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Old March 14 2012, 04:08 AM   #31
throwback
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

The Citadel is important in another way. During the era of the Prothean Empire, the government housed their documents in archives located in the space station. When the Reapers assumed control of the station, the archives were seized by the machines and their allies who used this knowledge against the Protheans. What is there to say that the Citadel Council didn't do the same thing - store their documents in archives located in the station?

I am beginning to think that Cerberus deliberately allowed the Alliance to track Kai Leng to Cronus Station. With the Alliance's attention on this station, the Cerberus forces could lay siege to the Citadel. A major sub-plot in this game was the war between the Alliance and Cerberus, and it seemed the latter won the war.

A question that was never resolved is how Cerberus was able to stay ahead of Shepard. We know that there were agents working for Cerberus, but it seems that Shepard never conclusively identified the leak nor fix the leak. I would think this would be a major concern of Shepard, but apparently not.
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Old March 14 2012, 04:14 AM   #32
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$



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Old March 14 2012, 07:41 AM   #33
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

PsychoPere wrote: View Post
Some odd and/or interesting tweets from the official Mass Effect feed on Twitter:

Probably a good thing to be cautious of. [re: how could Ashley be on the Normandy if she was with Shepard]

We know it's a lot to take in! But hang in there. Your decisions matter.

There are a number of different ways the state of the galaxy can be left in. You decide that. Your decision matter.

Mike Gamble already said on his twitter, if the fans knew what was in store, the reaction would be different.

We can't saaaaay! [re: is that really how Shepard ends?]
Don't know what to say. Either they think the fans of the series are beyond stupid, or whoever's managing that account has a very poor understanding of the English laguage. Or both.
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Old March 14 2012, 07:46 AM   #34
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

Reverend wrote: View Post
Yeah, if they're intentionally holding back the "real" ending for a DLC they intend to charge for, that'd just be a grotesquely mercenary thing to do, to say nothing of being a very cruel joke. Can you imagine if J.K. Rowling had held back the "real" final chapter of 'Deathly Hallows'? People would have rioted.

I think the leading theory is that they ran out of time and threw this hodge-podge together out of whatever elements of the intended ending had already been done.

Good read BTW. I agree with just about everything that guy wrote. It's not because the ending was sad or because <insert name here> died, it's because it's not an end to the story we thought was being told. Hell, I mean at least the end of 'Matrix Revolutions' made sense in the context of the film and it was something they were building up to (rightly or wrongly) from the very beginning. ME3's ending feels like the drunken gatecrasher from a totally different game.

You know what annoys me the most though? This ending actually has me *complaining* about what's probably the best piece of interactive storytelling of all time. I didn't mind the lack of side missions. I didn't mind the mostly linear structure. I was too engrossed and invested to care. I'm not usually an emotional person (I'm downright callous at times) but I don't mind admitting this game had me close to tears on no less than four occasions. At the other end of the spectrum, I've lost count of the number of times I laughed out loud or sat through a whole mission grinning like an idiot (especially Grissom Academy!) This is still a *phenomenal* game and it's only because I enjoyed it so much that the ending felt like such a betrayal.
I completely agree. While playing ME3, I just felt like it was getting more and more epic with each passing moment. The moment leading up to the end when you're wounded and you're slowly walking to the conduit was fucking awesome. But they just had to piss on it. For christ sake, all they needed to do was toss in some mini-epilogue scenes that explained what was going on with all the races out there and I would have been fine...but they couldn't even do that. Instead we get an ending that rivals BSGs as the biggest letdown ever.
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Old March 14 2012, 08:20 AM   #35
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

If Bioware intends to include an extension of the third game into the DLC that marks a 'new ending' (which now seems apparent - however we still don't know for sure), it's not something that hasn't been done before - especially if Bioware intentionally designed the current ''end' to be such as it is.
ME2 included the Arrival DLC that deals directly with imminent Reaper arrival after all (although, it can be played before or after the suicide mission).

Being able to raise galactic readiness through the DLC in SP though (by say 10% or 15%) would be good though because I really don't like how MP was made so 'integral' to that particular aspect of the game.
That, or finding more War assets in the DLC to help SP gamers have a higher Effective Military Strength without MP.
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Old March 14 2012, 08:23 AM   #36
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

Im surprised so many people are having issues with galactic readiness. I maxed out my bar and I didn't even touch multiplier.
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Old March 14 2012, 10:27 AM   #37
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

Oh my bar was full as well. I had somewhere around 6000 in War Assets, which gave me a very nice looking bar. Galactic Readiness was something different though, and it remained at 50% throughout the entire game if you didn't touch multiplayer. This percentage is applied to your assets, and is called Effective Galactic Readiness. This effectively cuts the assets in half, and affects heavily what ending you will have. Well, not that they're that much different anyway.

I've read one or two tweets from Bioware people that seem to be giving me renewed hope that ME3 isn't actually finished yet. I realise that they will be releasing DLC like they did for the first two games, but the hints are towards something that will change our feelings about the ending. I do find it a bit odd that the rest of the game is this totally amazing experience, that gradually gets more and more epic and emotional as it goes on, only for it all to fall flat in the final 10-15 minutes.

Although I suppose that original Half-Life was grounbreaking for the time, only for it to fall flat on its face during the Xen levels.

I would find it a very cynical marketing move if Bioware were holding back a final level of some sort, unless it were free or relatively cheap. I'm not made of money and war assets you know! It's just be funny if instead of this ending, we'd actually been left with a cliffhanger. A bit like what nuBSG did with Starbuck in season three.

I'm also a bit frustrated - I found out that I must have accidentally saved over my ending. Yeah it was a crummy one, but it's saved over at the point just before I launched my attack on Cerberus, which was a good five hours or so before I got the end. Total bummer. I might be able to play it in a day or two when I've calmed down a bit more.
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Last edited by Seven of Five; March 14 2012 at 10:42 AM.
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Old March 14 2012, 11:39 AM   #38
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

Skywalker wrote: View Post
ATimson wrote: View Post
Skywalker wrote: View Post
If they captured it, why bother towing it all the way to the Sol system? With the Citadel, the Reapers can control the entire mass relay network. They could have shut down all of the mass relays in the galaxy, which would have effectively killed the organic resistance. Why didn't they do this?
Possessing the Citadel alone isn't enough for control, or else Council space would've had control long ago. (And we know they didn't, or the location of the Mu Relay wouldn't have been lost in ME1.)

Either the Crucible or the active intervention of the Catalyst (I assume the latter, and that the Crucible was just a macguffin...) is necessary for the mass relay network to be controlled.

So given that the Reapers can't control it themselves, towing it to a system with a crapton of Reaper ships to keep the pesky organics from getting at it is their best bet.
The Citadel controls the relay network, if you know how to do so. This was the whole crux of ME1's plot: Saren and Sovereign were seeking the Conduit so that they could access the Citadel, take control of the relays, and bring the Reapers back from dark space. The Council didn't control the relay network because they never bothered to learn how the Citadel or the relays worked; they were content to just use the technology left behind for them. Since the Catalyst controlled the Reapers, as soon as they recaptured the Citadel, it should have had them shut down the relays and proceed to harvest the galaxy like in every other cycle.
^What was also at the crux of ME1's plot was that the Citadel's hidden functions could only be activate by the keepers and the last Prothean survivors from Ilos made sure the keepers would no longer respond to reaper control (did nobody thing to study them for a defence against indoctrination?) necessitating a reaper agent accessing the controls manually. Sovereign couldn't do it on it's own, even sat right on the tower.

It does seem a bit incongruous with the revelation that Catalyst resides on or within the Citadel. If it can open and close the arms, why not the other functions? The shackled AI theory is looking a bit more likely. I mean if it was the instigator of it all then why limit it's own control? Maybe the keepers have been passively aggressively fighting the Catalyst all along? Actually, when the Catalyst first showed up, I half expected it to show it's true form was that of an original Keeper. That would have been interesting.

Either way, the reapers, or at least the Catalyst has defiantly been in Shepard's head. Why else would it use the image of a boy that's been haunting Shepard's dreams since she escaped Earth? Indeed, where else could it have gotten that image?
clint g wrote: View Post
Im surprised so many people are having issues with galactic readiness. I maxed out my bar and I didn't even touch multiplier.
I maxed out mine too, but on closer inspection, I was just over 200 points short. If I'd have been able to finish the bugged Aria & Kasumi quests and turn in those few side-quests before going to Tuchanka, it might have made up the difference.

Seven of Five wrote: View Post
I'm also a bit frustrated - I found out that I must have accidentally saved over my ending. Yeah it was a crummy one, but it's saved over at the point just before I launched my attack on Cerberus, which was a good five hours or so before I got the end. Total bummer. I might be able to play it in a day or two when I've calmed down a bit more.
I wouldn't worry about that, there is no endgame save as far as I can tell other than the auto save that puts you back just after Harbinger blasts you. The one that sticks you back at Cronos station is I think so people can play future DLC from this point, which is telling in and of itself. Whatever DLC they have planned, at least some of it must be completed *before* you destroy Cerberus and enter the endgame.

Last edited by Reverend; March 14 2012 at 11:52 AM.
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Old March 14 2012, 12:55 PM   #39
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

Reverend wrote: View Post
The one that sticks you back at Cronos station is I think so people can play future DLC from this point, which is telling in and of itself. Whatever DLC they have planned, at least some of it must be completed *before* you destroy Cerberus and enter the endgame.
Considering that you can't go to any location they put DLC at in a post-endgame state, that was a given.
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Old March 14 2012, 12:56 PM   #40
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

I can't verify this since I play on Xbox, rather than PC, but a poster on another board says there are three categories for save files:
If you use a save editor to adjust your game saves, all saves are categorized as follows:

Out in a Blaze of Glory
Unfinished
Live to Fight Another Day

Everyone who has finished a game with high ems (regardless of which end option they choose) has seen their save checked as 'Live to Fight Another Day'.
If true, this would seem to be more "evidence" in the theory that the current ending might not be the "real" ending. If there wasn't something still coming to add onto the end, then it seems odd that BioWare would bother classifying the save files in any manner - unless, perhaps, the intention is for that information to be reflected in a future game, rather than DLC for this one.


Another poster over there says that people using the free Mass Effect Datapad app for iOS are receiving an odd little message from the Virmire Survivor after completing the game.
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Old March 14 2012, 02:17 PM   #41
Deks
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

clint g wrote: View Post
Im surprised so many people are having issues with galactic readiness. I maxed out my bar and I didn't even touch multiplier.
Maxing out the bar in SP is not the problem.
The EMS (Effective military strength) number needs to be at 4000 in order to get the Shepard taking a breath in a pile of rubble clip after picking 'destroy synthetics' option (mine was at 3800 I think - while the total number of the fleet was double/close to 8000) - and for that to occur, you need to do ALL of the side-quests and find enough War Assets.

Galactic readiness in SP always remains on 50% if you don't play MP... which halves the EMS (and it's something I don't approve of - at least they could have given us the option to raise GR % by about 10% or 15% in SP - but this is directly because of EA's insistence to include MP option to prevent piracy - idiots... I don't like EA btw because of their silly DRM tactics, and I don't like software like Origin being 'mandatory installs' either).
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Old March 14 2012, 03:12 PM   #42
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

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Old March 14 2012, 03:25 PM   #43
Reverend
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

PsychoPere wrote: View Post
I can't verify this since I play on Xbox, rather than PC, but a poster on another board says there are three categories for save files:
If you use a save editor to adjust your game saves, all saves are categorized as follows:

Out in a Blaze of Glory
Unfinished
Live to Fight Another Day

Everyone who has finished a game with high ems (regardless of which end option they choose) has seen their save checked as 'Live to Fight Another Day'.
If true, this would seem to be more "evidence" in the theory that the current ending might not be the "real" ending. If there wasn't something still coming to add onto the end, then it seems odd that BioWare would bother classifying the save files in any manner - unless, perhaps, the intention is for that information to be reflected in a future game, rather than DLC for this one.


Another poster over there says that people using the free Mass Effect Datapad app for iOS are receiving an odd little message from the Virmire Survivor after completing the game.
Can't find where I read it now or I'd provide a link, but I've seen a rumour floating around that the ending was intentionally nerfed at the 11th hour because of the beta leak a few months back. If I remember this right some anonymous source (who reportedly has been right before) says the "real" ending is coming in the form of free DLC. Allegedly the leak prompted them to change the ending but they didn't have enough time to have it ready for launch.

Take that with whatever dosage of sodium chloride you feel appropriate. I know I wouldn't take my word for it. Still, if true it's a bit of a gamble on Bioware's part.
superdeluxe wrote: View Post
^I actually didn't have a problem with the basic premise of this, at least so far as it being the original reason why the cycle was created. Perhaps there was some ancient, million year long struggle between organic and synthetic life. What if the synthetics won and wiped out *all* life in the galaxy (if not the universe) but, like the Geth regretted that they had to do it and so recreated life in it's basest form anywhere where it might have a chance of survival, but set the cycle in place to maintain an equilibrium. A sort of evolutionary holding pattern for galactic civilizations until a more permanent solution is found. I think this is implied with the idea that the crucible wasn't started by the Protheans, or even the ones before them. It's pretty clear that it was started by whoever put the cycle into place.

And indeed the options presented are valid; destroy all synthetics and risk the whole thing starting over again eons down the line, take control of the cycle and show that (if you've made the right choices) organics and synthetics can co-exist or force a permanent and inexorable bio-synthetic fusion with everything from sentient races to plants and bacteria.

The problem was the execution.

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Old March 14 2012, 04:29 PM   #44
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

Indeed.
The initial reasoning for 'protecting organics' via preservation all that time ago may have been valid... but the current cycle demonstrated in ME2 and ME3 that synthetic life can coexist with organic life without necessity for mutual destruction.
Furthermore, the argument is based on an assumption of repetitive pattern - ignoring possibility of factors that could alter the said pattern (as it happened in ME2 & 3)

It's possible the kid's/reapers reasoning is 'locked' and cannot get past the premise 'synthetics will always rebel'.
We've certainly seen that pattern in the first ME game, however, it's been broken since then, and the original reason behind the Geth attacking the Quarians was self-defense (because the Quarians attacked first)... and of course there's EDI.
It's only logical that a machine locked in a certain frame of thought will not be able to look for other alternatives - hence why all options that we were presented with were all 'absolutes' (as the Reapers see them).

The way I see it, humanity entered the galactic community and picked from them that AI's are bad. Granted, EDI's initial struggle with self-awareness was more than problematic, but it was obviously dealt with by Cerberus in a delicate manner which later resulted in something 'good'.

But the first time I played it, I suspected that something is off and seeing the kid appear as the Catalyst was just way off which indicated that the machinery itself probably interfaced with Shepard and produced the image... but later on I started suspecting it could be Harbinger.

Either way... it would seem (although I could be wrong) that Bioware's angle on this is still out in the open and that the actual 'ending' has yet to come (along with more content to play through).
Man... combining all 3 games into a single play-through with all DLC's will definitely be a massive attempt.
Lol... well, maybe not as massive... but it would produce roughly 130 hours of gameplay with all DLC's and side-quests.
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Old March 14 2012, 05:45 PM   #45
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Re: Mass Effect 3 $$(ENDINGS SPOILERS)$$

You guys know anything about this 'truth' possible DLC?
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