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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > The Next Generation

The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old October 30 2011, 03:25 AM   #766
Maurice
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

Dracula's Castle wrote: View Post
A concept that eventually was realized as DS9's promenade. But if you think about it, the idea of having such in the Enterprise would have dated the show heavily to the 1980's.

I mean come on ... a "mall?"
A mall doesn't necessarily means a shopping center. It can also be -- like the National Mall in Washington D.C. -- a sheltered walk or promenade, like a downtown or public square, which is probably what Andy was aiming for.
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Old October 30 2011, 06:06 AM   #767
mswood
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

Prologic9 wrote: View Post
mswood wrote: View Post
Zombie Seeker wrote: View Post
I think the exaggerated relief on the 4 footer will look horrible in HD. You just have to take a look at a few screen shots of the 6 footer from Generations to know that there is plenty of detail in it. http://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/a...11/gen0636.jpg

Granted the 4 footer probably looked better on a small standard definition TV that was not able to pick up the subtleties of the 6 footer.
You do realize that new shots of the 6ft model in Generations are going to look better then the original ILM, let alone Image G, effects shots. They did a lot of detailing work and a different paint job, then what was originally done for tv.
I much prefer the original paint job. There was plenty of detail to it, and it felt much more appropriate to the design.

The Generations scheme tried to replicate the aztecking from the refit-E era (something ILM was never good at), and ends up looking like its covered in plaid.

Physically there's very little added detail, with the phaser stripes being the major upgrade.
Oh and the other major, major difference between original Generations ship shots and the ILM and Image G work done for the TV show is that they had a ton more time for lighting the damn model and making sure their passes where spot on.

Thats a luxury that tv schedules (even the longer schedule for the Pilot just doesn't allow). And lighting on models is extremely, extremely important in maximizes the work done in crafting the model.

As I have never seen the original model (with its original paint job and details) lit with the same care as the Generations work I can't say which paint job is better or if the increased details helped the look of the ship.

I can say that based on the unequal comparison we did have (cleaned up original footage, and newly created footage) I preferred the newly created footage. But my enjoyment of that could easily be due to the increase care and time in lighting the model.
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Old October 30 2011, 04:55 PM   #768
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

mswood wrote: View Post
Zombie Seeker wrote: View Post
I think the exaggerated relief on the 4 footer will look horrible in HD. You just have to take a look at a few screen shots of the 6 footer from Generations to know that there is plenty of detail in it. http://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/a...11/gen0636.jpg

Granted the 4 footer probably looked better on a small standard definition TV that was not able to pick up the subtleties of the 6 footer.
You do realize that new shots of the 6ft model in Generations are going to look better then the original ILM, let alone Image G, effects shots. They did a lot of detailing work and a different paint job, then what was originally done for tv.
Well, at least two shots in Generations were reuses from the TV show. And they looked quite good next to the new footage.
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Old October 31 2011, 12:03 AM   #769
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

Since WHEN is a mall "1980s"?? Do you know how many malls there are in the USA in 2011?

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Old October 31 2011, 02:12 AM   #770
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

RAMA wrote: View Post
Since WHEN is a mall "1980s"?? Do you know how many malls there are in the USA in 2011?

RAMA
Exactly. A saucer-wide promenade, with a vista into space, and shops and lounges the entire perimeter would actually be an interesting idea to see on a Starfleet ship. It's different from what we've seen before, and if done right, would've been an interesting glimpse into crew life.
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Old October 31 2011, 04:12 AM   #771
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

JJohnson wrote: View Post
RAMA wrote: View Post
Since WHEN is a mall "1980s"?? Do you know how many malls there are in the USA in 2011?

RAMA
Exactly. A saucer-wide promenade, with a vista into space, and shops and lounges the entire perimeter would actually be an interesting idea to see on a Starfleet ship. It's different from what we've seen before, and if done right, would've been an interesting glimpse into crew life.
You mean like a Promenade or something?
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Old October 31 2011, 04:21 AM   #772
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

Yeah, except, you know, going somewhere interesting.
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Old October 31 2011, 03:39 PM   #773
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

Trekker4747 wrote: View Post
Sorry about that, probably a flood control or image-stealing control by the host and my own image host is having issues right now so I can't share the image myself. But if you click on the second link, the article, the image is viewable from it's own thumbnail link. Right sidebar, under the headline "Illustrations" should be the second image under a sketch of officers looking out a window at the Bussard Collector on the starboard nacelle.
Found it. Thanks!
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Old November 1 2011, 05:28 PM   #774
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

My Name Is Legion wrote: View Post
Yeah, except, you know, going somewhere interesting.
Oh please, any TNG fan would love to stand on that promenade and gaze up at the Enterprise docked above it, compare its many lovely details to that slightly smaller Galaxy class that docked there a few weeks before...

We get trainspotters and plane spotters here in England but I wonder if there'd be Starship Spotters in the 24th Century?
Probably!

Didn't realise the 4ft was so universally hated, *shrug* Opened a bit of a can of worms now it seems.
Now I'm to depart before people start comparing the CGI Galaxy Model in Ds9 Sacrafice of Angels to the CGI Galaxy in Voyagers Timeless

(TBH A Galaxy has never looked better than Timeless imo. These are the Voyages included)
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Old November 1 2011, 10:02 PM   #775
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

The AVS-Forum has some nice insights regarding the aspect ratio, since someone has original film of TNG:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...269677&page=24

The inner red area is the image content used for TV/DVD releases:
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Old November 1 2011, 11:07 PM   #776
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

REmarkable. It means that with an enormous amount of work, they COULD restore a 16:9 picture. And then, with ANOTHER enourmous amount of work, they could erase all the boom mikes and cabling that would have been missed by keeping it the same.

Still, would that not be awesome for a theatrical edit of BOBW?

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Old November 1 2011, 11:10 PM   #777
RAMA
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

Salinga wrote: View Post
The AVS-Forum has some nice insights regarding the aspect ratio, since someone has original film of TNG:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...269677&page=24

The inner red area is the image content used for TV/DVD releases:

Nice find.
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Old November 1 2011, 11:25 PM   #778
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

That frame is a nice insight but I still doesn't look like a 16x9 version is practical. The framing is off-center and as the AVS poster noted, framing and matting changes may have been implemented over the course of the series. Anyone looking for 'widescreen' TNG can just hit ASPECT button on their remotes.
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Old November 2 2011, 12:08 AM   #779
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

As a compromise I suggest the yellow area. It crops top/bottom a bit of the overscan area, that the old TV sets didnt show (so it was practically never ment to be seen) and adds more information left/right from the original frame. The 16:9 version shows then black bars left/right.



So a Blu-Ray version of the TV frame looks like:


... and my suggestion would look like:
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Old November 2 2011, 12:43 AM   #780
Maxwell Everett
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Re: The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

Salinga wrote: View Post
As a compromise I suggest the yellow area. It crops top/bottom a bit of the overscan area, that the old TV sets didnt show (so it was practically never ment to be seen) and adds more information left/right from the original frame. The 16:9 version shows then black bars left/right.

... and my suggestion would look like:
What you've done there is to essentially expand horizontally out to the Academy aperture area, resulting in an aspect ratio of 1.54:1. It preserves the centerline but it's an even less standard aspect ratio than my "what if" example of 1.63:1, which preserves the vertical framing and is closer to the European 1.66:1 :



You might as well keep the intended vertical framing and expand out to Academy, which would give you about 1.50:1, matching closely the VistaVision VFX plates of the pilot. But, like all these compromises, it solves one problem and creates another. Which is why they're probably sticking to 1.33:1.
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