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Old September 18 2011, 10:56 PM   #601
Myasishchev
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

Admiral_Young wrote: View Post
^ I'm still concerned with this new direction they are taking Supergirl in. Once again we get a totally new version of her. Seems this happens once every few years or so. Crisis. John Bryne Matrix version. Peter David angel version. Michael Turner version, and of course Karen Starr. Sigh. LOL.
Well, I've got no particular problem with the one-sentence pitch as given for the Mikes' Supergirl ongoing. It'd be my one-sentence pitch too, and if you're going with the cousin from Krypton angle, i.e. not introducing weird new stuff like the Matrix and pocket universes and earth-born angels (...kay), it's almost necessary.

But what's "mysterious" about her origin? She's the last acculturated survivor of a dead race, who has powers, and is in tension with the other survivor, who is effectively human.

Supergirl's origin is kind of obvious, and if it's not, you're missing the point entirely--that should be pretty upfront, because the point is how she survived and everyone else died.

That said, I found an interview with the Mikes that actually sounds like they sort of get it, although they might be committing the mistake, as have so many others, of treating Supergirl as a "teenager." Technically true, but this has never, ever really worked, with the possible exception of David's run, which is really more like a Tangent Universe property. It didn't work when Binder did it, but at least that gets a pass for being Silver Age nonsense with no sort of psychological realism, but it really didn't work when Loeb and Kelley and Puckett did it. They leaven this impression with the notion that they at least seem to grasp that she's an alien, and that the "survivor of a planetary holocaust" aspect is a bit more important than the "young and stupid" aspect.

Some choice bits:

Mike Johnson wrote:
We'll also be bringing back a character who used to be on both sides of the hero/villain equation and hasn't been seen for awhile. This person was associated with the Justice League. But when we started talking about the character, it seemed like this character would be a great foil for Supergirl.
Oh God. They're bringing back Triumph, aren't they?

Actually, I'm strangely okay with that...

Mike Green wrote:
We talked about action, and wow, Mahmud's action scenes are amazing. We have a huge gift here that we get to work with Mahmud. I feel like we don't even need to write a script... we just need to let him draw pictures of Supergirl flying around Earth and hitting villains...
That line is delightful, in that it could be so easily taken out of context.

theenglish wrote:
I don't get this though. When Superboy was created, Luthor was in a clone body posing as his own son. When Cadmus took Superman's body to clone it, Luthor, Lois, and Supergirl worked to stop them. Did the retcon just completely ignore this story altogether? (I actually thought that this was just a Smallville invention originally.)
Yeah, I dunno if that still happened (well, it definitely didn't now). He wasn't even born in Metropolis anymore. DC hates John Byrne, you see.
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Old September 18 2011, 11:18 PM   #602
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

Yeah unless they've completely changed Kara's origin. I believe in the second issue they tease a fight between her and Clark. This Superman seems to be angry (hence the pissed off heat vision eyes all the time) or implied or teased to be fighting people all the time
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Old September 18 2011, 11:29 PM   #603
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

Viz. Kara vs. Kal, I'm just glad they didn't pry my really cool Perez homage idea from my mind.

Oh, and P.S., according to the scant preview images I could find the Mikes don't like compressed storytelling very much, and burn pages like they need them to stay warm. But I can weigh in more fairly on this on Wednesday.
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Old September 18 2011, 11:59 PM   #604
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

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Plus IIRC that little revelation was during Geoff Johns Teen Titan run. I doubt they would undo something Johns implemented.
In fairness, it's one of the better ideas Johns ever came up with.
I don't get this though. When Superboy was created, Luthor was in a clone body posing as his own son. When Cadmus took Superman's body to clone it, Luthor, Lois, and Supergirl worked to stop them. Did the retcon just completely ignore this story altogether? (I actually thought that this was just a Smallville invention originally.)
The cloning of Superboy occurred before Luthor had to transfer his body.
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Old September 19 2011, 12:25 AM   #605
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

Hound of UIster wrote: View Post
theenglish wrote: View Post
Myasishchev wrote: View Post
In fairness, it's one of the better ideas Johns ever came up with.
I don't get this though. When Superboy was created, Luthor was in a clone body posing as his own son. When Cadmus took Superman's body to clone it, Luthor, Lois, and Supergirl worked to stop them. Did the retcon just completely ignore this story altogether? (I actually thought that this was just a Smallville invention originally.)
The cloning of Superboy occurred before Luthor had to transfer his body.
IIRC It happened AFTER Funeral for a Friend which was long after Luthor changed bodies--that said, there's no reason CADMUS couldn't have obtained Luthor's DNA at an earlier point.
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Old September 19 2011, 12:26 AM   #606
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

It's implied that it was done in secret. So it's probably logical to assume that when they cloned Lex the first time they were able to get the DNA at that point. Then when they obtained the Kryptonian samples afterwards they combined the two to create Connor.
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Old September 19 2011, 12:30 AM   #607
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

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It's implied that it was done in secret. So it's probably logical to assume that when they cloned Lex the first time they were able to get the DNA at that point. Then when they obtained the Kryptonian samples afterwards they combined the two to create Connor.
Well, this is what I was referring to earlier. At some point (I guess in the Teen Titans according to a poster above), Superboy went from having NO Kryptonian DNA to having Kryptonian DNA. I was wondering if there was some way to reconcile the two versions, but it just seems as if it was a complete retcon of his origin.
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Old September 19 2011, 12:33 AM   #608
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

^ Either way it doesn't really matter now.
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Old September 19 2011, 12:33 AM   #609
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

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Plus IIRC that little revelation was during Geoff Johns Teen Titan run. I doubt they would undo something Johns implemented.
Well, they are dumping everything he did on Hawkman.
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Old September 19 2011, 12:40 AM   #610
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

^ That's true. Maybe the human DNA will turn out to be someone else's.
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Old September 19 2011, 02:38 AM   #611
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

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^ Either way it doesn't really matter now.
Yes, that is true. I was thinking about picking up the new Teen Titans series though. Anyone have an idea how much the two of these books are going to be connected?
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Old September 19 2011, 03:19 AM   #612
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

^ The end of Superboy #1 number one implied that there will be a very big connection at least with Project NoWhere's intentions with Superboy.
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Old September 19 2011, 03:42 AM   #613
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

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I don't get this though. When Superboy was created, Luthor was in a clone body posing as his own son. When Cadmus took Superman's body to clone it, Luthor, Lois, and Supergirl worked to stop them. Did the retcon just completely ignore this story altogether? (I actually thought that this was just a Smallville invention originally.)
The cloning of Superboy occurred before Luthor had to transfer his body.
IIRC It happened AFTER Funeral for a Friend which was long after Luthor changed bodies--that said, there's no reason CADMUS couldn't have obtained Luthor's DNA at an earlier point.
You are wrong. The cloning of Superbody was done with the supervision of Luthor, in his original body, behind Westerfield's back.
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Old September 19 2011, 04:19 AM   #614
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

^^^^ Right, this was the retcon I was asking about originally, which has already been explained. Back during the Reign of Superman era though, it was "correct".

Of course, everything has been changed now.

Do people feel the new Superboy is worth buying? I wasn't overly impressed with the artwork, but from what I've heard of the story, it sounds compelling.
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Old September 19 2011, 04:20 AM   #615
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Re: DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

^ I'll be following it and I was very hesitant at first. It's fascinating.
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