basically acting like a bunch of kids on a field trip ), and there's no disputing that the writing doesn't really hold up well under scrutiny...... but what can I say? Despite the many flaws, the movie still works for me.
IMO there is nothing worse than overly picky sci-fi fans. Star Trek XI can also be nitpicked to death. I remember some of the complaints:

*Red matter that looked like red thick paint.
*Why would you build a Starship on planet earth v. in orbit?
*The character 'Nero,' - yea another poorly written Trek bad guy.
*Here we go again with another time travel paradox to solve plot problems
*Giant space drills - yea like you need a giant drill when you have anti-matter that can destroy an entire sector. Why bother?
*If you're oging to skydive to a space drill, wouldn't it be smart to bring a parachute along?

I could keep going.

I still loved the movie. And I still enjoyed Prometheus.
The difference is Trek was well paced, it was exciting and it had characters I could engage with in it, Prometheus had none of these things (aside from Fassbender) so since I didn't care about the characters, and since the film was so badly paced all I could do was see the glaring mess the script was in places!

I can get over plot holes, but there has to be something else to hold my attention, and pretty visuals alone ain't enough.
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