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Old November 7 2012, 04:00 AM   #2701
Timelord Victorious
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

Yes. Got timeout errors while in game and now can't even start the client.
They are aware of the problem and try to fix it. It's not STO specific, Champions seems to have the same problem.

In other news:

Season 7 pre-patch is up and Omega Conversion is available on Tribble now.
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Old November 7 2012, 04:03 AM   #2702
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

Thanks Timelord Victorious, glad to know it isn't just me.
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Old November 7 2012, 04:08 AM   #2703
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

Glad to know it's not just me either. Hopefully they will get it back up soon.
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Old November 7 2012, 11:31 AM   #2704
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

So how 'bout them conversion rates?
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Old November 7 2012, 02:49 PM   #2705
Timelord Victorious
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

Ok, here is my (unfortunately incomplete) results of the conversion.

Character 1: 5 EDC -> 500 Omega Marks, 3 Borg Neural Processors

Character 2 (starting value unknown, but it wasn't that much more than character 1): 1000 OM, 5 BNP

Character 3 (starting value unknown, but it wasn't much less than character 4): 2500 OM, 11 BNP, 3000 Dilithium Ore

Character 4: 173 EDC, 5 Proto Techs, 4 Rare Techs, 10 Proto Salvage, 20 Rare Salvage -> 3000 OM, 13 BNP, 4000 Dilithium Ore


Now compare what a typical Elite STF run results in:

Before the Conversion: 2 EDC
After the Conversion: 60 OM + 1 BNP

That doesn't take into account the occasional EDC drops from mobs, the occasional rare or proto salvages from Optionals and boss loot and the rare tech drops from boss loot under the old system.

The cheapest item you can get under the old system is a retro set piece Borg item for 5 EDCs.
The most expensive item you can get is a veteran MACO/Omega set piece item for 40 EDC=1 rare tech piece

There is no EDC value attached to Elite gear but it's clearly worth more than 40 EDC. If there were it would most likely be at least 80 EDC.

So presumably 40 runs of Elite STF to get a Elite Set piece if there were an EDC value to it. -> 80 EDC = 1 Proto Tech

I still have to do some math to figure out by how much Cryptic screwed me out of buing value here, but I think it is considerable.

Edit: With those values and presumably 40 runs for a Elite Set piece I can compare it to 40 runs under the new system -> 2400 Omega Marks, 40 Borg Neural Processors = 1 Proto Tech
Which I clearly don't get from the conversion, converting proto tech is definitely not worth it.

Or I could turn 1 Proto Tech into 2000 Dilithium Ore under the old system or my entirey stuff into 77,856 Dilithium ore.

Tech drops don't seem to count for much if anything at all in the conversion

ok, those tech drops and salvages are the Bonus, maybe I shouldn't take tose into account at all and consider them a bonus similar to Borg Neural processors. let's say I get roughly 1 salvage/tech drop in 3 runs, that about fits my number of them compared to my EDC.


My 173 EDCs equal 86 ESTFs -> 5160 Omega Marks + 86 Borg Neural Processors

Edit: I took the dilithium out of the equation, because I already got dilithium for those runs and don't want to double dip with the conversion.

Last edited by Timelord Victorious; November 7 2012 at 03:53 PM.
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Old November 7 2012, 03:51 PM   #2706
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

It converts VERY badly. And it's not even a percentage thing. They've had people showing that they convert and get a number. Then convert again with way less EDC/salvage, and get the exact same number.

Pretty much keep a little bit on hand to get something, I guess, but they're essentially completely screwing us again. It's not comparable, or fair value, they're in many circumstances just outright taking them away. Unless it changes soon, I'll just be cashing in most of my stock for DIL, or will vendor more sets of Retro Borg gear for EC...

I'd be pissed, but seems pretty par for the course here.
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Old November 7 2012, 03:55 PM   #2707
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

So basically its better to convert all our stuff to dilth before the conversion....or am i reading it wrong......not really up to scratch with the whole numbers side of STO.
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Old November 7 2012, 04:05 PM   #2708
Timelord Victorious
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

best value would be getting any gear pieces you still want if possible. Even if you convert into dilithium, it will still be ore, so only woth something if you don't hit your cap every day anyway.
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Old November 7 2012, 05:03 PM   #2709
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

at least that way, you get something for it, even if it takes a little while to convert it all.

Go earn another 10 EDC and rerun your conversion. Bet you'll have the same amount in the new system. The forum hasn't mapped it out enough to find the break points, but there are definitely categories where 1-10 = 1 amount, 11-20 = another amount, and so on. They've found spots where there's NO change from turning in, say 50 EDC or 100. Same exact value in new system. So once we feel out the limits better, you'll know what the most you should really keep is.

Real question, as always, is WHY. Why fuck over the players for no particular reason? Again. Don't want to flood the market, fine. But even if it's reduced returns, why isn't everything you turn in worth something? Worked to earn it, should have some value. Why is a Proto Tech worth a set piece now, but in the conversion, it's worth like a 10th of one? Aren't they the same thing?

I can at least see why they didn't want to publish this. It's not even a ratio, it's a flat-out Fuck You.
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Old November 7 2012, 06:04 PM   #2710
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

people on the STO forum are already doing spreadsheets and everything. So far they have estimated that there are about 19-20 tiers of Omega boxes.

With diminishing returns on higher tiers I think and bigger input requirements for each next tier.

What we lose the most is buying power for Elite gear because not much gets converted into Borg Neural Processors.
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Old November 8 2012, 03:15 AM   #2711
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

I've done some quick number crunching and here are some of my conclusions:

Overall, the conversion box is designed to give players bonus in Omega Marks, not Borg Neural Processors. In fact, the number of Borg Neural Processors is capped at a maximum of 15.

As many have noticed, there are about 15 conversion tiers.

Tiers 1-4 seem aimed at players who run normal (non-elite) STFs. Specifically, only in tiers 1-4 are Rare Salvage factored into the conversion calculations. From Tier 5 and beyond, all my regressions indicate Rare Salvage are either given somewhere between 0 to 10% weightage in tier calculation.

The little bit of good news is that at lower tiers, the EDC/salvage to Omega Marks conversion ratio is very good. At tier 1, you are getting 12.5 normal STFs worth of Omega Marks in exchange for 1-10 EDCs. The bad news is that bonus quickly becomes a conversion penalty at around Tier 5-6 where you loose out on a significant number of Borg Neural Processors and dilithium.

There is some indication that the STF accolades and/or number of STF runs play a factor into the quality of the box you get, especially at lower tiers. So even if you only have 1 EDC, it is very possible to get a tier 2 or perhaps even tier 3 box if you have > 40 of STF runs and a few MACO/Omega Force/Honor Guard accolades.

My conclusion is this, try to aim for either the tier 3 or tier 4 box for the optimum conversion rate. If you have a few STF accolades and around 15 EDCs, you should be able to get the tier 3 box which contains 1000 Omega Marks and 5 Borg Neural Processors. If you have around 20-40 EDCs, 10 Rare Borg Salvage and 10 Prototype Salvage, you should be able to get 1500 Omega Marks, 7 Borg Neural Processors and 1000 dilithium.
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Last edited by intrinsical; November 8 2012 at 03:34 AM.
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Old November 8 2012, 03:18 AM   #2712
Timelord Victorious
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

To compare what your box is actually worth:

Originally Posted by borticuscryptic
All of the following projects currently have a 40-hour duration. This is a variable that is under scrutiny however, and may change (they were briefly 2-hour duration on Tribble).


Mk X Ground Set (per piece)
Omega Marks: 250
Dilithium: 3500
Expertise: 1000
Commodity Price: ~6000 EC

Mk XI Ground Set (per piece)
Omega Marks: 375
Dilithium: 5500
Expertise: 32,000
Commodity Price: ~20,000 EC

Mk XII Ground Set (per piece)
Omega Marks: 500
Borg Neural Processors: 10
Dilithium: 9000
Expertise: 64,000
Commodity Price: ~40,000 EC


Mk X Space Set (per piece)
Omega Marks: 500
Dilithium: 15,500
Expertise: 16,000
Commodity Price: ~10,000 EC

Mk XI Space Set (per piece)
Omega Marks: 750
Dilithium: 20,000
Expertise: 48,000
Commodity Price: ~30,000 EC

Mk XII Space Set (per piece)
Omega Marks: 1000
Borg Neural Processors: 10
Dilithium: 34,000
Expertise: 64,000
Commodity Price: ~40,000 EC

** all of the above is subject to change!
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Old November 8 2012, 04:53 AM   #2713
intrinsical
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

I had lowly expectations of:

40 x EDCs -> 1000 Omega Marks
4-5 x Rare Salvage -> 1 Borg Neural Processor
2 x Prototype Salvage -> 1 Borg Neural Processor
+ diminishing returns when you convert anything more than 40 EDCs or 10 Prototype Salvage.

So I was pretty pleased that my estimates were in the right ball-park and that my decision to cash in most of my STF stuff for dilithium was correct.
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Old November 8 2012, 12:06 PM   #2714
Timelord Victorious
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

Slight update. The increased the amount of BNPs in each crate to double size since the last patch.
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Old November 8 2012, 02:51 PM   #2715
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Re: Star Trek Online Discussion Thread (now free to play!)

Nobody should be shocked that if you walk into this system with enough stockpiled to outfit every character you could ever possibly have with full gear, you will not walk out of it in that same state. People not having a reason to play anymore is part of what they were trying to fix. The minute they announced a conversion was coming, you *KNEW* it was not going to be "one for one"; deflation of the currency was inevitable.

The only question was whether you'd benefit more by losing your surplus but getting enough new currency to outfit who you need to outfit, or by selling/cashing in your surplus before the conversion. That you'd lose quantity in the conversion was implicit.
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