RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 139,580
Posts: 5,403,263
Members: 24,865
Currently online: 487
Newest member: shyrim

TrekToday headlines

October-November 2014 Trek Conventions And Appearances
By: T'Bonz on Sep 30

Cho Selfie TV Alert
By: T'Bonz on Sep 30

TPTB To Shatner: Shhh!
By: T'Bonz on Sep 30

Mystery Mini Vinyl Figure Display Box
By: T'Bonz on Sep 29

The Red Shirt Diaries Episode Five
By: T'Bonz on Sep 29

Shatner In Trek 3? Well Maybe
By: T'Bonz on Sep 28

Retro Review: Shadows and Symbols
By: Michelle on Sep 27

Meyer: Revitalizing Star Trek
By: T'Bonz on Sep 26

Trek Costumes To Be Auctioned
By: T'Bonz on Sep 25

Hulu Snaps up Abrams-Produced Drama
By: T'Bonz on Sep 25


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek TV Series > Star Trek - Original Series

Star Trek - Original Series The one that started it all...

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old December 31 2010, 05:47 PM   #16
Sisko_is_my_captain
Captain
 
Sisko_is_my_captain's Avatar
 
Location: Jericho, KS
Re: Spock with red makeup

Tosk wrote: View Post
Red Spock would have been weird, no question. But then, if he'd always been red, we wouldn't even question it.


But think of all the fake tan jokes trekkies would have had to endure for the last 40 years. Imagine the people dressing up at conventions.

http://uamodels.net/wp-content/uploa...orange3_fn.jpg
__________________
"Wait a minute...you mean to tell me that you made a time machine...out of a mining vessel?"

"Don't blame me - I voted for Kodos the Executioner."
Sisko_is_my_captain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 31 2010, 07:28 PM   #17
JRoss
Captain
 
JRoss's Avatar
 
Location: Stain'd-by-the-Sea
Re: Spock with red makeup

Actually, the color of the makeup used on Nimoy during the actual show was called, somewhat offensively, "Chinese Yellow."
JRoss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 31 2010, 07:37 PM   #18
Geoff Peterson
Fleet Admiral
 
Geoff Peterson's Avatar
 
Location: 20 feet from an outlet
Re: Spock with red makeup

I thought it was special blend made just for Spock.
__________________
Nerys Myk
Geoff Peterson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 31 2010, 07:54 PM   #19
Tosk
Rear Admiral
 
Tosk's Avatar
 
Location: On the run.
Re: Spock with red makeup

Sisko_is_my_captain wrote: View Post
But think of all the fake tan jokes trekkies would have had to endure for the last 40 years.
Nah, it'd just be one more "Trek inspired real life invention!" item for the list that people love to trot out.
Tosk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 31 2010, 08:00 PM   #20
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: Spock with red makeup

No North Pole Penquins wrote: View Post
I thought it was special blend made just for Spock.
Yeah, this seems to be one of a variety of things Star Trek 365 gets wrong (like saying the Doomsday Machine was a wind sock dipped in cement, when close examination suggests it to be a roughly hollowed wooden cone wrapped in some kind of cellophane or foil). Perhaps the "Chinese Yellow" color was a base of the formula devised for Spock, but it was a novel variant with greenish hues mixed in; it's used to this day as the base color for Vulcan makeup and is called "LN-1," after Nimoy's initials.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 31 2010, 08:04 PM   #21
Crewman47
Commodore
 
Location: Ayrshire, Scotland
Re: Spock with red makeup

Sisko_is_my_captain wrote: View Post
Tosk wrote: View Post
Red Spock would have been weird, no question. But then, if he'd always been red, we wouldn't even question it.


But think of all the fake tan jokes trekkies would have had to endure for the last 40 years. Imagine the people dressing up at conventions.

http://uamodels.net/wp-content/uploa...orange3_fn.jpg
A red tint like this might have worked on screen from the beginning but it does depend on how red he was going to initially be.

Crewman47 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 31 2010, 10:47 PM   #22
GSchnitzer
Co-Executive Producer
 
GSchnitzer's Avatar
 
Location: Gaithersburg, Maryland, USA, Terra
Send a message via AIM to GSchnitzer Send a message via Windows Live Messenger to GSchnitzer Send a message via Yahoo to GSchnitzer
Re: Spock with red makeup

No North Pole Penquins wrote: View Post
I thought it was special blend made just for Spock.
(Crossposted from the Star Trek Phase II Forum)

So, what color is Mister Spock?

Well, we know he has "green" copper-based blood. And we know that very early on, it was contemplated that the character might be a Martian with a reddish hue--just like the reddish sands that cover that planet. However, actual make-up tests revealed that reddish make-up doesn't look "alien;" it simply looks like bad make-up--especially for those with black and white televisions. So it was decided to make him a Vulcanian and go for a greenish, ochre, goldenish color, like--well, not quite like anything except maybe chicken soup. It's actually not an extreme difference from regular human color; it's fairly subtle.



Early on, the color would have to be mixed by hand using the available make-up colors--notably using Max Factor's "Chinese Yellow" pigment. But it would be a pain to custom mix this Vulcanian color each and every day if the show actually became a series; it would need to be mixed exactly the same, consistently, for continuity purposes. Of course, Star Trek did become a series and for this custom-colored make up, Star Trek make-up artist Fred Phillips went to The Research Council of Make-up Artists, Inc. (RCMA). This company could (and still does) make custom colors--and then they keep the formulas (something like paint color formulas) on file so they can be produced again later. The RCMA helped to develop all kinds of odd colors—including the strange color for Eddie Munster on The Munsters.

For us at Star Trek Phase II, it can be difficult (just as it was for Fred Phillips) to use "regular" make-up to try and recreate an appropriate Vulcan color and apply it all evenly to the actor--whether it's Phase II's Jeff Quinn, Ben Tolpin, or Brandon Stacy. Fortunately, the original RCMA 1965 color "LN-1" ("Leonard Nimoy #1") for Mister Spock's odd Vulcan coloration is still available--if you know what to search for and you have the money. Here's a shot of my left hand made up (a little too heavily, I think) with some RCMA "LN-1" that I acquired recently--and my right hand its normal pinkish self as a contrast. It's funny: I've seen my photo on a variety of computer monitors now and it never looks the same. Sometimes it appears really washed out and other times it appears super saturated. (I have no idea how it will render on *your* screen.)



And here's a shot of the little LN-1 make-up jars:


Interestingly, just as Kirk's shirt photographs not quite as green as it is in real life, this LN-1 make-up also doesn’t photograph quite as green as it looks to my naked eye.

There's no real commentary here--except to say that recreating the look of 1960s Star Trek for our fan-based series requires a greater eye to detail than most people probably imagine--right down to using the proper make-up pigments.

(For those of you in L.A., I got my LN-1 make-up from Sig Frends Beauty Supply in North Hollywood on Laurel Canyon right at Magnolia. I don't know if they have any left.)
__________________
Greg Schnitzer
Co-Executive Producer
Star Trek Phase II
http://www.startrekphase2.com
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3348883/
GSchnitzer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 1 2011, 12:33 AM   #23
starfox
Lieutenant Commander
 
Re: Spock with red makeup

It always bugged me that Spock sometimes had rosy cheeks, yet was supposed to have green blood.
starfox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 1 2011, 01:50 AM   #24
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: Spock with red makeup

^Not to mention having red lips and tongue.

It always bugged me that Spock wore eye shadow. What was up with that? I suppose the idea was to make his eyes look more hooded, but to me it just looks like makeup.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 1 2011, 02:02 AM   #25
Red Ranger
Admiral
 
Red Ranger's Avatar
 
Location: New York City, the greatest city in the world!
Re: Spock with red makeup

Interesting. As I recall, they initially used more of a golden tint for Spock's makeup in the second pilot, Where No Man Has Gone Before, before switching to the more greenish tint in the rest of the series. I also recall Rodenberry in his initial notes on Spock referring to him as half-Martian. Maybe that's where the original conception of his skin as red-tinted came from, a hint that he was from the Red Planet. So glad that changed, too!

They did succeed with red makeup in The Apple, of course. Wonder what the children of Vaal would have looked like on a B&W TV?
__________________
"I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell!"

"I would make this war as severe as possible, and show no symptoms of tiring till the South begs for mercy." -- William Tecumseh Sherman
Red Ranger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 1 2011, 02:54 AM   #26
Admiral Buzzkill
Fleet Admiral
 
Re: Spock with red makeup

cmdr_forst wrote: View Post
Star Trek 365 does indeed say "jet black."
So the question then is - according to who? Is any of the authors of Star Trek 365 someone who'd have been a first-hand observer at the time, or is this a twice-told tale?
Admiral Buzzkill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 1 2011, 04:31 AM   #27
Tosk
Rear Admiral
 
Tosk's Avatar
 
Location: On the run.
Re: Spock with red makeup

Christopher wrote: View Post
^Not to mention having red lips and tongue.

It always bugged me that Spock wore eye shadow. What was up with that? I suppose the idea was to make his eyes look more hooded, but to me it just looks like makeup.
Yeah but didn't McCoy and Sulu also have eye shadow on a lot of the time too?
Tosk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 1 2011, 04:32 AM   #28
Christopher
Writer
 
Christopher's Avatar
 
Re: Spock with red makeup

Dennis wrote: View Post
cmdr_forst wrote: View Post
Star Trek 365 does indeed say "jet black."
So the question then is - according to who? Is any of the authors of Star Trek 365 someone who'd have been a first-hand observer at the time, or is this a twice-told tale?
I already answered that above. D. C. Fontana said "escapee from a minstrel show" in her introduction, Paula Block & Terry Erdmann said "jet-black" in the body of the text.
__________________
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Site update 4/8/14 including annotations for Rise of the Federation: Tower of Babel

Written Worlds -- My blog
Christopher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 1 2011, 05:22 AM   #29
Itisnotlogical
Commodore
 
Itisnotlogical's Avatar
 
Location: Shufflin', shufflin', shufflin'...
Re: Spock with red makeup

If I didn't know that Spock was supposed to be an alien character, I would never have guessed that his skin tone was makeup. It looks very natural.
__________________
"Good grief. You guys sure know how to make something out of nothing. And then take sides about whether or not it's nothing, and then change your minds and discuss why you thought it was something." - Kestra
Itisnotlogical is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 1 2011, 07:15 AM   #30
Therin of Andor
Admiral
 
Therin of Andor's Avatar
 
Location: New Therin Park, Andor (via Australia)
View Therin of Andor's Twitter Profile
Re: Spock with red makeup

JRoss wrote: View Post
Actually, the color of the makeup used on Nimoy during the actual show was called, somewhat offensively, "Chinese Yellow."
Fred Phillips had a pancake makeup specialist mix up a combination of Flesh and Chinese Yellow, creating a new sallow shade, which they called "LN-1" ("Leonard Nimoy 1"), which has been used on many of the actors playing Vulcans in "Star Trek" over the decades.

When ST:TMP came out, I know some people who shouted at Spock, "He's not green!", misremembering that it was his blood that was green, not his skin tone.
__________________
Thiptho lapth! Ian (Entire post is personal opinion)
The Andor Files @ http://andorfiles.blogspot.com/
http://therinofandor.blogspot.com/
Therin of Andor is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:47 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.