Why was Kes written off the show?

[Lynx]

^^
Tinkerbell shows up in a lot of different cartoons on TV now and then and has done so for many years. She has not aged a day either so I guess that means than Kes will live for almost an eternity too.

[Guy Gardener]

Tinks radioactive dandruff is what keeps the lost boys young.

Though if you read the book, Tinkerbelle was a jealous little minx.

She tried to kill Wendy in the 2nd act.

The little blond fairy felt like she was being replaced by a giantess.

Sound familiar?

[exodus]

Lynx wrote:

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^^
Tinkerbell shows up in a lot of different cartoons on TV now and then and has done so for many years. She has not aged a day either so I guess that means than Kes will live for almost an eternity too.

Unfortunately, that's not irony and you don't know your Tinkerbell well enough to remember she was a Judas. She sold out Peter Pan, Wendy and all the Lost Boys to Capt Hook.
The irony is the fact that Kes looks like Tinkerbell, a character that never grows up and will never die but yet Kes will grow old and die over a short period of time. Kes looks like Tinkerbell but is mentally Wendy, Peter Pan's love that didn't want to be young forever and left Neverneverland to grow old and have the life she never could with Peter. Ocampa was Kes' Neverneverland. The fact that she was facing her death in "Fury", it's natural she'd want to return to the place of her youth.

[Guy Gardener]

Are we sur that Tink was a child?

She was born in neverland i would have thought?

The Indians didn't age, buit they didn't fly either.

Ditto with the pirates.

Meh?

Although if Tink is born fully mature (just like Kes relatively speaking.) isn't it possible there's a sort of to catch a predator element going on with her prepubescent lad cattle?

[exodus]

Guy Gardener wrote:

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Are we sur that Tink was a child?

She was born in neverland i would have thought?

The Indians didn't age, buit they didn't fly either.

Ditto with the pirates.

Meh?

Although if Tink is born fully mature (just like Kes relatively speaking.) isn't it possible there's a sort of to catch a predator element going on with her prepubescent lad cattle?

Nobody flew without her pixie dust.
Remember, that's how Peter gets Wendy and her brothers to Neverland. They had to fly to the second star to the right and straight on till morning.

I'm going to assume Tinkerbell was a child cause Peter viewed her as an equal. He viewed Wendy as a mother figure. Remember he took her so she could babysit the lost boys and cook and clean for them.

Didn't hate Kes...but had problems with VOY until 'Seven'.

[Guy Gardener]

Peter didn't view anyone as an equal.

He's an asshole.

[teacake]

exodus wrote:

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Unfortunately, that's not irony and you don't know your Tinkerbell well enough to remember she was a Judas. She sold out Peter Pan, Wendy and all the Lost Boys to Capt Hook.
The irony is the fact that Kes looks like Tinkerbell, a character that never grows up and will never die but yet Kes will grow old and die over a short period of time. Kes looks like Tinkerbell but is mentally Wendy, Peter Pan's love that didn't want to be young forever and left Neverneverland to grow old and have the life she never could with Peter. Ocampa was Kes' Neverneverland. The fact that she was facing her death in "Fury", it's natural she'd want to return to the place of her youth.

So is Neelix Peter Pan? And who is Flotter?

[Lynx]

exodus wrote:

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Unfortunately, that's not irony and you don't know your Tinkerbell well enough to remember she was a Judas. She sold out Peter Pan, Wendy and all the Lost Boys to Capt Hook.
The irony is the fact that Kes looks like Tinkerbell, a character that never grows up and will never die but yet Kes will grow old and die over a short period of time. Kes looks like Tinkerbell but is mentally Wendy, Peter Pan's love that didn't want to be young forever and left Neverneverland to grow old and have the life she never could with Peter. Ocampa was Kes' Neverneverland. The fact that she was facing her death in "Fury", it's natural she'd want to return to the place of her youth.

Somehow I do get the impression that you really dislike Kes because you're always trying to find something negative about the character, even when there's nothing negative to be found.

When you mentioned Tinkerbell, I immediately thought of the Disney character who is always nice and friendly and looks the same today as she did when they started to make cartoons in the 1930:s or so.

Kes is no Judas. She was always loyal to the Voyager crew.

Kes is not Wendy either, the fact that she left Ocampa had nothing to do with aging or not.

And Kes is no insane monster either as those in charge tried to make it look in "Fury" with that pathetic creature which showed up there.

[JiNX-01]

I don't know anything about Jennifer's alleged drug abuse. And until someone shows me a picture of her with a needle in her arm, I'm not buying.

Having said that, IMO Kes and Harry were the least interesting regular characters, with Chakotay nipping at their heels for third place. I figure the producers weren't about to decimate the cast so they tossed three names into a hat, and Jennifer lost.

Voyager was in Borg space. So having Seven of Nine join the crew worked so much better. Her history as a Borg and her journey to recovery of her humanity was far more interesting than watching Kes handing hypos to the The Doctor, and setting Tuvok on fire (tho' I have to admit, that was pretty cool).

[teacake]

JiNX-01 wrote:

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Voyager was in Borg space. So having Seven of Nine join the crew worked so much better. Her history as a Borg and her journey to recovery of her humanity was far more interesting than watching Kes handing hypos to the The Doctor, and setting Tuvok on fire (tho' I have to admit, that was pretty cool).

7's story is my favorite Trek tale so I agree with you. I was also bored by the super powered ingenue.

[Guy Gardener]

The only difference between Data and Seven of Nine's Journey/story is that Data lost his virginity in the 2nd episode.

[teacake]

7 is only part toaster.

I never gave a fig about Data and his journey. It was nice for Geordie to have a friend though, even if it was a robot friend.

[Guy Gardener]

Data was dreaming the impossible dream.

Seven was just trying to get over her inner asshole.

Plenty of people have come out the other side of Mr Borgs Wild Ride as still reasonably normal polite and agreeable persons.

Sevens problem was that no one Voyager suggested that she might naturally be a grumpy, sour faced know it all, which was perfectly human behaviour and it was they too who was trying to modify her personality into something uncomfortable and perverse.

If you lost a bet, could you impersonate Geordi's personality for a day?

[teacake]

Guy Gardener wrote:

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Data was dreaming the impossible dream.

Seven was just trying to get over her inner asshole.

Plenty of people have come out the other side of Mr Borgs Wild Ride as still reasonably normal polite and agreeable persons.

Sevens problem was that no one Voyager suggested that she might naturally be a grumpy, sour faced know it all, which was perfectly human behaviour and it was they too who was trying to modify her personality into something uncomfortable and perverse.

She's surrounded by Starfleet cultists who want everyone to be well rounded. People who fail at that fail at life in their eyes. I went to a school ceremony a while ago and they were giving out awards for Best this and Best that.. but the kids that were best in math or best in science didn't get any awards because all the awards were based on well roundedness. If you didn't participate in school events and suck up to the sports teachers you got nada. Best Math and All Round Good Bloke Award. Never mind that the nerds in your class all got far better grades.

Anyway.

SEVEN: You made me into an individual. You encouraged me to stop thinking like a member of the Collective, to cultivate my independence and my humanity, but when I try to assert that independence I am punished.
JANEWAY: Individuality has its limits, especially on a Starship where there's a command structure.
SEVEN: I believe that you are punishing me because I do not think the way you do, because I am not becoming more like you. You claim to respect my individuality, but in fact you are frightened by it.
JANEWAY: As you were.


Seven should have replied with "No as YOU were, apparently."

If you lost a bet, could you impersonate Geordi's personality for a day?

Sure, I can always stand to get more sleep.