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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > The Next Generation

The Next Generation All Good Things come to an end...but not here.

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Old October 5 2011, 05:27 PM   #511
Sean Aaron
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
LOL, how the hell do you make DVDs unplayable?
I dunno. Some of the media used just seems to be crap. This all kicked off for me because a DVD I have just refused to play in any of my players beyond a certain point into the film with no visible surface damage. This DVD like many others in my collection, is nearly 15 years old.

Yesterday I was trying to view the first disc in a TV series and the surface was tacky and actually adhered to my fingers. I had to just bin it and download the episodes from iTunes. That disc was maybe five or six years old. Honestly if they announced the death of DVD tomorrow I wouldn't shed a tear.
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Old October 5 2011, 05:29 PM   #512
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
LOL, how the hell do you make DVDs unplayable?
Perhaps the layers are starting to separate.
These discs do have a limited life-expectancy.
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Old October 5 2011, 06:04 PM   #513
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

beamMe wrote: View Post
JarodRussell wrote: View Post
LOL, how the hell do you make DVDs unplayable?
Perhaps the layers are starting to separate.
These discs do have a limited life-expectancy.

When I converted totally over to DVD (ditching, rebuying, or converting vhs to DVD) DVD discs were supposed to last for a 100 years! So far I've had none fail that I know of.

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Old October 5 2011, 06:50 PM   #514
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

RAMA wrote: View Post
When I converted totally over to DVD (ditching, rebuying, or converting vhs to DVD) DVD discs supposedly were supposed to last for a 100 years!
In a perfect environment I'm sure the discs would last that long. However I doubt most people maintain a perfect 70 degrees with zero humidity day in and day out.
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Old October 5 2011, 08:17 PM   #515
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

Yeah people love that film grain...though I have heard that STII bluray is a much improved picture from the DVD version!
I will say that the current bluray of ST II is not excellent. The clarity is there, but the colors are all shifted slightly to the Blue. Ceti Alpha V is now grey instead of Brown and that just isn't right.
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Old October 5 2011, 08:35 PM   #516
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

Screamy wrote: View Post
RAMA wrote: View Post
When I converted totally over to DVD (ditching, rebuying, or converting vhs to DVD) DVD discs supposedly were supposed to last for a 100 years!
In a perfect environment I'm sure the discs would last that long. However I doubt most people maintain a perfect 70 degrees with zero humidity day in and day out.
I don't, and nothing's broken yet.
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Old October 5 2011, 11:23 PM   #517
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

22 Stars wrote: View Post
Yeah people love that film grain...though I have heard that STII bluray is a much improved picture from the DVD version!
I will say that the current bluray of ST II is not excellent. The clarity is there, but the colors are all shifted slightly to the Blue. Ceti Alpha V is now grey instead of Brown and that just isn't right.

Really? I was going mostly by the large number of Amazon.com reviews. People seem to be quite happy with the picture. I haven't felt a need to buy the blurays because of a little noise reduction though.

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Old October 6 2011, 02:16 PM   #518
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

JarodRussell wrote: View Post
Screamy wrote: View Post
RAMA wrote: View Post
When I converted totally over to DVD (ditching, rebuying, or converting vhs to DVD) DVD discs supposedly were supposed to last for a 100 years!
In a perfect environment I'm sure the discs would last that long. However I doubt most people maintain a perfect 70 degrees with zero humidity day in and day out.
I don't, and nothing's broken yet.
You also haven't had DVDs for 100 years.
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Old October 6 2011, 02:25 PM   #519
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

The same was true for CDs though: a lot of outfits make the media and do the pressing and some are good quality and some are shit. It's only become apparent as the media get past the decade mark. I expect if I went through my CD collection (ripped over a year ago) and tried playing some of them I'd have problems as a lot of those discs are over a quarter-century old and frankly we were sold a bill of goods on their longevity.

I expect vinyl will turn out to be a more durable medium than any current optical format for the simple reason that it doesn't involve using adhesives to bond layers of plastic together sealing in a layer of material that's susceptible to oxidation.
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Old October 6 2011, 02:58 PM   #520
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

Sean Aaron wrote: View Post
I expect vinyl will turn out to be a more durable medium than any current optical format for the simple reason that it doesn't involve using adhesives to bond layers of plastic together sealing in a layer of material that's susceptible to oxidation.
More durable if you never play the record, perhaps, but at least CDs aren't damaged by listening to them!
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Old October 6 2011, 03:04 PM   #521
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

ATimson wrote: View Post
More durable if you never play the record, perhaps, but at least CDs aren't damaged by listening to them!
One of the things that pissed me off about the forced move from vinyl to CD is that you actually could read a vinyl record with a laser as well - there's actually no need for playback to degrade the medium.

Of course if laser-based record players existed then the music industry wouldn't have been able to force people to adopt their new format more quickly than it did. I know I wouldn't have made the switch in '88, but when the record labels simply stopped pressing LPs for most things I didn't have much choice.
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Old October 6 2011, 04:15 PM   #522
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

CD's are also far, far more convenient than vinyl. They are small, easy to store and carry, and you can have a portable player. LPs are 30cm across and relatively fragile. CDs are 12cm in diameter, and are pretty tough. You can jump to any track and any point within a track in an instant. They can hold video as well as audio. You can have a CD player in your car. People didn't adopt them just because record companies made us - if that had been the case, betamax and laserdisc probably would have been more successful than they turned out to be...
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Old October 6 2011, 04:40 PM   #523
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

Tomalak wrote: View Post
People didn't adopt them just because record companies made us - if that had been the case, betamax and laserdisc probably would have been more successful than they turned out to be...
That is true, but they forcibly accelerated uptake. I can assure you that by 1988 CD sales were not that massive. It wasn't until record companies simply stopped pressing vinyl that you saw a wholesale explosion of the format in record stores. I was definitely interested in the format and recognised the advantages, but I probably would have waited until there was a larger catalogue before picking up a CD player.
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Old October 6 2011, 04:47 PM   #524
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

RAMA wrote: View Post
22 Stars wrote: View Post
Yeah people love that film grain...though I have heard that STII bluray is a much improved picture from the DVD version!
I will say that the current bluray of ST II is not excellent. The clarity is there, but the colors are all shifted slightly to the Blue. Ceti Alpha V is now grey instead of Brown and that just isn't right.

Really? I was going mostly by the large number of Amazon.com reviews. People seem to be quite happy with the picture. I haven't felt a need to buy the blurays because of a little noise reduction though.

RAMA
Yeah, i started a thread about it some time ago, because I was so surprised and disappointed at the difference

http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=118964

The other TOS movie blurays look great to me.
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Old October 6 2011, 04:54 PM   #525
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Re: FX/editing wishlist/technical/related discussion for STNG-R

RAMA wrote: View Post
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Dick_Valentine wrote: View Post
The fact is, recomposit or not, some of the FX will still look dodgy (especially the first 2 seasons as well as the classic "phaser fire out of the torpedo tube" blooper) HD or not, so when they announced no new FX my money was mentally repositioned from a future DVD purchase to being spent on something else.
You realize that all the compositing and F/X like phaser fire was done on video, right?

This means they will have to recut each episode again using modern techniques and they'll have to recreate these kind of F/X which will allow them to correct the error you mentioned.
We've gone through great pains to tell people the FX done on video (like the phaser) will all be redone....

RAMA
Hmm I suppose that is something, but the fact is the majority of the FX is the original model work.
Maybe they'll re-add the phaser beams (In Yesterday's Enterprise, for example they're quite dull and hard to make out and the charging "pulse" before the phaser fire (my favourite thing about the TNG phasers actually, thought it was a shame Voyager's FX teams gave up on it over the course of that series) almost impossible to see without freeze framing) but the Enterprise itself will still be sitting there like a lemon in most battle scenes, especially after "evasive manuevers" is called out by the captain!"

I see what you're all saying and I don't want to turn this into a knock down, drag out mud slinging debate, I'm happy you're all happy with what has been announced, but when we've been going through this thread wondering how certain scenes or FX shots will look after they've been improved by a full CG remake then the actual announcement led to me being a little dissapointment and I'm surprised I'm in the minority in that regard.

There won't be as much new stuff in this project as I expected and for that I'm disappointed. Sorry if that annoys some people but it's just how I feel.
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