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Old September 3 2011, 06:24 PM   #16
Bernard Guignard
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

Science Officer wrote: View Post
Hi Ricky,

It's a brave person who attempts this. When you consider the differences between the TOS 1701 and the TMP 1701, you actually have quite a bit of room for manouvre on where you take it.

To me, the ship looks unbalanced - it's as if the back of the secondary hull is drooping. I think what is bugging me is a lack of horizontal lines.

On the secondary hull, you need to balance the hull around that centre axis. I've quickly painted (very badly) in a different undercut to show what I mean. I think what I'm aiming at is a more teardrop shape.

I've also tweaked the warp nacelles, so the grey stripe is horizontal instead of sloping upwards. I've also slimmed down the front.

Of course please feel free to deposit the ideas in the nearest bin! Afterall it's your ship!

Cheers,
S.O.

I'd keep the warp engines where they are but move the support pylons back to so that pylon Mid point meets with the mid point of the warp engine I'd sharpen the undercut to give more secondary hull
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Old September 3 2011, 07:12 PM   #17
Science Officer
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

Here's a cleaned up secondary hull.

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Old September 3 2011, 08:54 PM   #18
MadMan1701A
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

Yeah, I see what you're saying... but I still like the look of the nacelles too much, to remove the lower "scoop" section.

As far as the horizontal line goes, I was going to have a larger, more traditional pinstripe down the middle.

I still like the severe undercut, though. I don't know why, it just looks "right" to me.

Well, here's the comparison...



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Old September 3 2011, 08:56 PM   #19
publiusr
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

My only beef with the original design is the saucer's lower dome has the surrounding sensor array on it that seems a bit too large. I wonder what a jjprice saucer top above a TMP lower saucer might look like, and vice versa...
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Old September 3 2011, 09:00 PM   #20
Gojira
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

Science Officer wrote: View Post
Here's a cleaned up secondary hull.

After seeing the larger secondary hull I do like the size but I like how the undercut went in your original.
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Old September 3 2011, 09:29 PM   #21
Science Officer
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

MadMan1701A wrote: View Post
Yeah, I see what you're saying... but I still like the look of the nacelles too much, to remove the lower "scoop" section.

As far as the horizontal line goes, I was going to have a larger, more traditional pinstripe down the middle.

I still like the severe undercut, though. I don't know why, it just looks "right" to me.
That's fair enough - you've got to go with your own instincts and create the ship with the style cues you want.


Now that there is a comparison image, it's definately the lack of horizontal cues in the secondary hull that is bothering me. The things that lend to this are:
  • The introduction of the TMP style torpedo bay.
  • A slight straightening of the spine (to accomodate the torpedo bay).
  • The change from a long base where the warp pylons join the secondary hull.
  • Smoothed out hull - now symmetrical above/below the deflector dish.
These give the rear 50% of the hull the feeling like its on a 5 degree downslope - almost like it's starting to melt.

Concerning my own "tweak", I was thinking what would it be like if you were to introduce a stripe styled similar to one of the three "deflector rings" that run around the saucer rim?

Concerning the warp nacelles. OK the scoop bits could be kept. But again the nacelle stripes are on a slight upslope, which to me doesn't work.

Cheers,
S.O.
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Old September 3 2011, 10:16 PM   #22
spiff628
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

Awesome, I can see that you really put a great deal of thought into your design,not just for aesthetics either, it looks logical for the better part of the word.
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Old September 3 2011, 10:39 PM   #23
Crazy Eddie
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

Mad.... I like the beefy nacelles too, but one of the most visible differences in the TOS-refit was the brand new warp/impulse engines installed on the ship. A bit of originality is definitely called for.

Might I suggest that a similar transition from TOS/TMP could be applied? Say, remove the entire forward dome and expand the "lower scoop" so that it's actually the lower end of a much larger assembly that takes up the entire front end of the nacelle? I'm thinking you would probably end up with something that resembles the front end of a colonial viper, although with the angles involved it might end up looking more like the Enterprise is flying around with a couple of planet killers for engines.
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Old September 4 2011, 12:20 AM   #24
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

Yes, yes yes yes yes yes.
She's wonderful.
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Old September 4 2011, 02:34 AM   #25
MadMan1701A
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

publiusr wrote: View Post
My only beef with the original design is the saucer's lower dome has the surrounding sensor array on it that seems a bit too large. I wonder what a jjprice saucer top above a TMP lower saucer might look like, and vice versa...
Interesting idea... but one thing I like about the STXI ship is that it doesn't have an undercut area underneath the saucer. So, to make the bottom smaller so it can accommodate a smaller sensor array, it would have to come down farther, or slope in faster.

Space Therapist wrote: View Post
Science Officer wrote: View Post
Here's a cleaned up secondary hull.
After seeing the larger secondary hull I do like the size but I like how the undercut went in your original.


Science Officer wrote: View Post
MadMan1701A wrote: View Post
Yeah, I see what you're saying... but I still like the look of the nacelles too much, to remove the lower "scoop" section.

As far as the horizontal line goes, I was going to have a larger, more traditional pinstripe down the middle.

I still like the severe undercut, though. I don't know why, it just looks "right" to me.
That's fair enough - you've got to go with your own instincts and create the ship with the style cues you want.


Now that there is a comparison image, it's definately the lack of horizontal cues in the secondary hull that is bothering me. The things that lend to this are:
  • The introduction of the TMP style torpedo bay.
  • A slight straightening of the spine (to accomodate the torpedo bay).
  • The change from a long base where the warp pylons join the secondary hull.
  • Smoothed out hull - now symmetrical above/below the deflector dish.
These give the rear 50% of the hull the feeling like its on a 5 degree downslope - almost like it's starting to melt.

Concerning my own "tweak", I was thinking what would it be like if you were to introduce a stripe styled similar to one of the three "deflector rings" that run around the saucer rim?

Concerning the warp nacelles. OK the scoop bits could be kept. But again the nacelle stripes are on a slight upslope, which to me doesn't work.

Cheers,
S.O.
Yeah, I think I can see what you're saying, but as long as the floor level of the shuttle bay is horizontal, it doesn't really seem to droop.

The deflector ring detail is an interesting idea though... I might play with that.

spiff628 wrote: View Post
Awesome, I can see that you really put a great deal of thought into your design,not just for aesthetics either, it looks logical for the better part of the word.
Thanks. I was trying to get the big torpedo deck in there, for sure, since it's one of my favorite parts of the "real" refit.

newtype_alpha wrote: View Post
Mad.... I like the beefy nacelles too, but one of the most visible differences in the TOS-refit was the brand new warp/impulse engines installed on the ship. A bit of originality is definitely called for.

Might I suggest that a similar transition from TOS/TMP could be applied? Say, remove the entire forward dome and expand the "lower scoop" so that it's actually the lower end of a much larger assembly that takes up the entire front end of the nacelle? I'm thinking you would probably end up with something that resembles the front end of a colonial viper, although with the angles involved it might end up looking more like the Enterprise is flying around with a couple of planet killers for engines.
Thanks. I definitely am going to be changing the insides of the dome, but I'm still not entirely sure what's going to be going on in there. I'm trying to think of something besides big fan blades...

Johnnymuffintop wrote: View Post
Yes, yes yes yes yes yes.
She's wonderful.


Have fun, guys. I'll be working on this thing in the morning.

-Ricky
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Old September 4 2011, 02:42 AM   #26
Herkimer Jitty
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

Science Officer wrote: View Post
Here's a cleaned up secondary hull.

The proportions remind me of the Metaluna.
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Old September 4 2011, 06:26 PM   #27
Science Officer
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Location: United Kingdom
Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

One last attempt. In this one I've increased the undercut and changed the curvature of the spine.

Cheers,
S.O.
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Old September 4 2011, 07:39 PM   #28
YARN
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

It's a significant improvement over the nuPrise, but that's kind of like saying that it's better than a sharp stick in the eye.

I'd like to see you play with the shapes more. I think you can keep the sort of identifiable look of the nuPrise as a refit and make more ambitious changes to it.

At any rate, it's always fun to see variations on a theme.

The tail (back end of the secondary hull) seems a bit too long.

The neck looks much better, but it would be nice to see it move a bit forward...

Maybe a (partially) convex deflector dish (rolling with the metaluna vibe)?
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Old September 4 2011, 07:57 PM   #29
judexavier
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

Oh what the hell.
I know, perhaps a bit too...traditional?
(The word "REFIT" stuck in my head...)

http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/g...r/WIP014-2.jpg

Being more serious, for the dome guts, what about revisiting
that earlier Church sketch, with the cool exotic looking "reverse turbine" structure? For some reason, that seemed more "bussard/matter-sucking" than what they ended up using.
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Old September 4 2011, 09:11 PM   #30
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Re: The STXI Enterprise... REFIT!

Very awesome judexavier
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