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Old June 5 2014, 10:29 PM   #2431
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Relayer1 wrote: View Post
He has already said he's told the showrunners how it all finishes. He has it all plotted and planned (if roughly) and if he wasn't able to complete the story, someone else will be able to finish the novels from these notes / comlpeted chapters, like the Wheel of Time series.
GRRM has already said that won't happen; either he will finish the series, or no one will.
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Old June 5 2014, 10:33 PM   #2432
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

CaptainCanada wrote: View Post
Relayer1 wrote: View Post
He has already said he's told the showrunners how it all finishes. He has it all plotted and planned (if roughly) and if he wasn't able to complete the story, someone else will be able to finish the novels from these notes / comlpeted chapters, like the Wheel of Time series.
GRRM has already said that won't happen; either he will finish the series, or no one will.
If he dies it won't be up to him. There's a new 'Stieg Larsson' novel coming out next year.

The discussions with Martin's estate would go something like this :

‘You are aware George contractually owed us another book ? We also feel we owe it to the fans to conclude the story. We will hand pick a suitable author, editorially supervise putting together the work from George's completed chapters, drafts, outlines and information given to the TV shows writing staff. It will be sensitively handled and respect George's vision.

And there will be a, say, $15,000,000 advance...'
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Last edited by Relayer1; June 5 2014 at 10:43 PM.
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Old June 6 2014, 01:19 AM   #2433
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Brolan wrote: View Post
So much for the cut away theory. It couldn't have been more brutal than that.
There was the fingers in the eye socket scene, but there was a cut away before the actual head crushing. Yes, pretty brutal though.

The reports have said that GRRM has provided a broad summary of how his story ends. I think the books will have more than enough surprises in them. There is always the possibility that GRRM changes his mind or plans to continue the story beyond what he has told the writers.
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Old June 6 2014, 04:00 AM   #2434
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

theenglish wrote: View Post
Brolan wrote: View Post
So much for the cut away theory. It couldn't have been more brutal than that.
There was the fingers in the eye socket scene, but there was a cut away before the actual head crushing. Yes, pretty brutal though.

The reports have said that GRRM has provided a broad summary of how his story ends. I think the books will have more than enough surprises in them. There is always the possibility that GRRM changes his mind or plans to continue the story beyond what he has told the writers.
Yup, it looks like we will get one ending in the show and then another in the books with different details. I guess we all get to pick the one we like best.
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Old June 6 2014, 04:05 PM   #2435
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Allyn Gibson wrote: View Post
Eight novels (or more)?

Martin's American publisher suggests it could happen, and his UK publisher thinks there are too many balls in the air for Martin to juggle them down by the end of seven books.

Are they floating a trial balloon to see what the reaction might be?
I love how a silly off-hand remark by his publisher ("I told him that 7 books goes with 7 kingdoms, but there are actually 8...") gets blown out of proportion and treated as if she's actually announced that there are going to be 8 books.

Scout101 wrote: View Post
Would have thought that the popularity of the show would have lit a fire under his ass to write a little faster so he could cash in, but thanks for the reminder that we're coming up on the 3rd anniversary of the last book, without any hint that the next one is even close enough to tease...
So, you're disappointed that he's not doing a rushed cash-grab job instead of taking the time to properly write his life work?

Honestly hope it kinda blows up on him. Show spoils his ending, people get less excited to buy his last couple books that end up releasing 5 years after the show goes off the air and just rehashes what they've already seen anyway, etc.
Yes, because sales of popular books tend to go down after a lot of people have seen a very popular film or TV adaptation.
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Old June 6 2014, 05:01 PM   #2436
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Scout101 wrote: View Post
Would have thought that the popularity of the show would have lit a fire under his ass to write a little faster so he could cash in, but thanks for the reminder that we're coming up on the 3rd anniversary of the last book, without any hint that the next one is even close enough to tease...

Honestly hope it kinda blows up on him. Show spoils his ending, people get less excited to buy his last couple books that end up releasing 5 years after the show goes off the air and just rehashes what they've already seen anyway, etc.
The man wrote a series of books, that you've greatly enjoyed for very little money, and because he's not writing fast enough you want him to suffer? Holy shit dude. Entitled much?
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Old June 6 2014, 08:34 PM   #2437
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Maybe I'm naive but I really don't think old George cares too much about the money at this stage anyway. It would probably be more profitable to bang out a book every year or two than the way he's doing it.
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Old June 6 2014, 11:25 PM   #2438
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

GRRM himself has said this about the "will there we more than 7 books issue":
http://insidetv.ew.com/2014/06/03/ge...me-of-thrones/
“My plan is to finish in seven,” Martin says. “But my original plan was to finish in three. I write the stories and they grow. I deal with certain things and sometimes I find myself not at the end of a story. My plan right now is still seven. But first I have to finish Book Six. Get back to me when I’m half-way through Book Seven and then maybe I’ll tell you something more meaningful.”


Martin has been consistent on this subject, giving basically the same answer when we asked if he was “firmly committed” to seven books back in 2011 (“I’m as firm as I am,” Martin said, “until I decide not to be firm”).
He's also said:

That said, given the amount of story remaining in his 4000-page saga — much of which hasn’t yet been published — Martin suspects the producers’ plan of making seven seasons will not be enough. “I don’t think it will be enough to tell the story we’re telling in the books,” he says.
Which is also what I've been thinking even without knowing the future storylines - there's a shitload of things to be resolved in those remaining books, so 7 seasons could end up being very rushed.
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Old June 7 2014, 02:53 AM   #2439
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

DevilEyes wrote: View Post
GRRM himself has said this about the "will there we more than 7 books issue":
http://insidetv.ew.com/2014/06/03/ge...me-of-thrones/
“My plan is to finish in seven,” Martin says. “But my original plan was to finish in three. I write the stories and they grow. I deal with certain things and sometimes I find myself not at the end of a story. My plan right now is still seven. But first I have to finish Book Six. Get back to me when I’m half-way through Book Seven and then maybe I’ll tell you something more meaningful.”


Martin has been consistent on this subject, giving basically the same answer when we asked if he was “firmly committed” to seven books back in 2011 (“I’m as firm as I am,” Martin said, “until I decide not to be firm”).
He's also said:

That said, given the amount of story remaining in his 4000-page saga — much of which hasn’t yet been published — Martin suspects the producers’ plan of making seven seasons will not be enough. “I don’t think it will be enough to tell the story we’re telling in the books,” he says.
Which is also what I've been thinking even without knowing the future storylines - there's a shitload of things to be resolved in those remaining books, so 7 seasons could end up being very rushed.
I was the guy that was arguing of few pages back that the series would be at least ten seasons. Now that I see how much of books four and five are being incorporated into the current season I believe that I stand corrected. The only way to complete the series now in seven or eight seasons is for the television series to take its own path (guided by GRRM's broad outline) and the books to continue the way the author writes them.

To paraphrase what Martin has said previously, fans need to realize that this story is not a "choose your own adventure".
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Old June 7 2014, 02:15 PM   #2440
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

theenglish wrote: View Post
DevilEyes wrote: View Post
GRRM himself has said this about the "will there we more than 7 books issue":
http://insidetv.ew.com/2014/06/03/ge...me-of-thrones/
“My plan is to finish in seven,” Martin says. “But my original plan was to finish in three. I write the stories and they grow. I deal with certain things and sometimes I find myself not at the end of a story. My plan right now is still seven. But first I have to finish Book Six. Get back to me when I’m half-way through Book Seven and then maybe I’ll tell you something more meaningful.”


Martin has been consistent on this subject, giving basically the same answer when we asked if he was “firmly committed” to seven books back in 2011 (“I’m as firm as I am,” Martin said, “until I decide not to be firm”).
He's also said:

That said, given the amount of story remaining in his 4000-page saga — much of which hasn’t yet been published — Martin suspects the producers’ plan of making seven seasons will not be enough. “I don’t think it will be enough to tell the story we’re telling in the books,” he says.
Which is also what I've been thinking even without knowing the future storylines - there's a shitload of things to be resolved in those remaining books, so 7 seasons could end up being very rushed.
I was the guy that was arguing of few pages back that the series would be at least ten seasons. Now that I see how much of books four and five are being incorporated into the current season I believe that I stand corrected. The only way to complete the series now in seven or eight seasons is for the television series to take its own path (guided by GRRM's broad outline) and the books to continue the way the author writes them.

To paraphrase what Martin has said previously, fans need to realize that this story is not a "choose your own adventure".
I always thought that books 4 and 5 would be covered by season 5 (especially as some of it is being covered this season, this way they make up 1.5 seasons, roughly) because there's no way to make two seasons out of them; one extended season, yes, but not two seasons. It's not that there's no material, it's that there are lots of characters, locations and storylines, but none of them individually have enough material for two seasons - not even Jon, because the arcs would feel weird and suffer if they were split into two seasons.

I also think they will include some TWOW stuff next season for some of the characters; the battle of Meereen, certainly; battle of Winterfell, perhaps; Sansa will have to have some TWOW stuff - especially considering that they've sped up her storyline (and even without it, I already thought she'd have to have some TWOW stuff, since her AFFC chapters are thin on actual events, though rich in internal monologue), I wouldn't be surprised if they add something from TWOW for Arya, and I don't know what they'll do with Bran: probably some TWOW stuff, and maybe they can use him again for weirnet visions to finally get a bit more of the backstory into the show? The only storyline from AFFC I see possibly moved to TWOW is Oldtown, because it could be too many locations and new characters for one season, and it's just set up in AFFC anyway. So Sam may not get to meet the maesters, "Alleras" and "Pate" until season 6 premiere.

Still, I don't think that two more seasons will be enough to wrap up everything, even without hearing the reports of how long the next two books are supposed to be - there's just too much stuff to be resolved. I think eight seasons would be a more realistic and better goal than seven, unless they make extended seasons as The Sopranos, Oz (which practically did two seasons in one year with a break and called them season 4) or some other shows, but they've said it doesn't fit their shooting schedule.
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Old June 8 2014, 07:57 PM   #2441
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

I keep wondering if or how Jon Snow will learn who his real mother/parents are. Through out the book they make it a point that Ned would never tell anyone, but did he confess it to someone? Who's would Ned trust enough to do that? If he didn't tell anyone, how else could we find out who they are. Could Bran use his Green sight to find out? Will there be a magical explanation. Will he never find out...
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Old June 8 2014, 08:08 PM   #2442
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Tom Hendricks wrote: View Post
I keep wondering if or how Jon Snow will learn who his real mother/parents are. Through out the book they make it a point that Ned would never tell anyone, but did he confess it to someone? Who's would Ned trust enough to do that? If he didn't tell anyone, how else could we find out who they are. Could Bran use his Green sight to find out? Will there be a magical explanation. Will he never find out...
Lord Howland Reed knows.
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Old June 9 2014, 01:54 AM   #2443
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
Tom Hendricks wrote: View Post
I keep wondering if or how Jon Snow will learn who his real mother/parents are. Through out the book they make it a point that Ned would never tell anyone, but did he confess it to someone? Who's would Ned trust enough to do that? If he didn't tell anyone, how else could we find out who they are. Could Bran use his Green sight to find out? Will there be a magical explanation. Will he never find out...
Lord Howland Reed knows.
Maybe. If so, maybe he told his kids.

How that information gets to Jon is anyones guess.
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Old June 9 2014, 10:14 AM   #2444
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Although they're minor characters, both Pyp and Grenn die during the Battle of Castle Black even though their book counterparts are still alive. Not too surprising considering they haven't really done much since A Storm of Swords. Still, I'm sorry to see them go.
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Old June 9 2014, 02:45 PM   #2445
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones Spoiler-Filled Discussion

Well, Grenn sort of makes sense since he served as a replacement for Donal Noye. And since Noye isn't in the show, I guess they still wanted SOMEONE we knew to die at the gate. But yeah, sucks they killed Pyp as well. Though as you said, they didn't really do much going forward (hell, I had to look at the AFFC appendix to double check that they DID survive the battle )
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