Ending the Dominion war sooner

G2309 · March 7 2011, 07:34 PM

In WYLB when Odo heal the female changling I wondered how many lives could be savd if they tried it sooner.
I don't mean just sending them a cure but doing it in exchange for diarmemant.
It put the Federation in a very strong position. Losing a war or the extinction of your race? Not much of a choice.

Dancing Doctor · March 7 2011, 07:42 PM

The Federation Council debated whether or not to give the Dominion the cure to the morphogenic virus, but decided against it as they felt it would give the Dominion "the upper hand" in the war.

It'd be like the Allies finding out that all of the senior Nazi leadership has AIDS or syphilis, and, despite having developed a cure, decided not to hand it over.

pimp · March 7 2011, 11:32 PM

Well from a strategic point of view it is correct in not sending a cure to the dominion and save the founders simply because there is no trust therefore in their position the federation had every right to keep it away from them simply because there is a potential to give strength to the dominion and possible outcome might not be peace. Thats how I would see it from their point of view.

Also when Odo linked with the female changeling did he not give some kind of clarity to her when they linked, like he convinced her it was the right thing to do (this is just my thoughts and not sure if true) or did he simply just cure her and she realized it had to end for the sake of her people?? (which is sort of the same)

Rom's Sehlat · March 9 2011, 05:31 PM

My understanding of the linking with the female changeling was that there was more to their conversation. It's supposed to be beyond the average viewer's understanding. Remember how Odo said, "Trust me" to Kira and Garak? For all we know, he could have made all sorts of promises about the negotiations or something. He could have let her win at tic-tac-toe. Or shown her the Federation's amiability to their enemies when hostilities are over. Or told her the reason the Gamma quadrant wasn't coming to their aid was because very powerful beings (that some people considered gods) were blocking them. Who knows?

Perhaps he had convinced her that the Feds were more fanatical in defending themselves than the Jem'Hadar were in attacking them. Well, that wouldn't have bothered her. She wasn't here to assimilate them, just take over anything left standing afterward.

G2309 · March 11 2011, 05:23 PM

Dancing Doctor wrote:

The Federation Council debated whether or not to give the Dominion the cure to the morphogenic virus, but decided against it as they felt it would give the Dominion "the upper hand" in the war.

It'd be like the Allies finding out that all of the senior Nazi leadership has AIDS or syphilis, and, despite having developed a cure, decided not to hand it over.

I remember all this.I didn't mean just giving them the cure. But exchanging it after they disarmed their foces.

Dancing Doctor · March 11 2011, 05:30 PM

G2309 wrote:

Dancing Doctor wrote:

The Federation Council debated whether or not to give the Dominion the cure to the morphogenic virus, but decided against it as they felt it would give the Dominion "the upper hand" in the war.

It'd be like the Allies finding out that all of the senior Nazi leadership has AIDS or syphilis, and, despite having developed a cure, decided not to hand it over.

I remember all this.I didn't mean just giving them the cure. But exchanging it after they disarmed their foces.

It might have. However, remember that the real deciding factor was that Odo would be coming back to the Link. That was what swayed the Female Changeling. Getting cured was just an added benefit.

TeutonicNights · March 11 2011, 06:34 PM

So the Federation council officially refused to end a genocide that their own citizens have committed?

Imo the DS9 writers went too far here/screwed up.

Dancing Doctor · March 11 2011, 07:02 PM

I don't think the Council knew about or were given the origins of the virus, though.

All they knew was that there was a virus, and that Bashir had a cure.

TeutonicNights · March 11 2011, 07:45 PM

Alright. Still, the thought of the Federation Parliament saying Genocide is alright as long it suits them and even tho they got the cure right there is somewhat ridiculous.

Knowing about the cure, but not telling anyone is one thing (and already problematic for the Feds I'd guess), but the freakin council officially making such decisions in front of everyone?

Dancing Doctor · March 11 2011, 07:56 PM

The Founders were out to completely dominate and rule the Alpha Quadrant and/or wipe out those who wouldn't submit.

Why should you feel inclined to help your enemy in such circumstances?

Rom's Sehlat · March 11 2011, 10:14 PM

The Founders were smart enough to design whole species with genetic engineering but they can't develop a cure for a virus?

G2309 · March 15 2011, 06:37 PM

TeutonicNights wrote:

So the Federation council officially refused to end a genocide that their own citizens have committed?

Imo the DS9 writers went too far here/screwed up.

TNG did the same. With Picard being criticised for not taking a chance to commit genocide against the Borg in "I Borg"

C.E. Evans · March 15 2011, 07:02 PM

War is ugly business. They often aren't won by doing nice things, IMO, so sometimes you're damned if you do and damned if you don't...

MikeS · March 17 2011, 12:28 PM

You're all anthropomorphising the situation. Nobody talks about genocide when refering to antibiotic usage. The survival of our species and the species we work together with was/is at stake - threatened by another form of life that wants to destroy us.

Tulaberry whine · March 19 2011, 01:51 AM

TeutonicNights wrote:

So the Federation council officially refused to end a genocide that their own citizens have committed?

Imo the DS9 writers went too far here/screwed up.

It's one thing for DS9 and Trek to be a positive, idealised vision of the future but to complain about this is to want a fantasy.

No government in the same position as the Federation council - no matter how idealised - would have handed over that cure.

March 7 2011, 07:34 PM	#1
G2309 Captain	Ending the Dominion war sooner In WYLB when Odo heal the female changling I wondered how many lives could be savd if they tried it sooner. I don't mean just sending them a cure but doing it in exchange for diarmemant. It put the Federation in a very strong position. Losing a war or the extinction of your race? Not much of a choice. __________________ I've got blog with some scifi reviews and humour if you want to check it out http://wondersandparodies.blogspot.com/

March 7 2011, 07:42 PM	#2
Dancing Doctor Admiral Location: At the Militant Janeway True Path Devotees Compound	Re: Ending the Dominion war sooner The Federation Council debated whether or not to give the Dominion the cure to the morphogenic virus, but decided against it as they felt it would give the Dominion "the upper hand" in the war. It'd be like the Allies finding out that all of the senior Nazi leadership has AIDS or syphilis, and, despite having developed a cure, decided not to hand it over. __________________ ‎"Captain, we are being hailed. That is, if you don't mind...if it isn't too intrusive." Loyal member of the Militant Janeway True Path Devotees

March 7 2011, 11:32 PM	#3
pimp Commander Location: United Kingdom, London	Re: Ending the Dominion war sooner Well from a strategic point of view it is correct in not sending a cure to the dominion and save the founders simply because there is no trust therefore in their position the federation had every right to keep it away from them simply because there is a potential to give strength to the dominion and possible outcome might not be peace. Thats how I would see it from their point of view. Also when Odo linked with the female changeling did he not give some kind of clarity to her when they linked, like he convinced her it was the right thing to do (this is just my thoughts and not sure if true) or did he simply just cure her and she realized it had to end for the sake of her people?? (which is sort of the same) __________________ No one here is exactly what he seems - G'Kar

March 9 2011, 05:31 PM	#4
Rom's Sehlat Fleet Captain	Re: Ending the Dominion war sooner My understanding of the linking with the female changeling was that there was more to their conversation. It's supposed to be beyond the average viewer's understanding. Remember how Odo said, "Trust me" to Kira and Garak? For all we know, he could have made all sorts of promises about the negotiations or something. He could have let her win at tic-tac-toe. Or shown her the Federation's amiability to their enemies when hostilities are over. Or told her the reason the Gamma quadrant wasn't coming to their aid was because very powerful beings (that some people considered gods) were blocking them. Who knows? Perhaps he had convinced her that the Feds were more fanatical in defending themselves than the Jem'Hadar were in attacking them. Well, that wouldn't have bothered her. She wasn't here to assimilate them, just take over anything left standing afterward.

March 11 2011, 06:34 PM	#7
TeutonicNights Commander Location: Non-isotropic cosmos	Re: Ending the Dominion war sooner So the Federation council officially refused to end a genocide that their own citizens have committed? Imo the DS9 writers went too far here/screwed up.

STAR TREK

CSI

ABOUT US

March 11 2011, 07:02 PM	#8
Dancing Doctor Admiral Location: At the Militant Janeway True Path Devotees Compound	Re: Ending the Dominion war sooner I don't think the Council knew about or were given the origins of the virus, though. All they knew was that there was a virus, and that Bashir had a cure. __________________ ‎"Captain, we are being hailed. That is, if you don't mind...if it isn't too intrusive." Loyal member of the Militant Janeway True Path Devotees

March 11 2011, 07:45 PM	#9
TeutonicNights Commander Location: Non-isotropic cosmos	Re: Ending the Dominion war sooner Alright. Still, the thought of the Federation Parliament saying Genocide is alright as long it suits them and even tho they got the cure right there is somewhat ridiculous. Knowing about the cure, but not telling anyone is one thing (and already problematic for the Feds I'd guess), but the freakin council officially making such decisions in front of everyone?

March 11 2011, 07:56 PM	#10
Dancing Doctor Admiral Location: At the Militant Janeway True Path Devotees Compound	Re: Ending the Dominion war sooner The Founders were out to completely dominate and rule the Alpha Quadrant and/or wipe out those who wouldn't submit. Why should you feel inclined to help your enemy in such circumstances? __________________ ‎"Captain, we are being hailed. That is, if you don't mind...if it isn't too intrusive." Loyal member of the Militant Janeway True Path Devotees

March 11 2011, 10:14 PM	#11
Rom's Sehlat Fleet Captain	Re: Ending the Dominion war sooner The Founders were smart enough to design whole species with genetic engineering but they can't develop a cure for a virus?

March 15 2011, 07:02 PM	#13
C.E. Evans Vice Admiral Location: Saint Louis (aka Defiance)	Re: Ending the Dominion war sooner War is ugly business. They often aren't won by doing nice things, IMO, so sometimes you're damned if you do and damned if you don't... __________________ "Shout, shout, let it all out..."

March 17 2011, 12:28 PM	#14
MikeS Fleet Captain Location: Liverpool, UK	Re: Ending the Dominion war sooner You're all anthropomorphising the situation. Nobody talks about genocide when refering to antibiotic usage. The survival of our species and the species we work together with was/is at stake - threatened by another form of life that wants to destroy us. __________________ One day soon, man is going to be able to harness incredible energies, energies that could ultimately hurl us to other worlds in... some sort of spaceship.