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Old September 4 2011, 03:47 PM   #2956
Admiral James Kirk
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

Besides if he really is a SUPER man then his junk should protrude in an impressive manner. What's so super about a guy with no willy?
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Old September 4 2011, 03:56 PM   #2957
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

JoeZhang wrote: View Post
I will say that the "junk" needs to be tucked away more if possible.
Again, what's wrong with genitals? Superman has genitals, you have genitals, I have genitals. None of us have 'junk' - unless we are deformed in some way.
Ok, his meat stick and two potato then.

Admiral James Kirk wrote: View Post
Besides if he really is a SUPER man then his junk should protrude in an impressive manner. What's so super about a guy with no willy?
He's not trying to get laid at a night club though and he's not using it to lift cars over his head.
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Old September 4 2011, 03:59 PM   #2958
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

JoeZhang wrote: View Post
I will say that the "junk" needs to be tucked away more if possible.
Again, what's wrong with genitals? Superman has genitals, you have genitals, I have genitals. None of us have 'junk' - unless we are deformed in some way.
Does Superman have a dick as we know it? Only Lois Lane and Lana Lang can say for sure.

It might be like the alien crotch-organ Jack Hawksmoor has that makes regular ladies throw up and even the Engineer sort of silently question her life choices.
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Old September 4 2011, 04:14 PM   #2959
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

Saul wrote: View Post
He's not trying to get laid at a night club though and he's not using it to lift cars over his head.
I don't think we know enough about the movie's plot to be able to say such things with certainty
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Old September 4 2011, 04:21 PM   #2960
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

He's Superman, not Supereunuch. And I'm guessing young Clark took showers after phys ed in school, like all the other boys. No-one noticed that he had an 'S' shaped appendage down there, presumably.
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Old September 4 2011, 04:52 PM   #2961
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

SalvorHardin wrote: View Post
Saul wrote: View Post
He's not trying to get laid at a night club though and he's not using it to lift cars over his head.
I don't think we know enough about the movie's plot to be able to say such things with certainty
One wonders what the refractory period is for a super-powered Kryptonian. Maybe Alanah Rae knows.


JoeZhang wrote: View Post
I will say that the "junk" needs to be tucked away more if possible.
Again, what's wrong with genitals? Superman has genitals, you have genitals, I have genitals. None of us have 'junk' - unless we are deformed in some way.
If someone doesn't want to call attention to every aspect of their physique the appropriate answer is not to wear a skin-hugging outfit to begin with.

The only explanation for wearing these kinds of outfits that makes real psychological sense is Farmer's; ie, that it's a sexual fetish for these guys. Since no one associated with these properties will ever go there, we're stuck with a variety of less plausible, highly arguable rationales.
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Old September 4 2011, 05:11 PM   #2962
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

I liked Watchmen.
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Old September 4 2011, 05:29 PM   #2963
Admiral Buzzkill
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

Okay, almost nobody will go there.

I liked the bit in Watchmen where one of the Minutemen was reminiscing about their early adventures in a letter to another, and wrote something like "remember the guy we kept interfering with until we realized that he wasn't really trying to get away with his crimes but just enjoyed being beaten up by men in costumes?"
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Old September 4 2011, 05:34 PM   #2964
Kai "the spy"
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

Dennis wrote: View Post
Kai "the spy" wrote: View Post
The thing about the muted colors is, I guess, to make him more subtle, less standing out. But if he wear supposed to be subtle, he wouldn't wear a costume at all, would he? He'd just wear street clothes, like Clark did in the first eight seasons of SV (and all the characters on that other show by Tim Kring).

Why doesn't he wear street clothes, why the costume? Because he has to stand out. He wants people to trust him, which is why he doesn't wear a mask, and people in a dangerous situation have to immediately recognize him as Superman, the one who can save them. He has to stand out, and that's why muted colors just don't work for him, in my humble opinion.

That's not strong logic, much less an persuasive argument.

First, it's an assumption rather than fact that the intent here is to make him stand out less in a crowd. In that get-up, especially with the huge red cape, there's no place that he's not going to stand out just fine. Secondly, anyone who makes his entrance by flying in through the window has everyone's attention, I can guarantee you that.

If the rationale were that he has to stand out to the maximum degree possible - well, he'd stand out even better if the costume were day-glo and phosphorescent at night. It's not, and the only reason this version seems less eye-catching than the old comic book one is by comparison with what's familiar.

Aside from the fact that the rationale that "he's wearing the outfit to stand out' doesn't make that much sense, it's not a given that this is the reason for it. If that explanation has been offered at some point in the comics -well, so have alternative explanations in different eras. One of the earlier ones was simply that Supes needed an indestructible outfit, and the only material that fit the bill were the red, yellow and blue blankets from his Kryptonian rocket. He was therefore stuck with the garish costume scheme. Apparently the current explanation is that the design of the tights, armor or what-have-you is itself Kryptonian.

All such explanations are reasoning backward from the fact that the character was established as dressing this way for no particular reason. If you were used to seeing him dress in black and silver you'd have accepted the offered explanations for that as given and would be startled by the introduction of bright colors in a movie.
As for "is it's purpose really to stand out": Of course, it is. If it wasn't supposed to stand out, he'd wear something else. Even if it's about the material being indestructable, he could've made something more associated with day-to-day life out of it than tights and a cape.

Even from the creator's perspective, there is no essential reason for giving him such a costume other than for him to stand out. In 1938, there was nothing like Superman. He wasn't the usual comics hero, who back then were detectives, soldiers, pilots, cowboys and stuff. He was something else entirely, so to get that across right away, he had to wear something that stood apart from detectives, soldiers, pilots and cowboys.

And the colors helped at that. Red and blue are primary colors, and there's a reason why primary colors are on almost any nation's flag: They stand out. They are easily recognizable. They are immediately associated with something which they are supposed to stand for.

And, now that I think about it, there is one more thing Superman's costume is supposed to do which also applies to flags. They are supposed to inspire. And muting these colors isn't inspiring at all. See for yourself.

Bright:


Muted:


Muted colors look grim, not inspiring. At least, I think so. And I like my Superman to be inspiring. Sure, he can be made to inspire through his actions in the new movie, but that won't be underlined by his costume. As far as I see it, the new movie's costume hampers Superman's purpose to inspire, and that's a big minus.

Even so, I'm still looking forward to this movie.
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Old September 4 2011, 05:39 PM   #2965
davejames
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

Dennis wrote: View Post

First, it's an assumption rather than fact that the intent here is to make him stand out less in a crowd. In that get-up, especially with the huge red cape, there's no place that he's not going to stand out just fine. Secondly, anyone who makes his entrance by flying in through the window has everyone's attention, I can guarantee you that.
Agreed. The idea that this guy isn't going to stand out in a crowd or serve as a source of inspiration, just because the blue is a little more muted than usual, just seems ridiculous to me.

Besides, this is Zack Snyder we're talking about. There's no way this Superman isn't going to look bold and dynamic as hell on screen. That's the one aspect I'm NOT too concerned about with this movie.
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Old September 4 2011, 05:41 PM   #2966
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

Dennis wrote: View Post
Okay, almost nobody will go there.

I liked the bit in Watchmen where one of the Minutemen was reminiscing about their early adventures in a letter to another, and wrote something like "remember the guy we kept interfering with until we realized that he wasn't really trying to get away with his crimes but just enjoyed being beaten up by men in costumes?"
"Whatever happened to him?"
"Well, he tried on Rorschach, and Rorschach dropped him down an elevator shaft."
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Old September 4 2011, 05:50 PM   #2967
Admiral Buzzkill
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

Kai "the spy" wrote: View Post
As for "is it's purpose really to stand out": Of course, it is. If it wasn't supposed to stand out, he'd wear something else.

This is a conclusion you've come to - possibly based on an explanation provided at some point somewhere in the history of the comic - but simply because the logic of it satisfies you doesn't make it so. It's not a fact, not even within the fictional continuity, which anyone has to accept as a premise and reason from.

It doesn't convince me one bit, for the reasons I explained before, and therefore doesn't matter.

Superman dresses in the costume that he does because the kids who created him wanted him to dress that way. There's no other real reason for it. The most likely explanation is simply that they were presenting him in four-color comic format, aiming the stories at youngsters, and wanted to take full advantage of the available palette.

Any "in-story" rationale was constructed later. One is as good as another. The most plausible - even in its silliness, it makes the most sense - is that his costume had to be of Kryptonian origin for him to not wind up flouting his junk, as Joe Zhang puts it, every time he blocks an explosion with his body or something.

But that's just what makes the most sense to me. I buy it more than "he wants to stand out (okay, I don't buy that one at all)." You prefer the "look at me!" explanation. That's fine. Jumping from "this is what I prefer to believe" to "what the filmmakers are doing doesn't make sense/is wrong because they're not taking into account the character's reason for dressing that way" is a non-starter.
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Old September 4 2011, 05:51 PM   #2968
JoeZhang
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

I should have been a bit clearer - I was wondering why people are using the word junk rather than genitals.

Dennis's wider point however is bang on the money - he's a big lad and isn't shy.
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Old September 4 2011, 05:58 PM   #2969
davejames
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

Kai "the spy" wrote: View Post
Muted colors look grim, not inspiring. At least, I think so. And I like my Superman to be inspiring. Sure, he can be made to inspire through his actions in the new movie, but that won't be underlined by his costume. As far as I see it, the new movie's costume hampers Superman's purpose to inspire, and that's a big minus.
Spider-Man came across as a pretty damn inspiring character in the Raimi movies, and that blue was much darker than this-- and much darker than it often appeared in the comics as well. In fact Spidey's costume has probably gone through as many different shades of blue over the years as Superman's has.

The idea that people can ONLY be inspired by a superhero costume where every color is as bold and intense as can be just... makes no sense to me.

Raimi understood, as Snyder does, that having the same intensity of colors next to each other would just look too loud and garish in live action. One or the other has to be toned down a bit.
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Old September 4 2011, 06:00 PM   #2970
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Re: Superman (casting, rumors, pix till release)

JoeZhang wrote: View Post
I should have been a bit clearer - I was wondering why people are using the word junk rather than genitals.
Jesus Christ, does it matter?
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