The OFFICIAL STNG Next Level Bluray watch and review thread

[RAMA]

Let's go with torches to CBS and find out what happened!!

Ahem, this is purely a joke...

[tomswift2002]

I was watching both the DVD and Blu-Ray at the same time for all three episodes and the problem was at the same amount for all three episodes. But it would be nice if CBS just did a widescreen version or just used the entire negative with no cropping (it's not like this would be the first time in Trek history where people saw revealing moments after the original release).

But, on another board I noticed someone asking whether the 7.1 audio is a 5.1 matrixed. I don't think that occurred since the 5.1 seems to have been matrixed from the 2.0 stereo master and some of the audio seems a little muddied and distorted when compared to the 7.1 audio. Of course I was listening to the sound track on a surround system that only outputs Dolby Digital and DTS 5.1 (with the ability to matrix a 6th rear center channel) and PCM 2.0, but the Blu-Ray audio still sounded crisper and more separated than the ZDVD audio. So I think CBS most likely did a proper 7.1 mix.

RAMA wrote:

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Funny that I didn't notice this. Possibly because there was MORE picture in the first episode on the disc, and never bothered to check the others..

[Hober Mallow]

Maybe the remaster team is just trying to punish us for being difficult. Some of us argued vociferously in favor of the original aspect ratio, against the top and bottom being cropped; others argued in favor of a widescreen version. The remaster team found a way to do it where neither side gets what they want.

[Sho]

^ That would almost be worth it .

Edit: They should ship an episode in 9:16!

[tomswift2002]

Sho wrote:

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Edit: They should ship an episode in 9:16!

Did you mean 16:9? 9:16 would be a very narrow and long picture.

[Sho]

That was the joke, see the preceding post by Hober Mallow for context.

[Maxwell Everett]

tomswift2002 wrote:

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I was watching both the DVD and Blu-Ray at the same time for all three episodes and the problem was at the same amount for all three episodes.

By problem, you mean the cropping was the same amount on all three? Hmm. That certainly runs directly counter to what I'm seeing. Are you viewing them both on displays that have a 1:1 mode -- that is, no overscan? I understand if you mean that while watching one or the other you don't see a huge difference (because there isn't)... but unless you're stopping both at the same moment and examining them closely or taking screengrabs, how can you be sure?

Of the three, "Sins" definitely has the re-framing issue. Again, what I'm seeing is that all the non-VFX shots are showing about 85% of what the DVD shows. "Encounter at Farpoint" and "The Inner Light" generally give us a bit more, around 100-102% or so.

Hopefully when TrekCore gets around to doing full galleries of "Sins" and "Inner Light" we can all check for certain... but you can compare "Farpoint" right now if you haven't already:

Blu-ray:
http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/thumbnails.php?album=1

DVD:
http://tng.trekcore.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=1

[tomswift2002]

My LCD doesn't have overscan, and I was starting the two different versions at the same time and pausing them at The same time. I was using both a PS3 and Sony DVD-Recorder both hooked up by HDMI. All three had the framing issues.

But I really wish that CBS would release the Blu-Ray in widescreen.

Maxwell Everett wrote:

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By problem, you mean the cropping was the same amount on all three? Hmm. That certainly runs directly counter to what I'm seeing. Are you viewing them both on displays that have a 1:1 mode -- that is, no overscan? I understand if you mean that while watching one or the other you don't see a huge difference (because there isn't)... but unless you're stopping both at the same moment and examining them closely or taking screengrabs, how can you be sure?

Of the three, "Sins" definitely has the re-framing issue. Again, what I'm seeing is that all the non-VFX shots are showing about 85% of what the DVD shows. "Encounter at Farpoint" and "The Inner Light" generally give us a bit more, around 100-102% or so.

Hopefully when TrekCore gets around to doing full galleries of "Sins" and "Inner Light" we can all check for certain... but you can compare "Farpoint" right now if you haven't already:

Blu-ray:
http://tng.trekcore.com/hd/thumbnails.php?album=1

DVD:
http://tng.trekcore.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=1

[Mr. Adventure]

It would've been interesting if they had put an episode in 16:9 on the sampler disc to judge reactions. Though the internet might have exploded if they had.

[Maxwell Everett]

tomswift2002 wrote:

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My LCD doesn't have overscan, and I was starting the two different versions at the same time and pausing them at The same time. I was using both a PS3 and Sony DVD-Recorder both hooked up by HDMI. All three had the framing issues.

All three are going to have slight framing differences of some sort because they are new scans of the negative on new equipment and the old tape masters have a slightly warped geometry to them. The new equipment is better, just as you'd expect. But with "Sins" we're talking about something else... it definitely has a unique level of cropping compared to the other two.

[NewHorizon]

tomswift2002 wrote:

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My LCD doesn't have overscan, and I was starting the two different versions at the same time and pausing them at The same time. I was using both a PS3 and Sony DVD-Recorder both hooked up by HDMI. All three had the framing issues.

They have framing 'differences' due to the new scan, but the other two episodes are nothing like Sin's of the Father, that one is cropped much smaller...whereas the other two episodes generally show a bit more than the old DVD scan.

As for 16x9...I'm glad they're going with 4x3 first...16x9 would be a completely separate project considering it would take some careful adjustments to frame everything properly.

[Trekker4747]

I don't understand the argument for making the show 16x9 for the Blu-Ray wouldn't doing that be for the same, stupid, reasons that brought us "full-screen" DVDs?

The show was filmed in 4x3, it was originally broadcast in 4x3 it should be presented in that format. Want it to fill the screen either to wear your TV evenly or because the "fill-in color" on your TV can be distracting? Then stretch the picture. Don't like the distortion? Deal with it.

Making it 16x9 would not work it'd very likely expose elements of production we're not meant to see or it'd just plain ruin the framing of shots which could have an impact on the scenes themselves.

Yeah, I watched the Next Level in 4x3 because on the BD the unused portions were black so I didn't find it any more distracting than when I watch a movie that's not 16x9 on my TV. Yeah, I'm slightly worried about un-even wear but I suspect in the long-run I'll be fine, I tried using "stretch" and such but the one that does it best wasn't available through the Blu-Ray (the setting that stretches the edges more than the center.)

Still, watch it in 4x3 and you'll be fine. I'd much rather have that then the mess that'd likely come from making the show 16x9.

[22 Stars]

Yeah, while i understand the desire to have the image fill a modern 16x9 screen, it just doesn't and wasn't created to.

[Sho]

I'm sorry for evidently rebooting the 16:9 sub-discussion . Let me point out I've poked fun and moaned at the "It should really be 16:9" faction on earlier pages, and the 9:16 jab was just more of the same.

[Mr. Adventure]

I have no problem with it being 4:3 as it originally was presented and in fact prefer it being available in that manner yet I still think it'd be interesting to see it otherwise. I remember posting a homemade clip here a long time back where I tried to crop it such that was not very will received.