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Trek Literature "...Good words. That's where ideas begin."

View Poll Results: Rate Rough Beasts Of Empire
Outstanding 36 25.53%
Above Average 58 41.13%
Average 25 17.73%
Below Average 13 9.22%
Poor 9 6.38%
Voters: 141. You may not vote on this poll

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Old January 15 2011, 08:50 PM   #181
jhempel24
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

Cool, thanks alot! Things could get real interesting in future books!
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Old January 15 2011, 09:35 PM   #182
David R. George III
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

jhempel24 wrote: View Post

Sooooo......question I guess.

shanejayell wrote: View Post

Not quite.

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Old January 15 2011, 10:22 PM   #183
jhempel24
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

And the intrigue goes on! Thanks for answering my question!
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Old January 16 2011, 11:39 AM   #184
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

In 'Serpent among the ruins', the romulans were outsmarted by the Federation, through Harriman;
In 'In the pale moonlight', they are outintrigued by Sisko/Garak;
In 'Inter arma enim silent leges' the romulans are again outsmarted, this time by S31;
And now, the tzenkethi murder a praetor and a senator with impunity, fully bending the romulan political process to their will.

The romulans, characterised by their penchant for intrigue/backstabbing, being outsmarted by everyone and his idiot cousin is turning into a recurring joke.
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Old January 16 2011, 07:39 PM   #185
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

Harriman outsmarted someone? This I've gotta read.
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Old January 16 2011, 07:57 PM   #186
Rush Limborg
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

^In the books, they make it a point to "redeem" him from his admittedly embarrasing stint in Generations. I believe Peter David started the trend, in his excellent The Captain's Daughter.

(PAD's book actually has Harriman ranting to his personal log about how much he's been beating himself up about what had happened in the film....)
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Old January 16 2011, 08:09 PM   #187
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

Serpents Among The Ruins does an absolutely amazing job of giving the reader a Harriman a couple decades removed from Generations that seems like the same guy, but an incredible leader and devastatingly effective officer after so much experience. It's a great book.
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Old January 17 2011, 12:58 AM   #188
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

^It certainly is.


Now...the mention of Serpents Among The Ruins brings up a point. Returning to a previous topic:

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Old January 17 2011, 01:52 AM   #189
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

I don't think they'll change sides, necessarily, but I think she';ll be open to diplomacy with the Federation.

Heh! Last time I checked Admiral Harriman was still around, maybe they can meet?
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Old January 17 2011, 03:14 AM   #190
Rush Limborg
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

At the very least,


By the way...


As Sun Tzu said:

The superior militarist strikes while schemes are being laid.

The next best is to attack alliances.
And:

Draw them in with the prospect of gain, take them with confusion.

When they are fulfilled, be prepared against them; when they are strong, avoid them.

Use anger to throw them into disarray.

Use humility to make them haughty.

Tire them by flight.

Cause division among them.
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Old January 17 2011, 06:50 AM   #191
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

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Old January 17 2011, 09:10 AM   #192
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

I finished the book and enjoyed it. Thanks David.
About the Prophecy. Many of the posters in this thread have commented on the various interpretations of the prophecy. One interpretation I haven't seen (or if I have I failed to parse it out) is that Sisko's marriage is not the actual cause of the sorrow, but instead leads to it.
Take option one. Sisko spends his life with Kassidy and "knows nothing but sorrow".
Option two, he does not and isn't miserable.
In option one he would be doing certain things in certain places simply because that was the life he was leading. In option two he would be in other places and doing other things. Simple change of circumstances could account for the difference in happiness levels. No causal relationship to his marriage is required.
Maybe if he hadn't gotten married then he would have done different things when returned from the Celestial Temple. Maybe he would have been in a position to save Vaughn, maybe he would have spent extra time with his dad and been there to save him rather than his not being found until the morning, etc...
Looking at the timelines from the outside the Prophets could have seen these differences and warned Sisko. If this is the case then leaving Kassidy would change the circumstances of his life and possibly avert further tragedy.
Of course, as has been pointed out previously, making decisions based on prophecy is fraught with danger. Interpretation is the key.
I could be wrong, but I seem to recall a paragraph in the book where Sisko is trying to describe (to himself or someone else, I can't recall) just what it was like in the Celestial Temple and how he became convinced that the Prophets were correct in their warning. He just couldn't make sense of what he had seen there.
In any case I have to disagree with those who think that Sisko came off as a "deadbeat dad". He KNOWS the Prophets experience the future. And he BELIEVES in the prophecies they produce. Whether you agree with his decision or not, whether you think he is wrong in his belief, it is entirely in the character that was developed over the course of the series.
Yes, Sisko is a family man. But he is also the Emissary of the Prophets. Even if they are not talking to him any more he believes in them and I would think the this particular prophecy had been eating away at him for some time. Any losses he suffered would be credited to it whether he really wanted to do so or not.
So that part of the story makes sense. Even if it is kind of depressing. I look forward to more development of Sisko in the future.
I also enjoyed the rest of the book. I especially like the Tzenkethi. Very cool
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Old January 17 2011, 09:25 AM   #193
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

Voted Excellent, thought the book was overall great.

I loved seeing more of the Romulans; having not read Rihannsu or the first two Titan books, I wasn't as familiar with some of the stuff but was glad to see them and spend some time with our favorite Star Empire.








So, overall, thanks for a really good book, Dave! And you should really check out Doctor Who.

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First: Things couldn't stay as they were. To put it bluntly, happy endings are boring, and Sisko got one: home, with his family, retired. I have no interest in a Sisko that's just off to the side, occasionally dropping in to throw some prophecy our way. Yes, of course there are possibilities in domestic tension or something like that. But, just like Janeway as an admiral made the character difficult to shoehorn into ongoing stories, Sisko as a retiree would do the same. And for my money, if he's around, I want him to be going somewhere.
I think things could definitely have stayed as they were - happy endings are boring only inasmuch as they're endings, but maintaining happiness shouldn't have to be. I was hoping they'd go the Friday Night Lights route with Sisko and Kasidy - show a healthy, happy couple that really do love each other and are doing their best to raise a child, but showing the real challenges and problems that can bring about. There's really good genuine drama there, especially for a religious icon. Intermix it with general Bajoran stuff, and yeah, make him just an occasional guest character.

But now we have this, and I'm looking forward to seeing how Ben (and Kasidy, I'm sure we're not done with her) deal with this unexpected change in their lives.
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Old January 20 2011, 12:40 PM   #194
trash80
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

Finished the book last night (my first e-book too!), a good read indeed. Feel there are many things in this book that will feed into future stories which i am looking forward to.
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Old January 20 2011, 06:41 PM   #195
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Re: Typhon Pact: Rough Beasts Of Empire review thread

^ Glad to hear that you enjoyed it.
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