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Old January 3 2011, 07:46 PM   #16
davejames
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

Only seen the first movie (which wasn't nearly as bad as people say), but it seemed to me it was simply a matter of love at first sight. And the fact he couldn't read her mind was intriguing too.

And the werewolf guy was friends with her since childhood, so he clearly still had a bit of a crush.

As for Stewart, I think she's cute enough. And a lot more believable as a real teenage girl than a Megan Fox or one of those Gossip Girls. I'll never understood this online attitude where any girl who's not a smokin hot supermodel must now suddenly be dismissed as "ugly". What the hell is that about?
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Old January 3 2011, 08:02 PM   #17
Myasishchev
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

At a guess, a preemptive strike.
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Old January 3 2011, 11:34 PM   #18
melancholymecha
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

if I were Bella Id be more interested in Carslile...
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Old January 4 2011, 05:25 AM   #19
Temis the Vorta
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

I wonder greatly if the assertion that Kristen Stewart isn't pretty Goddamn eye-pleasing is some kind of ridiculous Internet standards thing,
She's not Amanda Seyfried or Mila Kunis, and that's why she got the role. She's supposed to appeal to girls, not guys. She needs to be the wish-fulfillment stand-in, so she should be accessible: pretty but not obnoxiously so.

I suppose guys might see her as being exactly as attractive as Amanda Seyfried or Mila Kunis, no more or no less, but that's beside the point. It really doesn't matter what guys think of her. Those movies are not for guys.
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Old January 4 2011, 06:45 PM   #20
Greg Cox
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

[QUOTE=Temis the Red-Nosed Vorta;4634548]
IIt really doesn't matter what guys think of her. Those movies are not for guys.
Nailed it again.
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Old January 4 2011, 07:36 PM   #21
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

Temis the Red-Nosed Vorta wrote: View Post
I wonder greatly if the assertion that Kristen Stewart isn't pretty Goddamn eye-pleasing is some kind of ridiculous Internet standards thing,
She's not Amanda Seyfried or Mila Kunis, and that's why she got the role. She's supposed to appeal to girls, not guys. She needs to be the wish-fulfillment stand-in, so she should be accessible: pretty but not obnoxiously so.

I suppose guys might see her as being exactly as attractive as Amanda Seyfried or Mila Kunis, no more or no less, but that's beside the point. It really doesn't matter what guys think of her. Those movies are not for guys.
I think it's mainly her attitude. She can be very beguiling when she wants to be (cf Adventureland), but that's not what the role ever calls for. Put her in a male-geek genre movie and she'd do just fine.
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Old January 4 2011, 07:46 PM   #22
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

Again, I think Kristen Stewart is cute enough certainly no aspects about her that I find unattractive in fact I even think she's not too bad an actress. I just don't think the character of Bella is all-that attractive mostly because she's got less substance on her or in her than an empty white envelope.

I can deal with her stammering way of speaking, her shyness and even that she's "klutzy." But it's that she's a lemming with that "Mirror Syndrome" a patient on House a few seasons back had. (That caused the POTW to emulate the mannerisms and speech of the person in the room he perceived to be "in charge.")

She latches on to Edward like a puppy dog to a master, a master who craves her blood and has to restrain himself from slaughtering her, oh, and he's a stalker. She also the most emo person ever. Edward breaks up with her and she goes into fits of night-terrors and dramatic stages of catatonia for several months.

Bella should be in the psychiatric ward of her local hospital with a team of doctors working around the clock trying to figure out what her deal is.

Stewart is beautiful and a good actress.

Bella is some black-lipstick and a fishnet shirt away from becoming the gothiest person ever and she'd probably be an outcast with them too.
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Old January 4 2011, 08:32 PM   #23
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

Now to be fair, Twilight functions on a very old idea of what romantic love is. When the concept of romantic love first came to be in the West it was around 1150. Prior to that there was lust and there was love of your fellow man, but there was no such thing as romantic love. It was invented by the troubadours and it was a very specific concept. Romantic love had to be:

1) Adulterous - since marriage was an institution that was about the alliances of family, affection had nothing to do with it and the idea of a husband and wife sharing love was ridiculous since chances were neither one of them had any choice in who was chosen to their partner
2) Wildly and deeply painful since one was forever restricted from the object of one's love who was married to someone else and adultery was a mortal sin

In the famous romance Tristan and Isolde, Tristan is delivering Isolde to his uncle Mark, King of Ireland, for an arranged marriage when, on the journey, the two young people accidentally drink a love potion that Isolde's mother had sent along for Isolde and King Mark to drink. They fall instantly and deeply in love and Isolde's maid says to Tristan, "You have drunk your death." To which he replies:

"I do not know what you mean. If you mean the pain of my love for Isolde - tht is my life. If you mean the punishment from society that I shall receive for loving her, I accept that. If you mean eternal damnation in hell - I accept that too."

Feeling deep pain was a sign of the depth of one's love. If you didn't have it in the gut so that it doubled you over with longing - it wasn't love. This notion survives in most great romance stories of our culture to this day. Something separates the lovers and they suffer unbearable pain until they can reunite.

Now, granted, Twilight is a shallowly written bit of flotsam that has all the quality of a 12 year old girl's fan fic - but Bella's suffering harkens back to the oldest idea of what romantic love is.
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Old January 4 2011, 10:05 PM   #24
Artemis
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

Lapis Exilis wrote: View Post
Now, granted, Twilight is a shallowly written bit of flotsam that has all the quality of a 12 year old girl's fan fic - but Bella's suffering harkens back to the oldest idea of what romantic love is.
Have to agree.

I watched once a nice little vid which explains what is the secret of bella's popularity among girls.

It states that she is an empty shell into which we girls can easily pour our own personalities with little difficulty.

Okay, she's shy. I can be shy. She's clumsy. Here here. She is self-consciouss. Hell yeah. It just goes on.

Now, as for Edward and Jacob....erm...they're just desperate.
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Old January 4 2011, 10:19 PM   #25
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

As long as, in the final book, Edward and Jacob hook up with each other and wander off together, I'm happy.
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Old January 4 2011, 10:20 PM   #26
Artemis
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

That would be a perfect ending, yes.
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Old January 4 2011, 10:30 PM   #27
davejames
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

Artemis wrote: View Post
Lapis Exilis wrote: View Post
Now, granted, Twilight is a shallowly written bit of flotsam that has all the quality of a 12 year old girl's fan fic - but Bella's suffering harkens back to the oldest idea of what romantic love is.
Have to agree.

I watched once a nice little vid which explains what is the secret of bella's popularity among girls.

It states that she is an empty shell into which we girls can easily pour our own personalities with little difficulty.

Okay, she's shy. I can be shy. She's clumsy. Here here. She is self-consciouss. Hell yeah. It just goes on.

Now, as for Edward and Jacob....erm...they're just desperate.
And also to be fair, teenagers DO tend to become wildly and irrationally obsessive about relationships at that age. I just see the Twilight series as representing that time of life when the hormones are going crazy and everything that happens to you feels like the Most Important Thing Ever.

Yeah the writing could obviously be better, but I don't know anyone trying to claim that these are "works of art" to begin with.
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Old January 4 2011, 10:38 PM   #28
Artemis
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

I've heard people claim them to be works of art just because of the way love and edward as the most perfect guy ever are described.
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Old January 4 2011, 10:56 PM   #29
Greg Cox
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

davejames wrote: View Post
And also to be fair, teenagers DO tend to become wildly and irrationally obsessive about relationships at that age. I just see the Twilight series as representing that time of life when the hormones are going crazy and everything that happens to you feels like the Most Important Thing Ever.

.

And, of course, that sort of obsessive longing is basically encoded into the DNA of gothic fiction anyway. Look at Barnabas Collins or the Mummy or the Phantom of the Opera or the Hunchback of Notre Dame, all pining for their lost loves for all eternity, etc. And Poe and the Brontes, etc.

Mix Gothic melodrama with adolescent angst and hormones, and you've practically got a perfect storm of over-the-top emotion . . . . .
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Old January 4 2011, 11:06 PM   #30
Gaith
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Re: TWILIGHT -- What Do the Vampire Guy and the Werewolf Guy See in Be

DonIago wrote: View Post
As long as, in the final book, Edward and Jacob hook up with each other and wander off together, I'm happy.
Jacob deserves better!
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