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Old May 10 2012, 02:52 AM   #121
tighr
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

Set Harth wrote: View Post
That was before he became a team player.
He's not even a "team player" in the first three X-Men films. In all three films, he's clearly only in it for himself. He even tries to leave multiple times.
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Old May 10 2012, 02:54 AM   #122
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

Admiral James Kirk wrote: View Post
But he may be playing nice with the rest of the team in First Class 2.
That article was written before First class was even released. Ultimately, Hugh Jackman did have the aforementioned cameo, where he tells them to eff off.
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Old May 10 2012, 03:35 AM   #123
A beaker full of death
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

M'rk, son of Mogh wrote: View Post

It's funny to see the hypocritical justifications

Get personal much?
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Old May 10 2012, 03:43 AM   #124
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

tighr wrote: View Post
Admiral James Kirk wrote: View Post
But he may be playing nice with the rest of the team in First Class 2.
That article was written before First class was even released. Ultimately, Hugh Jackman did have the aforementioned cameo, where he tells them to eff off.
It was only written about a month before the movie came out, though. It's not like they were still shooting. Singer's comments might be misdirection to conceal the cameo, but who really knows? Not that I'm crazy about the idea of Logan having amnesia yet again...
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Old May 10 2012, 03:45 AM   #125
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

I'm not crazy about Logan having an unhealing bullet hole in his adamantium skull. The only thing protecting his brain from injury is a thing layer of flesh. The idea makes my skin crawl.
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Old May 10 2012, 03:54 AM   #126
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

A beaker full of death wrote: View Post
M'rk, son of Mogh wrote: View Post

It's funny to see the hypocritical justifications

Get personal much?
Not at all, it's not a personal attack, it's a broad ranged one.

I didn't mean that directed at a specific person, I meant it for all of the hypocritical "fans" out there. I see this often enough on the boards I visit, and it's just funny how people twist things so that it fits "their" vision of what things are "supposed" to be, when really, these stories are supposed to be exactly how they're written, whether we like 'em or not.

You know, the old "This character NEVER does this!" but if it's there on the page, obviously they do.

It probably gets a bit trickier with the movies, though, as we can only go by what we see on the screen and their histories aren't as fleshed out, by any means. Which almost means that anything CAN happen, anybody CAN team up (provided the studios got along, etc) since a few hours of seeing these characters isn't as concrete as the 60+ years in the books.
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Old May 10 2012, 04:14 AM   #127
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

Admiral James Kirk wrote: View Post
I'm not crazy about Logan having an unhealing bullet hole in his adamantium skull. The only thing protecting his brain from injury is a thing layer of flesh. The idea makes my skin crawl.
Those who know more about the comics may correct me if I'm mistaken, but I thought Logan's admantium was grafted onto his bones, but not replacing his bones. If that's the case, there should be a hole in the adamantium covering his skull, but not in the bone, which would have healed.
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Old May 10 2012, 04:42 AM   #128
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

M'rk, son of Mogh wrote: View Post
Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
Like I said it's about personality. Spidey being a hardluck hero who can't catch a break and Logan being a borderline psycho/misanthrope.
Logan being borderline psycho is enough to keep him out of the Avengers for you.

Yet Hulk, Scarlet Witch, Hawkeye, Quicksilver and all are well-adjusted enough to stick around? Yeah, because the Hulk is SO much more predictable and easy to control than Logan.

"No more mutants" is a bit more than borderline psycho as well, if you ask me.

It's funny to see the hypocritical justifications for keeping Spider-Man and Wolverine away from the team. Spider-Man, who you can trust more than anybody to do the right thing, will put his everything into doing what's right, and will more times than not succeed, yet he doesn't belong? Crazy.
Yes they were, because they weren't actual psychos or villains when they joined. They were pawns, used by Magneto and the Black Widow respectively, to further their agendas. They each proved their worth and reformation time and time again. Pietro and Clint were hot heads, but never psycho. Wanda was never presented as a psycho for most of her stint either. She was often the heart and soul of the team.

The Hulk lasted for what, two issues and a half? Most of that time the Avengers were fighting him. He's never really been a member of long standing.

Not a fan of "no more mutants". Seemed out of character for Wanda.

As tighr said, these aren't real people. Spider-Man and Wolverine are in the Avengers because they help sell comics not because they've "earned it" or "deserve it"

Yes, I'm a bit old school when it comes to these characters. Spider-man without the "Parker luck" becomes just another wisecracking superhero. Wolverine needs to be a guy on the edge, who keeps that dark part of himself under control, never knowing when that control will falter.
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Old May 10 2012, 07:06 AM   #129
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

^
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Old May 10 2012, 07:09 AM   #130
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

Nerys Myk wrote: View Post
As tighr said, these aren't real people. Spider-Man and Wolverine are in the Avengers because they help sell comics not because they've "earned it" or "deserve it"
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Old May 10 2012, 02:24 PM   #131
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

I think Logan on the Avengers doesn't work because he's generally a loner who barely gets along with the X-men and because his personality should have him constantly at odds with guys like Cap, to the point where realistically they would probably throw him off the team. Remember, half the reason he was 'allowed' to stay with the X-men was because Charles wanted him there due to a sense of (for lack of better term) mutant solidarity, often over Cyclops' objections. There is no Xavier in the Avengers and most of the "big guns" there tend to be more like Cyke than Wolvie. I also think it overexposes the character to have him on two teams. But, obviously, current readers disagree.

Spidey is a bit more complicated an issue. Pre-marriage Spidey didn't want to join the Avengers because he considered himself a loner (there was probably also a bit of self esteem issue, namely, Spidey didn't have any). As he got older and matured it made a bit more sense that he join. However with the Mephisto reboot it is arguable that, again, he's more like the old Parker who wouldn't be a member of any group foolish enough to let him in.

In fact, I'd say the bottom line here is that Wolvie and Spidey both work best as "street level" heroes and, just as it is often difficult to realistically put Batman in JLA (either making him ineffectual or the "with enough prep time uber-Bat"), having Logan and Peter in Avengers is a creative challenge that too many writers aren't up to.
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Old May 10 2012, 03:12 PM   #132
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

For me, the Avengers are >< that far from being a government agency, completely unlike any other Marvel team. Books/teams like the Defenders were created to contrast them. The members should, by default, be "out of the closet" as superheroes. That hasn't always been the case, but the team has evolved that way. Steve Rogers and Tony Stark are no longer secret identities. The Avengers individual members should not ever be characters who are wanted for questioning.

I can go with characters like Luke Cage and Iron Fist, Ms Marvel, Thing (which feels weird, but he qualifies for membership of a S.H.I.E.L.D. sanctioned organization.) Spidey and Daredevil aren't a good fit because their lives keep them in the shadows. I could go with Wolverine as being a former Canadian government agent, he's a loner/misfit/outsider, yes, and that could be played up in the stories, but he basicly qualifies for government clearance.
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Old May 10 2012, 04:25 PM   #133
A beaker full of death
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

LaxScrutiny wrote: View Post
Steve Rogers and Tony Stark are no longer secret identities.
ugh. Don't get me started on that.

Otherwise, I largely agree with the above two posts.
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Old May 10 2012, 05:52 PM   #134
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

I hope that future films restore the idea of secret identies. It's a core element of the appeal of many superheroes. Otherwise they are just spies and government agents.

I know the thought is that's it outdated in this time high tech surveillance. But I don't buy it. Does anyone think my real name is Donald? We all are using secret identities on some level or another. Let them be metaphors for that with superheroes.

I noticed a minor detail in The Avengers. Towards the end a news reporter says that "Tony Stark's Iron Man Has been spotted" or something like that. Not sure if it means anything. But their could be skepticism whether he really wears the suit all the time.
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Old May 10 2012, 06:02 PM   #135
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Re: what's next for Marvel (movies)?

The "secret identity" of your username works here because, well, we don't know who you are nor do we have the capability of finding out. However, those with the skill to do so and those who run this board do since they have your IP address and the information you provided when you signed up for this account.

All of that can be used to back-trace and find out who you really are. And when we're dealing with Iron Man where Tony Stark openly admits who he is, Captain America who can be found through any number of records and such and Bruce Banner's public ordeals it's sort-of hard to really have a "secret identity" or to keep your super-hero persona silent.

I've no problems, really with it. I think in comic-book land the only heroes who're really tied to their secret identities are Superman, Batman and Spider-Man.

I mean, are we really missing anything by not seeing Thor having to spend time as a crippled doctor?
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