A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

[137th Gebirg]

backstept wrote:

---

if TMZ is to be believed, Kit Harrington and Rose Leslie are apparently dating

Interesting. That certainly made for quite believable interactions with them last season and good chemistry. Did this start before, during or after filming, I wonder?

[backstept]

I have no idea . . . the article I read was on Buzzfeed and it's basically some photos from a restaurant where they appear to be quite friendly with each other. Speculation mostly.

[Kosh Naranek]

Okay - Cersei is a trainwreck.

She has now allowed the Faith to create basically their own order of knights and men-at-arms. That is is horrible idea! Now there are going to be bands of armed men that have no loyality to the crown.

She may have saved a few bucks, but I can see this coming back to bite her in the rear. She is bringing down her own house brick by brick.

[Ayelbourne]

Kosh Naranek wrote:

---

She is bringing down her own house brick by brick.

That's the beauty of her story in book four.

[Anwar]

And when the truth about her children comes out (and it more or less is out and could be investigated by the Faith) there will be bands of Knights with no loyalty to the Crown out to kill "abominations"! She really didn't think it out...

[Shurik]

Ayelbourne wrote:

---

That's the beauty of her story in book four.

It's my favorite part of AFFC.

I loved her extremely convoluted plan to get rid of all her "enemies", including Maragery, and how it unsurprisingly blew up in her face and got her imprisoned by the same religious nuts she gave power to.

[Lonemagpie]

Cersei's problem is that she thinks she's a genius because she managed to outwit the one man in the kingdom who was dumber than she is...

[teacake]

I wish he'd written more chapters in Cersei's voice. Those were brilliant.

[Dream]

Lonemagpie wrote:

---

Cersei's problem is that she thinks she's a genius because she managed to outwit the one man in the kingdom who was dumber than she is...

Poor Ned...

[Anwar]

It wasn't even Cersei who outwitted Ned, so she can't even take credit for that. Heck, it was more just luck that things worked out so well in her favor.

[Venardhi]

137th Gebirg wrote:

---

Speaking of questionable parentage, what about that bizarre scene between Jaime and his Aunt Genna before he went to talk to Blackfish at Riverrun?

Unless I missed the subtext going on, it seemed to me that she implied that Tyrion was the only true son of Tywin, not Jaime; further implying that maybe Jaime (and, by birth, Cersei as well) are not Tywin's offspring. Is her statement supposed to be more of a metaphor, in that Jaime is nothing like Tywin as a person (good or bad), or does she hold some secret about their origins? That one really confused me and there has been no mention of it since.

There is quite a bit of subtext suggesting that Aerys had his way with Joanna at least once.

[Kosh Naranek]

I was not sure about the whole Aunt G conversation. Her words did seem pregnant with subtext. On the face of it, I took it this way - Tyrion is Tywin's true son because of all of Tywin's spawn, only Tyrion has the old man's smarts and cunning.

At this point in the books, I don't recall any mention of Aerys being obsessed with Joanna. However, that may be in a chapter that I have yet to read, and subsequent POVs may change my mind.

I have a couple of questions:
1. When Jamie has that musician play for Edmure, Edmure seems horrified. Am I to assume it was the same musiciain that played out in the hall outside Edmure's bedroom as Cat and Robb were slaughtered?
2. In Jamie's POV - he thinks that Tyrion betrayed Cat too? How is that so? I don't recall Tyrion being complicit in any betrayl. By the time Jamie and Brienne made it to King's Landing to bring about her plan, Tyrion was already imprisoned and powerless. - Is Jamie thinking of Tyrion marrying Sansa and trapping her in a marriage she did not want? But to be fair to Tyrion, he was the only one protecting her and even Sansa acknowledged that he had saved her from Joff several times.

To again crow about Cersei's stupidity, how can she think the crown defaulting on their debts is a good thing? Not only is war and possible impending famine going to wreck the land, she is going to dry up liquid currency as well.

For some reason, I can see Tommen giving his royal mother Hell over Margaery. Perhaps I am wrong but that kid seems mega attached to his wife.

[Lonemagpie]

Anwar wrote:

---

It wasn't even Cersei who outwitted Ned, so she can't even take credit for that. Heck, it was more just luck that things worked out so well in her favor.

Yeah, but she doesn't see it that way...

[137th Gebirg]

Cersei, like all the Lannister brood, seems to have serious daddy issues. Her driving force during all her plotting and scheming was accompanied by "wouldn't father be proud?", or "I handled that problem just as well if not better than father would have" or other similarly paraphrased notions. Instead of making good decisions for herself and Tommen, she seems to be more motivated by surpassing Tywin's greatness, perceived or otherwise.

And even throughout ADwD, Tyrion is still haunted by Tywin's ghost and the unknown fate of Tysha - "Where do whores go?"

It seems to me that Jaime was the first to truly break the chains of his dead father's will and start to write his own personal destiny.

[Kosh Naranek]

Well, I am glad the Dorne business is finally going somewhere...maybe.

Dorne started out with a splash. I really liked Oberyn. However, as the story actually in Dorne progressed, the ripples of my interest began to calm and finally it was a flat lake of boredom. However, at least I now know that Doran was up to something all along, but he appears to be surrounded by idiots.

I assume now that Dorne intends to ally itself with the last Targeryn?

I also found this...