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Trek Literature "...Good words. That's where ideas begin."

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Old March 27 2012, 02:53 PM   #1
Min Zife
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The Fall of Ben Sisko

Like others I have felt betrayed and saddened by the mess that came over Sisko in Rough Beasts of Empire. With DRGIII's new duology this is what I hope for in our favorite captain.

Shave your head. Grow your goatee. Go to Bajor, grab Vedek Kira by the pagh and both of you get your butts aboard that starbase they are building in the gamma quadrant and take command.
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Old March 27 2012, 03:01 PM   #2
rfmcdpei
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

Min Zife wrote: View Post
Like others I have felt betrayed and saddened by the mess that came over Sisko in Rough Beasts of Empire.
I was saddened, yes. I do not, however, feel betrayed. How can I feel betrayed by a defensible plot development, and by who?
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Old March 27 2012, 03:09 PM   #3
bok2384
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

I agree with rfmcdpei, I was saddened and angry at the development (at Sisko, not David George), so much so I flung the book across the room at the end of that scene.

However, we'll see how, and indeed if, George deals with this in the upcoming duology.
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Old March 27 2012, 03:14 PM   #4
ATimson
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

rfmcdpei wrote: View Post
Min Zife wrote: View Post
Like others I have felt betrayed and saddened by the mess that came over Sisko in Rough Beasts of Empire.
I was saddened, yes. I do not, however, feel betrayed. How can I feel betrayed by a defensible plot development, and by who?
Defensibility is in the eye of the reader.
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Old March 27 2012, 03:17 PM   #5
King Daniel Into Darkness
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

How betrayed? How is the poor guy dealing (not so well) with depression and a (justified) fear he'll bring death to all those he loves betrayed?

Perfect people living happily ever after makes for crap stories.
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Old March 27 2012, 03:50 PM   #6
Cybersnark
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

I agree that Ben has made some spectacularly bad decisions of late, and I really hope that someone is about to smack some sense into him. If not the Prophets, then maybe Jake, or Nerys.

What I really want to know is how Kasidy is dealing with this. I can't imagine that she's letting him go as entirely as he's let her go.

Hell, maybe she could show up on his doorstep and vebally tear him a new one (or better, on the Prophets' doorstep and tear them several new ones, since they're the ones ultimately responsible for this mess).
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Old March 27 2012, 03:53 PM   #7
Sci
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

I felt saddened, as I was supposed to feel saddened by the narrative. I did not feel betrayed -- it's not like DRGIII and I had some sort of agreement that he violated, after all. No one ever promised me that the characters in Star Trek would live happily ever after.

Sisko's direction in Rough Beasts of Empire isn't where I would have taken him, but I don't think it was an invalid creative choice. I'm interested to see where they're taking him next.
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Old March 27 2012, 04:17 PM   #8
Jarvisimo
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

KingDaniel wrote: View Post
How betrayed? How is the poor guy dealing (not so well) with depression and a (justified) fear he'll bring death to all those he loves betrayed?
Sisko's depression was so tangible throughout the book! The fact that that narrative was told from only his perspective really solidified the sense of claustrophobic hopelessness and loss of direction. DRG did a wonderful job at depicting the morose hopelessness, the totally introverted world-picture and resultant foolish, self-destructive decisions that a depressed person can take.

It was also certainly critical of the actions of its protagonist, given the strong narrative contrast between Sisko cutting off and rejecting all his loved ones, and that single un-introverted choice he made at the book's end in his lifeline conversation with his first officer.

Looking forward to what DRG does next - I really hope he didn't write the book, the first of which is now going to print, attempting to console those negative reactions to RBoE.
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Old March 27 2012, 06:58 PM   #9
shanejayell
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

It was a good book about a main character making bad choices. Nothing wrong with that. Looking forward to the duology.
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Old March 27 2012, 07:46 PM   #10
MvComedy
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

I got the impression, by the end of RBoE, that Mr. George was laying the foundation for setting the DS9-R onto a new track as a whole. Sisko definitely has the most reconciliation to do at the character level. In the bigger picture, though, the entire DS9 cast (both TV and original characters) has fractured, and if Pocket is going to get back to following DS9 as a series on it's own terms, there is definitely some shuffling to be done. The only major characters even left on the station are Ro, Quark, Prynn, and Bashir. Five (!) of the main characters have been promoted to captain (Sisko, Ro, Kira, Vaughn, and Dax), and not since Star Trek VI have there been more than three captains assigned to one post (and even that was a stretch of logic, but that was the Original Series cast so that was a little easier to suspend disbelief).

So I took much of the action for Sisko in RBoE to be eventually directing him back to becoming the commander of DS9 and the duology will result in him assembling/reassembling the crew. Of course it could just be my wild imagination.
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Old March 27 2012, 08:19 PM   #11
C.E. Evans
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

I admit that I wasn't very happy after reading Rough Beasts of Empire. To me, it represented Sisko at his worst. IIRC, Avery Brooks balked at the idea of Sisko officially dying at the end of "What You Leave Behind..." because he didn't like the idea of the Siskos being depicted as another African-American family (in both fiction and real-life) with a missing father figure, and I applauded that. It happening anyway in RBoE did piss me off.

But...I later reconciled it with the idea that this wasn't done on a whim, that there was a plan for the character beyond this book. This wasn't the real Benjamin Sisko we were seeing in RBoE. This one has been broken, perhaps even more so than the one that first came to DS9. Losing the goatee and regrowing his hair was the physical manifestation of him losing all that he had gained over the years. He's got to be now on a journey to find himself again and recover what's he's lost before it's too late.
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Old March 27 2012, 08:58 PM   #12
JD
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

I wasn't happy with the actions Sisko took in RBOE, and I definitely was not a direction I liked to see him take, or would have taken if I was writing him, but at the same I think it made perfect sense given how he's acted in the past. Just look at the end of DS9 Season 6, it ended with him leaving Starfleet and the station and hiding out with his father back on Earth. I think given everything that has apparently happened since The Soul Key, his actions in RBOE are perfectly in character with how he was portrayed in the show. At the same time, I don't doubt that this will eventually give way to him returning to Bajor and Kasidy once he has dealt with his current issues. So I'm really curious to see what will have become of him by the end of DRG III's new books.
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Old March 27 2012, 09:06 PM   #13
DonIago
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

I'm starting to think I really need to read this book.
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Old March 27 2012, 09:11 PM   #14
JD
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

You should, it's a really good book, and it give us our first good look at the Tzenkethi.
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Old March 27 2012, 09:55 PM   #15
Sjaddix
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Re: The Fall of Ben Sisko

Look I will take it as long as DRGIII has Sisko rise once again to new heights its all good but if he does not then yes Character Assassination of the most important minority (human) character in all of Star Trek would be unforgivable.
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